1. Time for some upgrades in server hardware and software to enhance security and take AK to the next level. Please contribute what you can to sales@audiokarma.org at PayPal.com - Thanks from the AK Team
    Dismiss Notice

When is an Ariston a Linn Sondek LP 12?

Discussion in 'British Audio' started by theophile, Nov 10, 2016.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Nat

    Nat AK Subscriber Subscriber

    Messages:
    12,725
    The Heybrook was strongly influenced by the Fairchild/AR/Thorens/Ariston/Linn/Fons approach to the challenge of designing a good sounding table, but it was quite a few years later from the controversy discussed here. A fine table in its own right, of course.
     

     

    Please register to disable this ad.

  2. cleverdick

    cleverdick Active Member

    Messages:
    203
    Location:
    Essex, UK
    .
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2018
  3. theophile

    theophile Pheasant Plucker. Subscriber

    The answer has already been discussed. Refer back to the discussion.
     
  4. Hamstall

    Hamstall Active Member

    Messages:
    165
    Just purchased LP12 00503. Currently awaiting delivery so I can compare with RD11 000082... they will of course be IDENTICAL.
     
  5. IMF_Pioneer

    IMF_Pioneer Active Member

    Messages:
    171
    Location:
    Australia
    Hi Hamstall,

    Well you picked that one up for a lot less than I thought it would go for, especially when serial # 00005 went for 1,500 Euros, or in Aussie dollars $2,325.00 which is a whopping amount. Both will be identical and you got a plinth and lid to go with it opposed to it being just a chassis unit for mounting into a cabinet.
    Good buying and best of luck with it.

    Cheers.

    PS. I was going to put images up of it as the link to the listing will eventually become defunct but I still haven't worked out how to post images up as this site only uses third party hosting and doesn't retain it's own images.
     
    Last edited: May 26, 2018
  6. IMF_Pioneer

    IMF_Pioneer Active Member

    Messages:
    171
    Location:
    Australia
    Hi Hamstall,

    If it's possible could you please put up some of the images from the eBay listing and then when you receive it maybe some more.


    Cheers.
     

     

    Please register to disable this ad.

  7. Hamstall

    Hamstall Active Member

    Messages:
    165
    I'll post up a few more pics soon. Yes, this is a honey. Plinth is unmarked, arm is a nice little Grace 707 and the Supex cartridge has a great tip on it. Just been serviced and taken in to local Linn dealer for a once over and he reckoned it had a quiet life and probably had never had a service. Belt needed replacing and the 2-core mains flex was lethal. The motor on these has no tilt adjust, so the speed isn't fine-adjustable. It was running slow. The new belt makes it run at 33.8rpm.
     

    Attached Files:

  8. Hamstall

    Hamstall Active Member

    Messages:
    165
    From the eBay listing:
     

    Attached Files:

  9. theophile

    theophile Pheasant Plucker. Subscriber

    It seems to be missing the yellow sticker.
     
  10. Hamstall

    Hamstall Active Member

    Messages:
    165
    Looking at this picture, you can see the chassis which looks rather like the second revision of the LP12 chassis. It's not, because the pressing is 'open' at the motor end, whilst LP12 chassis have a lip all the way around. The first version was single-piece pressed steel. When I first saw this on an old RD11 I once had (s/n 000089) I thought it was a later addition... but the same design turned up on another RD11 that I still own (s/n 000082) and on that belonging to a correspondent who owns 000073. The deck with s/n 00005 which appeared on eBay recently had the one-piece pressed steel chassis and the crimped leak-prone bearing which was fitted to the LP12 with the red rocker switch.

    My new acquisition has no reference to Linn Products on the chassis, just on the armboard, but it's certainly an LP12 because of the actual number and where it's printed. RD11s had a separate plastic sticker with the serial number, and the grey label with 'Final Inspection' printed on it has the signature of the member of staff who inspected it. That makes sense, the Linn label doesn't.

    s-l1600-14.jpg
     
  11. Hamstall

    Hamstall Active Member

    Messages:
    165
    No it has it... trimmed off as you'd expect. Thumbnail 1. It wasn't on the eBay listing pics, but I asked the vendor to see if it was present before bidding.
     

     

    Please register to disable this ad.

  12. Macaroonie

    Macaroonie Member

    Messages:
    62
    [​IMG] s-l1600.jpg

    Hi gang . New poster here but long time member over at Lansing Heritage. I was in the Hi Fi biz for many years here in Scotland and in the US.
    I knew Hamish and have no doubt in my mind that his design existed pre Linn. I saw them in his house which doubled as a hi fi shop.
    Anyway I posted this pic of 00005 because as you can see the foam ' dampers ' are still there , thereby refuting the assertion that Ivor designed this out of the Linn
    I'm with what you guys have been saying and by and large you are correct , it is indeed a mystery why the court decision went Linn's way. Hamish had identifiable prior use of the design and had prototypes. That and the single point bearing issue is hogwash. Thorens and others had it as did original Aristons.

    It is a murky story and one that never sat well with me as long as I worked in that industry.

    M
     
    Last edited: May 30, 2018
  13. theophile

    theophile Pheasant Plucker. Subscriber

    Ivor never envisaged that his web of lies, though known to be lies by many, would ever publicly unravel.
     
  14. theophile

    theophile Pheasant Plucker. Subscriber

    Thanks for the information Macaroonie. Very little of what Ivor has said about that period adds up or even concurs with the other things he has said about the same time frame.
     
  15. Hamstall

    Hamstall Active Member

    Messages:
    165
    Hi Macaroonie. Good to meet you.

    Is this Linn 00005? The one that recently went on eBay for £1500?
     
  16. Macaroonie

    Macaroonie Member

    Messages:
    62
    That's for sure. But shit sticks to yer shoe !!

    FWIW I was in Harrogate at the show of the ' crying ' incident. Don't let ex or current Linn dealers tell you otherwise , it happened and it was all round the show like a bush fire. I was there that night but missed it but many many people didn't. I was in the Swan Hotel nearby with Arnie Nudell. A Colonial chap.
     

     

    Please register to disable this ad.

  17. Hamstall

    Hamstall Active Member

    Messages:
    165
    Having checked the eBay listing, I see it is. There are many details on that deck that are wrong though, so I'd not trust the foam in the springs as being original... although they *could* be.

    1) If you check the motor, you'll see it has a 1974 manufacture date.
    2) The armboard is of the second type with a 'finish' to the underside. The first Linn armboards were bare hardboard underneath.
    3) The chassis is the later one-piece pressed type not the pre-Linn Ariston type.
    4) Ditto the bearing is of the second castellated type.

    In conclusion I'd guess that the top-plate and serial numbers are correct from deck 000005, but precious little else is.
     
  18. Macaroonie

    Macaroonie Member

    Messages:
    62
    Indeed. Just the chassis
     
  19. Hamstall

    Hamstall Active Member

    Messages:
    165
    Hamish's company "Thermac" ... was it a central heating company? I have a story from a chap based in Berkshire who says that an old friend of his was also a friend of Hamish's, and his home was indeed a kind of hi-fi shop, but his core business was heating or the like. This chap owned RD11 number 0000001, obtained from Hamish as a demo unit. He was going to do some marketing work for him and liked him immensely, but found him impossible to do business with because they'd both just end up listening to music and getting pi**ed every night!
     
  20. Hamstall

    Hamstall Active Member

    Messages:
    165
    Yes... of course the RD11/LP12 were both offered chassis-only. This makes Ivor's comments about the 'iconic' fluted LP12 plinth being different from the RD11's totally irrelevant. The plinth wasn't actually part of the deck as supplied, since it and the cover were technically optional extras. Contemporary price lists verify this.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page