Discussion in 'British Audio' started by tyeeslayer, Sep 10, 2013.
Oops posted the badges twice.
Badges against the new material. I think this will turn out sharp!
No need to doubt the effect of replacing the capacitors for the better or the worse.
I have reported on my recapping.
This I did based on the assumption that these speakers had to have much more potential than I was hearing from them (impressive bass but muffled not clear sound in general)
for my first recap of I used somewhat high end and mid end material (cables / caps / resistors) .
The difference after recap was night and day.
Gone was the "great warm vintage 70's sound , but still I will gladly sell you this speaker set for 100 Euro" type of feeling.
The curtain truly had lifted. This way the speakers all over sudden exposed the amplifier quality while before the would put a veil on it.
However, I remained skeptic about the need for those thick internal whoofer cables, large expensive caps, replace a resistor etc..
So I moved to the following test:
As I posted earlier I had another pair of wharfedales Dovedale 3 partially completed. After finding a replacement for a defect tweeter to complete also this pair of of Dovedale 3, I went to my electronic part shop and bought generic red cross over caps.
I assumed - since the speakers sounded so bad in raw non-recapped mode- I assumed that high end caps / cables / resistors were only accountable for the extra 5 % of improved quality in sound and that the overruling fact of putting new caps whatever the brand would suffice to get the happy result comparable with the first speakers and this at a fraction of the cost.
That turned out to be wishful thinking.
After having worked one speaker, replacing only caps, I could let go the idea that the easy cheap way would give satisfying results.
While I had a decent speaker which could be sold as "recapped" maintained, serviced or whatever it would never be declared a reference or keeper like the previous pair.
The cheaply recapped speaker did not at all provide the clarity the earlier set had given after recap / rewiring.
Conclusion: Same amp, same position, same relative humidity etc...the differences in speaker degradation or rubber surround let aside, your choice whether to replace caps, wires, resistors by cheap versions or not and use expert versions instead will surely provide different results.
Discussing Dovedale 3 there for will remain a vastly subjective matter.
Choice of parts do make a difference. Old parts sound tired and muffled compared to new parts.
That these speakers have great potential if refreshed despite the doubtful not so built to last cabinet material is also true in my opinion.
I do not regret my time and money invested in the first pair and the results overshot my expectations.
In my opinion I have wasted my time recapping the cheap way , there is not a single advantage in sound repoduction to be detected apart from more forgiving on amp harshness that the cheap brand new caps will provide.
I will have to redo the work and pay for extra good parts if I want 4 Dovedale 3's with interesting sound. Why not
It would be interesting to have a crossover with external sockets to swap the parts on the fly and appreciate the difference if any.
That is a big difference on your youtube videos. I used Solens caps. I wonder what the gap in quality is between the them and janzen. I tried to look up your photos but the links do not work anymore.
Here they are finished with a new suit. They really sparkle when playing electronic music. They are a bit behind my leak 2060's in the bass dept. I believe they share the same woofer magnet and basket. Of course the Doves do have smaller cabinets. The material seems to have played a trick on the phone camera making the grill look distorted. Very strange.
I’d like to dedicate this post to my main w90 lovin homie - the legendary GANG-TWANGER! Mr. Twanger was the first AKer that really preached the gospel of the w90 in all of its glory. And what glory it is!!! I recently decided to haul my W90’s out of temporary retirement and rotate them into my living room system. Man I’m glad I did.
There is just something about these oil capped w90’s that just does it for me. I’ve played around with a bunch of “higher end” speakers both vintage and new, and there are very few that put a smile on my face as quickly as the w90’s can. Recently picked up a Pilot 232, and paired with the w90’s I am in midrange heaven! THANK YOU MR. TWANGER AND MR. BRIGGS!
I recently acquired these W70d's for $25. Cabinets are ok, need refinishing. The wiring in one is a mess, the other looks original. I'll be starting a restoration on these soon, hopefully I can bring them back!
Does anyone know the easiest or best way to pull the tweeter/midrange array from a pair of W-90's? Looking through the grill.cloth with a flashlight the surrounds look ok, but it is hard to see and be sure. The grills don't look like they were made to be removed.
If they’re like mine, then the front grills don’t come off. You need to remove the back top panel (where the tone pots are) - pull that panel off and you will see a compartment with your wires and capacitors. Inside this compartment, pull the next panel out (the one that all of the wires attach to) to gain access to the mids/tweets.
Thanks, I'll look again, but all I saw were a couple nuts recessed in a couple holes that look like they are screwed to the drivers from the front.
My pair of early Dovedale 3's I decided to save from the dump after the seller poorly packed them and finding out the rubber surrounds had turned to plastic and shatterd. I've temporarily replaced the original woofers with a set from a pair of Dovedale W2's same basket just a higher impeadance voice coil (12 ohms instead of 6) and different magnets (alnico instead of ceramic), I've swapped the magnets for now but I've got identical replacements from a pair of W60's on the way.
I've also bought some new grill cloth to replace the old torn so called "Corduroy" style cloth, some velcro to replace the nails somone used to hold the grills in and some new caps for the crossovers.
If I recall correctly, those were bextrene surrounds. Too bad they shattered. Was it in the cold?
I think that's the rubber they used, I know that it's synthetic rubber that tends to go hard and natural rubber turns into a gooey tar.
I'm guessing these poor things spent a few decades in someones shed, the finish had absorbed so much dirt it was black in places with some pretty serious scratches and dents also interestingly I found metal shavings in the crease of a diaphragm in one of the tweeters after noticing it was distorting harshly, cleaning those out without removing the diaphragm was a ordeal in itself...
They where pretty neglected and looked a lot better in the pics online, but they're on the road to receovery and getting the love they deserve. The Dovedales have always been on my bucket list of speakers.
They are very nice speakers. I had a pair and really liked them. Rock and Roll sounded excellent on them.
Yep, punchy bass that still allows you to hear the detail in bass guitars with a little brightness allowing drums, guitars, cymbals and vocals to sound a little forward and detailed. I have a pair of Triton 3's which use the same mid and tweeter only in a slimmer, smaller case with a 8" woofer and I always felt they lacked ummpth in the lower frequencies which the Dovedales make up for in full, even with the wrong woofers.
They're everything I expected and more and they'll be sticking around for a while. My Yamaha seems happy driving them but some amps may make them a little too bright.
Caps came in today, got them soldered in this morning and I've been listening all day, it always suprises me how much a difference it makes, there's definitely more mid bass and the sound is a lot smoother and clearer.
Any ideas if it would be worth replacing that resistor?
I'm starting to dig into my recently-acquired W70d's, first question is the capacitor shown in the pic. I'm assuming the silver (paper/oil?) capacitor was not original equipment? I'm obviously going to test the capacitors and see if they are still working correctly, this one has me a little intrigued...
Glued the dustcap from one of the original drivers onto one of my temporary 'hacked' speakers aswell as replaced the screws holding the mid and tweeter because the old ones where completely rounded, I also stapled some velcro in the factory places, one of the grills still had velcro on them and the velcro was red so I went with that colour. They're lookin' pretty smart now.
Guess I'm in the set!. 4 W70s, and as of last Friday, 4 W90s.ive had the 70s, and one set of 90s, awhile now. A friend called from bend Oregon, saying he thought he found a pair of W 90s, in the back room of a local stereo store.
He did, and now their here, with me. I paid 300.00 for this set, and I think 300.00 for the last set of 90s. The 70s, went for 300.00 and like 275.00, one pair of 70s were near Portland, the other in Reno. I don't mind spending the money if their in great shape, which is what I got.
The 90s came from south of Seattle, the others set obviously, Bend Oregon.
All in fantastic shape, and all sound killer. I've got a set of 90s, with a set of 70s, stacked in my kitchen area, right now that system is an ADS set up " SS".
The plan is to change out the power equipment. Run my DQ-10s with the ADS kit, and the Warfdales with the Dynaco tube system.
Should be a much better fit, the DQ-10s suck up the power.
Picked up what appears to be Early Wharfedale W60 Speakers at an estate sale today.
The model is not marked anywhere on the Speakers so maybe someone can confirm the model. They are two way speakers with a 12 inch cloth surround woofer. One woofer cone appears to be dated 12/66 and at first glance both woofers appear the same. I looked closer and noticed the woofer frames are slightly different. Both are labeled "Made in England" and one also has Wharfedale cast in to the frame. Can someone confirm what they are? Also I thought early 2 way W60 were ported
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