VTA adjustment - check yours for amazing results!

[kstaskiewicz]

A guy from work gave me a Grado F-1+ cart in perfect condition, in box etc. This is supposed to be the equivalent of today's Grado Silver - the metal part of the cart and the lettering on the front are actually gold in color, but it's OK. I like it gold - it matches the golden accents on my TT. Plus Grado Gold is actually some small percentage of Grado Silvers... Confusing.

Anyway, I fitted the cart with the NOS Grado Silver stylus I have and was again disappointed. The cart/stylus combo seemed to be so much more "sibilant" than my Ortofon Super OM-10 and the tracking sucked (playing Telarc's 1812 overture would make it bounce all over those cannon shots...)

So I looked at it up close and I realized that the arm was set way to high for it. After couple of hours of squinting through a maginfying glass and playing with little allen screws at the base of the tonearm I finally got the VTA right.

What a difference!
The cartridge sounds rich and full. No more tracking problems, not even the most difficult passages... no more sibilance... I like it a lot - more than the Ortofon. The funny part is I didn't even think that VTA will have impact on all of this... I thought it was one of these things invented by tweakers to give themselves infinite amounts of things to do in the process of never being satisfied with the sound they get.
But this is for real. And it makes a phenomenal difference.
So much so, that I believe many carts are given sucky reviews, because they're just not set-up right.
Kris

 

[Wardsweb]

The better your cart, the more important this is. The stylus gets smaller and the setup more important.

 

[ron-c]

Which is why 'on the fly' arm height adjustment is so important like on the SL1200 Technics. I have other much more expensive arms and tables but they do not have this feature. If you play the thick vinyl you can set the table for them and use additional mats as a shim for normal records.

Thanks,
Ron-C

 

[Sansui Louie]

As a clarification for noobs, VTA is Vertical Tracking Angle, which translates to "Arm Height".

The tonearm should, when playing a record, be level from front to back. If it's not, your turntable should have an adjusting screw to loosen, so that the arm can be raised or lowered until it IS level.

Many cartridges are about of the same height when mounted, so this adjustment may not be necessary. But other times it is, case in point is when I went from a Grado Black to an AT 440 ML...BIG difference, I had to lower the arm significantly.

There are other adjustments that are necessary as well, like overhang (how far forward or backwards the cartridge 'sits in the saddle' on the headshell) and cartridge alignment, which, if you think of the needle as a rudder and the record as water, means that the boat is going straight.

 

[OvenMaster]

I'm the guy who bought an OM10 Super and found my Dual's arm tilted back so far the rear end of the cart was dragging. Five paper shims at the front of the cart gave my OM10 the 3° forward tilt it needed to ride level. Immediate treble improvement:thmbsp:!
When a cart's adjusted truly properly, you'll be shocked at how great even modestly-priced gear can sound. :yes:
Tom

 

[Kegger]

I don't mean this as any disrespect for anyone but why would anybody not feel that
having there cartridge sit right and enter the groove properly not make a big difference?

I mean the needle makes sound by riding in a groove and vibrating to whats there, how
could it ever sound right if it wans't in the groove right?

Is it me or does it just make sense that it has to be right to sound right?

 

[Wardsweb]

Kegger for many people who have not heard a table setup correctly, they do not know they are missing anything. They don't know the treble could be crisper and the bass could be deeper. Most any cart you throw on will produce sound, but if not setup correctly, the odds of it being the best possible are slim to none.

 

[macaltec]

Ok guys. All of this technical talk of alignments and adjustements has got me wanting to start tweaking my DUAL 1229 and Sansui SR 929. Any websites I can get the protractors from? How do I know if the overhang issue is correct? The VTA seems easy enough. What about a site for: TT set up for Dummies? I've had TT's for years but never got into these areas before. Thanks.

mac

 

[Charivari]

Hey, Mac, check out the Vinyl Engine. You should be able to find answers to your questions over there. The site even has some good protractors here.

- JP

 

[hifi_nut]

Kegger,
The best anology I can come up to try and explain how VTA affects reproduction is this:

Take an A4 sized picture of your favourite actress, put it down on a table top close to the edge. Now bend your knees and lower yourself untill your eyes are almost level with the table top and the picture. You´ll be able to see the picture from quite an horizontal angle, but you´ll recognize your favourite actress in some of her beauty, and still make out some of the features that attract you to her.
Now stand up and look again. You´ll be seing the pic from a straight angle ( remember you´ll be staring down at her from a vertical standpoint ) and you´ll be seing her in her full glory, all the curves, details and nuances much better focused and defined.

It will still be only an image of her, like a recording is only an image of an event which took place somewhere else before, but depending on the angle you take a look at it you get different and more or less precise perceptions of it.
Jorge

 

[Kegger]

Wardsweb I agree with what your saying that they don't know what they are missing
but just thinking out loud and a little needle is riding in a groove to make noise that
common sense would tell me it should be riding in there a certain way to do what it
is suppose to do properly.

You are definately right, throw it on there and it works but wouldn't you think if it's on
there just right to track the groove correctly it would sound better.

Like I said I don't mean to offend but to me it just sounds like common sense. If I have
offended someone it was not my intention but mearly trying to say that if you look at the
situation you should be able to understand why it's important and would make a difference.

 

[hifi_nut]

Ok guys. All of this technical talk of alignments and adjustements has got me wanting to start tweaking my DUAL 1229 and Sansui SR 929. Any websites I can get the protractors from? How do I know if the overhang issue is correct? The VTA seems easy enough. What about a site for: TT set up for Dummies? I've had TT's for years but never got into these areas before. Thanks.

mac

Hi Mac,

JP ( Charivari ) has pointed you to THE place for vinyl learning.
Just to tell you that the issue of overhang is quite simply specified by each arm´s manufacturer, and there is a new, and excellent by the way, searchable database for tonearms at The Vinyl Engine.
Jorge

 

[OvenMaster]

Kegger, my old OM20 was only aligned using the Dual-supplied jig, plus it was tilted to the left if you looked at it head on. I had no clue it was wrong. I thought it was "good enough", and I have been involved with stereo since 1973. It wasn't until I came here to AK that I redid everything to near-perfection and now I'm regretting over 30 years of ignorance. Common sense? Sure... to those who know. But if someone doesn't know, they'll muddle along for decades and think that's all there is. I was one of them.
Tom

 

[Kegger]

I see what you guy's are saying, my post was more of a reinforcement as to the
validity of it, my bad!

 

[kstaskiewicz]

Well, actually I think this particular adjustment -VTA- is somewhat advanced in nature. First of all you have to have a turntable with the tonearm adjustment to be able to change it relatively easily, or else you have to resort to shims or different thickness mats, or some combination of the above.
But if you are actually aware of such advanced techniques, chances are you already have a better turntable anyway...
Don't forget - most of the TTs that are commonly available at a thrift store near you are of the "set tonarm hight" variety...

What I meant to say in my initial post is that as much (or as little) as I knew abot the mechnics behind the turntable and the way the stylus rides the groove I thought the VTA wouldn't have that much of an impact on the signal reproduction. I do realize we are talking about groove modulations that equal tenths or hundreds of a thickness of a hair... or even less...
But if the cartridge is loose on the headshell or it is tilted, or misalligned horizontally or the tracking force is too low then obviously this will all translate in the stylus riding the groove improperly and the musical content being distorted in one way or the other.
Just like a car with the bent frame, one overinflated and one flat tire, misaligned steering will never drive properly.
But if it's jacked up in the back and lowered in the front, all other things set correctly you won't have trouble keeping it right on track will you? Pretty rough comparison, I know but that's what I thought.

Even if the tonearm hight is incorrect the strereo imaging should still be correct, the lateral tracking would be OK - hence no channel distorion, there should be no timing or sibilance issues - it should sound more or less OK.
Incorrect VTA is is not a fundamental error, or so I thought...

And to find out that it can be in fact a very fundamental one came as a revealing surprise to me. Because, to be quie honest, it was the first time ever where I heard an actual audible difference between the VTA set right as opposed to having it set wrong...
I suspect it was the first cart I ever used that allowed me to hear it very clearly.

In any case - and to make a very long story short- I've learned a valuable lesson and I couldn't have possibly done it were I not exposed to the highly contageus influence of this group of excellent people commonly known as Audiokarma.org
Thank You!

 

[Kegger]

Kstaskiewicz this is a good thing that you have found out and I didn't mean to
deminish your findings or the fact of you posting this good information and my
comments only dwelling on 1 fact of your post and that was people who knew
about VTA but did not think it was all that critical.

By all means people who don't know about it should.

 

[danj]

When it comes to VTA errors, Grados are known to be among the most sensitive of all brands. With good equipment one can easily hear the difference.

That very sensitivity also makes them fairly easy to get right as errors are readily audible. I always do my best to make sure my carts are properly aligned in all planes. Maybe that's why I've never witnessed the so-called "Grado Dance."

But I have never had a Grado that would track the cannon shots of the Telarc 1812. That's not a criticism as most carts won't track it. See past threads on this subject, most of which rapidly became a with lots of name calling and :nono:

 

[packrat]

I think VTA is often overlooked because it doesn't really make much difference with a spherical stylus, the kind usually supplied with cheap TTs that don't allow arm height to be adjusted. BUT, even a cheap stylus needs to be aligned horizontally and have proper null points. This is not an 'easy' thing for many people to do. The P-mount cartridge was introduced because when installed in fixed arm height cheapy TTs it always achieved correct alignment and was thus a user friendly way to get mediocre results. result: cartridge alignment and VTA becomes forgotten by the masses, CDs sound better than LPs......and playing vinyl becomes seen as some tweaky audiophile thing to do ...

VTA becomes more important as you get into ellyptical stylus, then then very important with any line contact stylus.

The angle is important because you are trying to get the stylus to match the angle with which the disk cutting tool was when cutting the original master. Match up that angle and you get lower distortion and better channel seperation. From what people report, that seems to be the case. I've only ever had ellypical stylii, but do notice better highs and fewer 'fuzzies' and 'sssssplassshesss' when VTA is set right.

Thanks for reporting the importance to your setup - yes, this is not a mystical tweaker voodoo thing, but something which exists because of the mechanics of how LPs are made. Probably more important than the type of phono cable of platter mat you use. ( One more reason the SL-1200II is a good mid-fi starter table is because the VTA is easily adjusted with that arm.)

 

[rulerboyz]

Well, actually I think this particular adjustment -VTA- is somewhat advanced in nature. First of all you have to have a turntable with the tonearm adjustment to be able to change it relatively easily, or else you have to resort to shims or different thickness mats, or some combination of the above.

What happens if once you start putting on those shims/mats you realize that you have raised the height of the record so high that the spindle is no longer high enough to go through the record hole? From what I can tell, that what it would probably take to get the correct VTA on my PE 3048.

 

[Nat]

It worth mentioning that having the arm parallel with the record is the starting point, not the end point of adjusting VTA. Little changes up or down may have a worthwhile effect. And will certainly eat up lots of free time. But hey -- the only way to do it is to listen, which is what we have these toys for anyway.