What are some good 2-track stereo inline head R2R decks?

[Wigwam Jones]

I'm discovering this thing called Reel to Reel :thmbsp: and along the way, I discovered that there were prerecorded tapes available for 2-track stereo, inline or staggered heads. And although 4-track stereo R2R decks will play 'em, apparently they play best on what they were intended for.

So what's a good 2-track stereo R2R with inline heads, designed for those 2-track tapes?

Thanks!

 

[boxoboom]

Never heard of them but I have heard of half track heads is that what you are talking about?

 

[Wigwam Jones]

Never heard of them but I have heard of half track heads is that what you are talking about?

I don't think so, but I could be wrong. Apparently, before 4-track stereo (2 channels in each direction, you flip the tape over to hear the other side or have an autoreversing deck), there were 2-track stereo reel to reel tape decks that used the entire 1/4 inch tape for just the two tracks - no 'other side' of the tape.

I am reading that you can play 2-track 'in line' tapes on 4-track machines, but the playback is not optimal and one channel will be slightly volume-impaired. So I was wondering what the classic way old 2-track stereo reel to reel machines might be.

If that's half-track, then yes, but it's OLD not new. Talking way back.

 

[70salesguy]

Teac A3300SX-2T

Pioneer RT-1050 (with the proper head stack)

 

[Sam Cogley]

Buy an Otari MX-5050.

 

[4343]

Buy an Otari MX-5050.

+1

Because you can select two speeds on the front panel, normally 7.5 and 15 ips, but internally you can set 3.75 and 7.5 ips. Hardly ever see half-track @ 3.75, but the Otari also has the "staggered heads" for 4 track stereo tapes, and 3.75 might be needed for those.

 

[ofajen]

I don't think so, but I could be wrong. Apparently, before 4-track stereo (2 channels in each direction, you flip the tape over to hear the other side or have an autoreversing deck), there were 2-track stereo reel to reel tape decks that used the entire 1/4 inch tape for just the two tracks - no 'other side' of the tape.

I am reading that you can play 2-track 'in line' tapes on 4-track machines, but the playback is not optimal and one channel will be slightly volume-impaired. So I was wondering what the classic way old 2-track stereo reel to reel machines might be.

If that's half-track, then yes, but it's OLD not new. Talking way back.

That would be two-track, half-track: two signals, each using half the tape (minus guard bands). (There was also a bi-directional, mono, half-track format, which played a mono track in each direction.)

The Otari MX is not a bad rec. Many of those machines will have erase, rec and play heads for 2-track half track and a 2-track, quarter-track play head for playing the 2-directional, pre-recorded tapes, too. They generally run 15/7.5 ips, which should cover most of those tapes and they can do both NAB and IEC eq. Also,as mentioned, they can be switched to play at 3 3/4 ips. A machine in good working order should run $300 or so from a local studio, though there are some who list them on eBay for way more.

Cheers,

Otto

 

[Wigwam Jones]

Thanks, guys! Suppose I was looking for an older R2R for somewhat less money, though. I'm thinking that I don't want to pay a lot for something I will only be using to play the occasional 2-track stereo 7 1/2 IPS prerecorded tape on, not for home recording or heavy-duty use. Something I could use to play the old tapes and record them to a different format. Would an older American or German desk such as the older Webcor, Telefunken, Norelco, and other such units be 2-track, or were they either mono or 4-track?

The Otari seems like a great deck now that you've pointed it out to me. Maybe if I came by a working model cheaply enough. I will definitely keep my eyes open. Thank you!

 

[dr*audio]

Actually, the Otari is probably the best deal out there for an excellent 2 track deck that is reliable, easy to service and has excellent sound. If you want to get into 2 track on the cheap, though, look for an Ampex 960. It records and plays 2 track stereo and has a moveable playback head that allows you to play 4 track stereo as well. It is totally mechanical, 1 motor. Very good sound quality and John Warmack has many parts for it. It was made by Ampex professional division for the home market. The later home machines were made by a different division and not made as well. There are other decks in this series, the 1260 and F44, but I don't know if there are 2 track versions of them.

 

[Wigwam Jones]

Good information on the Ampex, thank you! I'll keep an eye open for that one as well.

 

[KentTeffeteller]

The Ampex mentioned was made by their Consumer and Educational division. It is a single motor machine, good performing but is best for people who can repair it by themselves. Otari MX 5050 + 10 on recommendation.

 

[dr*audio]

The Ampex mentioned was made by their Consumer and Educational division. It is a single motor machine, good performing but is best for people who can repair it by themselves. Otari MX 5050 + 10 on recommendation.

John Warmack told me it was made by the Professional Division, and he used to work for Ampex.

 

[Wigwam Jones]

The Ampex mentioned was made by their Consumer and Educational division. It is a single motor machine, good performing but is best for people who can repair it by themselves. Otari MX 5050 + 10 on recommendation.

I understand. But again, budget concerns. It seems what I'm hearing is either spend around $300 or don't bother. Would that be it? Because with all due respect, I just want to play a few 2-track prerecorded tapes. Not really worth the investment unless I happen to stumble across one very cheaply.

Does no one actually know if the older stereo tape decks such as the Webcors are 2-track or 4-track, or is it just that no one is going to tell me because they really don't want me to buy one?

 

[jan_stevns]

.....Does no one actually know if the older stereo tape decks such as the Webcors are 2-track or 4-track, or is it just that no one is going to tell me because they really don't want me to buy one?

You'r asking an unanswerable question - because most vendors made several versions of their tape decks

No brand made 2trackers only , no brand made quarter trackers only.

 

[Matt Fisher]

If you're just planning to use it occasionally to play prerecorded tapes, you might look into the Tascam 22-2, the little brother of the 32-2. It doesn't take 10" reels, but no prerecorded 2-tracks that I know of (except newer ones from the Tape Project) are on 10" reels. One can be had for much less than $300. I'm not saying it will be as good as an Otari, but I have the 32-2 and I like it just fine. Perhaps others with more knowledge will have a reason to warn you off of a 22-2.

Don't limit yourself to eBay to try to find these things. Most of my good decks I got locally from Craigslist, at good prices and no shipping.

You should be warned, however, that in the long run the cost of the deck is not what you should be worried about. It is not unusual to see individual 2-track tapes go for more than $300. Generally speaking, most of the valuable tapes seem to be classical tapes from RCA and Mercury, but there are a few notable pop or jazz tapes that will also set you back a fair chunk (the top of the heap seems to be "Kind of Blue"). You can get cheaper ones, of course, but the expensive ones are the ones that really show off the format and have material you'd actually want to listen to. The sound of a good 2-track tape is fantastic and can be habit-forming.

 

[Wigwam Jones]

If you're just planning to use it occasionally to play prerecorded tapes, you might look into the Tascam 22-2, the little brother of the 32-2. It doesn't take 10" reels, but no prerecorded 2-tracks that I know of (except newer ones from the Tape Project) are on 10" reels. One can be had for much less than $300. I'm not saying it will be as good as an Otari, but I have the 32-2 and I like it just fine. Perhaps others with more knowledge will have a reason to warn you off of a 22-2.

Don't limit yourself to eBay to try to find these things. Most of my good decks I got locally from Craigslist, at good prices and no shipping.

You should be warned, however, that in the long run the cost of the deck is not what you should be worried about. It is not unusual to see individual 2-track tapes go for more than $300. Generally speaking, most of the valuable tapes seem to be classical tapes from RCA and Mercury, but there are a few notable pop or jazz tapes that will also set you back a fair chunk (the top of the heap seems to be "Kind of Blue"). You can get cheaper ones, of course, but the expensive ones are the ones that really show off the format and have material you'd actually want to listen to. The sound of a good 2-track tape is fantastic and can be habit-forming.

I hear you, but I have my eye on some that interest me and they're going unsold for $2.99 opening bids...there is frankly no way I will ever buy a tape that costs as much as you stated, even if it contains aural eargasms that would make me die and go straight to heaven on the spot. Won't happen ever, so no point in pursuing that.

I will look at the Tascam, thanks!

Still curious about the older decks though.

From what little I can glean on the net, when 2-track stereo tapes first appeared, they were available in 'staggered' and 'stacked' (or 'inline') versions. It seems that Magnacord (?) introduced 2-track stereo home machines with 'staggered' head alignment and another company (Ampex?) later introduced the more expensive-to-make 'stacked' heads.

Then, it appears that 4-track appeared on home recorders and that promptly destroyed the home market for 2-track stereo reel to reel (kind of like Men in Black complaining that they have to buy "The White Album" again)...

I see the tapes on eBay. The were clearly from the early to mid 1950s.

That tells me that there were home recorders made during that time that played 2-track stereo tapes (staggered or stacked). However, what I don't know is which ones?

All my Google searches have led me in circles. And occasionally (please excuse, no offense intended) to people who have asked similar questions and gotten the same answer - ie "I know what you're looking for but I am not going to tell you because that's not a good thing and you don't want it."

If someone knows which of these old R2R home units was able to play 2-track stereo, I would love to hear some brand/model names. Even if you're certain that it's not what I want.

I'm sure there is a wealth of knowledge on the really old home R2R units on AK. I can't find it online, and I'm pretty good at searching for this esoteric stuff. So I'm asking please if someone knows, spill it. I accept the full consequences of being warned not to buy the old crap; let it be on my head. Just post the info!

 

[KentTeffeteller]

Tascam 22-2 uses the Infamous Teac/Radio Shack OEM X-3 transport. Capstan motor is a weak DC design and belts must be changed semi annually in home use. Motor switches are also prone to problems. Both parts (if available) are $300.

 

[Wigwam Jones]

You'r asking an unanswerable question - because most vendors made several versions of their tape decks

No brand made 2trackers only , no brand made quarter trackers only.

But I'm guessing that certain models numbers were 2-track and others were 4-track. So I'm asking which were which.

It appears that at a certain point, manufacturers starting putting the label '4-track' on their units. But I have seen some that do not say '4-track' on them and yet they are (like my Akai M8). I actually didn't know my M8 was a 4-track machine until I looked in the manual; it's not on the case itself that I can find.

So if it says 4-track, I know it's not what I'm looking for, but if it says 'stereo', that doesn't mean it is 2-track; it might be and it might not be.

See how that can be frustrating? So I'm asking the brain trust for the guys who have that information stored in their noggins if they will kindly share it. What I'm getting is 'you don't want that'. OK, I know, I know, I don't want that. Tell me anyway!

 

[KentTeffeteller]

I know of no 1/2 track Stereo Webcor machines. Magnecord made some nice 1/2 Track Stereo machines. Teac and early A series based Tascams were and are very nice machines. Pioneer made one model. The Ampex mentioned is most likely a 600 series relative which would explain John Warmack's knowledgeable statement about being made by Ampex Professional Division. 602 series 2 track Stereo variants are good choices. A good under the radar choice is also the Ampex ATR 700 (Teac built it, it was the machine which birthed Tascam).

 

[BANDWIDTH]

Tascam 32/42/52 - all 2-track machines - each "upgrade" more robust (transport) and hence more expensive. 32's are more abundantly available and least coinage. 42 is a very well-made unit with ease of access to the electronics it's strong suit. The 52 is tank-like - built for constant operation and it's strong suit is the Omega tape drive which is very tape friendly. Those don't come up too often and are usually >$1000 in decent repair.