XLR vs RCA Shootout

jblnut

Don't Overthink It
Like many people with newer gear, I have been wondering "hmm...could using a balanced XLR cable on my phono pre or my CD player actually make a noticeable difference?" Finally this past week I decided to see for myself. First step was to get some decent new XLR cables, so I hit my local hi-fi shop (Natural Sound) for 2 sets of 4ft Monster 1000i cables. These are $100/pair cables just for reference (not cheap, not expensive - somewhere in what I hoped would be the meaty middle ground).

My setup is as follows:

CD - Sony XA5400ES (with Audioquest Ruby cables)
Phono - VPI Classic with Denon DL-S1
Phono Pre - Pass Labs Xono (with some $20 low-end Monster cables I had on hand)
Main Pre - McIntosh C220
Amp - McIntosh MC275
Speakers - JBL 250Ti

I added the balanced 1000i cables to both the CD and phono pre and hooked them to to unused balanced inputs on the preamp. I left the RCA's that were already there connected. This would let me quickly change sources from the remote across the room. I then put some music on both and proceeded to make sure the levels were matched between cables. I had read that XLR should be +3db louder but this was not the case with either component. The levels were already matched.

At this point I began to listen to some CD's - some rock, some jazz, some vocal. I listened and I listened before I brought in my wife and teenage son for a second and third opinion. I repeated the same test over again with some LP's - a variety of different kinds of music and I had them come in again to listen with me.

I spent all of Friday afternoon this way and came to the conclusion that I cannot hear a difference, and neither could they.

I post this only to bear witness that in my room with my system on that day, a difference could not be detected. I fully respect the opinions and ears of those that can and do hear differences (especially those that can listen, turn the system off, change cables, turn it back on and hear a difference 5-10 miuntes later).

You may draw whatever conclusions that you like here. Perhaps I did not test high-end enough XLR's to be "that" much better than what I am using. Perhaps I did not listen long enough. Perhaps signal to preamp cables are not as noticeable as preamp-amp or amp-speaker cables.

Whatever the reason, I am actually happy to be able to return $200 worth of cables because I could not detect a meaningful difference. And that's why I am posting here. Not to start wars and not to degrade anyone who is very much into cable swapping and fine tuning their system this way. I'm just sharing actual experience in the hopes that others may find this useful.

jblnut
 
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Nice test and glad you did it with several pairs of ears.

Cool that your preamp has the intelligence to adjust for the gain differential between balanced and unbalanced signals and even cooler that you can switch them on the fly to compare :thmbsp:

Enjoy your newly proven setup to it's fullest!

Best,
Mike
 
Does your preamp selector lift both the + and ground leads or does it leave the ground in place, only lifting the + wire? (I've never dealt with XLR connections, I assume they are similar to an RCA in this respect.) If both grounds stayed in place it might have had an impact on your results, one way or another.
 
I always thought the advantage of XLR was over long cable runs. Obviously no sound-reinforcement systems would run RCA from Front of House to the stage, but I never figured out why in my home system I should expect an advantage. I have the capability of running balanced from my active crossover to my amps but since the run is three-feet I never expected to find a difference. Of course to go completely balanced would be better. In my system that would require a different pre-amp and EQ and, since I am quite content with my Soundcraftsmen Pro-Control-Four and Pro-EQ-44, I'm happy to interpret your results into saving me the trouble and expense.

Thanks!
 
Thanks for putting the time and effort in to make, and share the results of, your test.
 
I have a question. Is there any inherent property of balanced cable that would make the signal 3db louder? My admittedly limited understanding of balanced cables is that they cancel out noise and thus improve the noise floor.

Boosting the signal 3db would typically make the balanced cable sound better given that it's been found that people prefer the louder source. And of course if a cable could boost my sound level by 3 db without any change in amp wattage, we'd all be waiting in line to buy one. It would effectively convert a 100 wpc amp into 150 wpc.

Having said that, thanks for the careful testing and especially your attention to matching sound levels.
 
I appreciate all your kind words, and I also appreciate those who did not jump in to try and blame me, my equipment or my ears for failing to hear a difference (we have enough hot topics around here lately).

On the preamp front, yes one of my favorite features of the C220 is the ability to "trim" each input +/- 6db in .5db steps so that all of your sources will be the same volume as you switch between them. It's incredibly useful for comparisons like this.

On the topic of the mystery +3db with XLR cables, both the store manager where I bought the cables as well as my Pass Labs preamp manual mentioned this. I was really surprised when I did not get the expected bump in volume using them. As to why or why not, I need to do more research on this front.

As you can see I have invested in upmarket cables in the past (the Audioquest Rubys) but this was before I ever owned a preamp with a remote, and a CD player with dual outputs. I would encourage anyone who really wants to be able to A/B cables quickly and easily to invest in a similar setup. By sitting squarely in your listening spot and changing back and forth between different inputs in your preamp (one going to each set of cables back to the CD) can you really get a fair sense of what each cable is or isn't bringing to the party.

jblnut
 
You might not see any difference with both RCA and XLR plugged in at the same time, not sure.
 
Most everyone knows by now that I believe that cables make a difference. That said, other than a lower noise floor in some systems, I haven't been able to hear the difference between XLR and standard RCA's either.

Thank you for sharing your experience.
 
I appreciate all your kind words, and I also appreciate those who did not jump in to try and blame me, my equipment or my ears for failing to hear a difference (we have enough hot topics around here lately).

On the preamp front, yes one of my favorite features of the C220 is the ability to "trim" each input +/- 6db in .5db steps so that all of your sources will be the same volume as you switch between them. It's incredibly useful for comparisons like this.

On the topic of the mystery +3db with XLR cables, both the store manager where I bought the cables as well as my Pass Labs preamp manual mentioned this. I was really surprised when I did not get the expected bump in volume using them. As to why or why not, I need to do more research on this front.

As you can see I have invested in upmarket cables in the past (the Audioquest Rubys) but this was before I ever owned a preamp with a remote, and a CD player with dual outputs. I would encourage anyone who really wants to be able to A/B cables quickly and easily to invest in a similar setup. By sitting squarely in your listening spot and changing back and forth between different inputs in your preamp (one going to each set of cables back to the CD) can you really get a fair sense of what each cable is or isn't bringing to the party.

jblnut

It occurs to me that maybe having both cables connected might reduce the balanced output by 3db. An interesting experiment might be to measure the output levels of the balanced cables by themselves vs. the standard cables by themselves using pink noise such as FM interstation noise. I don't really expect there will be a difference, but I could be wrong.
 
A true balanced line adds 3 dB because it carries 2 signals, 180 degrees out of phase with each other, which are then combined at the input (after the phase is flipped back on the - signal)

All else being equal, I wouldn't expect much of a difference to be heard, except -

XLR is a much more robust connector which "makes" ground first, so you can hot-plug it. Plus it locks, which is nice.

You can make very long runs of balanced cable if you need some distance between components. Most commonly you would see this with preamp > amp connections, so you can keep speaker wire runs very short.
 
I saw no mention of taking care of the room acoustics, or its background level or noise floor. Without addressing these two item's, no listening test is going to reveal anything.
 
I saw no mention of taking care of the room acoustics, or its background level or noise floor. Without addressing these two item's, no listening test is going to reveal anything.

Please tell me what you are trying to get at with these comments. None of us listen in a "perfect" room and I didn't have a chainsaw running in the background or anything. I can assure you that after being a musician for over 40 years and a hi-fi nut for 30 I am quite capable of discerning differences in my system.

Put another way - if I have to go to extreme lengths to hear differences - lengths that I would not go to in a normal music listening scenario - then the difference is moot to me anyway.

Jblnut
 
Like many people with newer gear, I have been wondering "hmm...could using a balanced XLR cable on my phono pre or my CD player actually make a noticeable difference?" Finally this past week I decided to see for myself. First step was to get some decent new XLR cables, so I hit my local hi-fi shop (Natural Sound) for 2 sets of 4ft Monster 1000i cables. These are $100/pair cables just for reference (not cheap, not expensive - somewhere in what I hoped would be the meaty middle ground).

My setup is as follows:

CD - Sony XA5400ES (with Audioquest Ruby cables)
Phono - VPI Classic with Denon DL-S1
Phono Pre - Pass Labs Xono (with some $20 low-end Monster cables I had on hand)
Main Pre - McIntosh C220
Amp - McIntosh MC275
Speakers - JBL 250Ti

I added the balanced 1000i cables to both the CD and phono pre and hooked them to to unused balanced inputs on the preamp. I left the RCA's that were already there connected. This would let me quickly change sources from the remote across the room. I then put some music on both and proceeded to make sure the levels were matched between cables. I had read that XLR should be +3db louder but this was not the case with either component. The levels were already matched.

At this point I began to listen to some CD's - some rock, some jazz, some vocal. I listened and I listened before I brought in my wife and teenage son for a second and third opinion. I repeated the same test over again with some LP's - a variety of different kinds of music and I had them come in again to listen with me.

I spent all of Friday afternoon this way and came to the conclusion that I cannot hear a difference, and neither could they.

I post this only to bear witness that in my room with my system on that day, a difference could not be detected. I fully respect the opinions and ears of those that can and do hear differences (especially those that can listen, turn the system off, change cables, turn it back on and hear a difference 5-10 miuntes later).

You may draw whatever conclusions that you like here. Perhaps I did not test high-end enough XLR's to be "that" much better than what I am using. Perhaps I did not listen long enough. Perhaps signal to preamp cables are not as noticeable as preamp-amp or amp-speaker cables.

Whatever the reason, I am actually happy to be able to return $200 worth of cables because I could not detect a meaningful difference. And that's why I am posting here. Not to start wars and not to degrade anyone who is very much into cable swapping and fine tuning their system this way. I'm just sharing actual experience in the hopes that others may find this useful.

jblnut

Years ago I ran a similar test, the difference was that I compared pairs of identical brand/model/length XLR and RCA interconnects. I did hear a difference between the two. Neither was better than the other, just that each had a slightly different sonic presentation. I preferred the sound with the balanced cables, and that is what I have been using ever since. One benefit I like is the more secure connections of the XLR plugs. IMO all your test proves is that in YOUR system, XLR or RCA makes no difference. Not all equipment is true differential. Some components just have converters on input/output. There are too many variables among various brand/model components and each person's experience is going to be different.
 
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Please tell me what you are trying to get at with these comments. None of us listen in a "perfect" room and I didn't have a chainsaw running in the background or anything. I can assure you that after being a musician for over 40 years and a hi-fi nut for 30 I am quite capable of discerning differences in my system.

Put another way - if I have to go to extreme lengths to hear differences - lengths that I would not go to in a normal music listening scenario - then the difference is moot to me anyway.

Jblnut

Oh heck, relax and stop being defensive :nono:

Whether you have been a musician or a high fi nut for 100 years, the typical background levels of most houses would not allow you to hear any difference between anything. That is unless you live in a rural country setting where there is no traffic or noise whatsoever. Even then a refrigerator, a computer, or any other appliance running would detract from any subtle difference one could here between two different interconnects.

The only difference I have heard from XLR and RCA interconnects, is a lower noise floor via the XLR. That difference allowed me to hear a airplane going over the recording venue that I could not hear via the RCA cables. Or the sound of the air conditioning system in the venue being heard versus not being heard. The room I did this comparison in had a NC-15 rating, and was done in a dedicated hometheater room.

I had a friend who invited me over to see if we could here the difference between Dolby Digital and DTS. He had a great system, but he did not pay very close attention to his room's acoustics. Because of that, we could hear no difference between the two. We went back to my place and did the test in my hometheater that had been tweaked to death with both passive(acoustical panels and bass traps) and electronic acoustical treatment(Audyssey XT32 Pro), and the differences between the two could more easily be heard.

Sometimes the differences are there, but the environment won't allow us to hear it. The point I was trying to make is when you do listening tests, the environment for which you conduct them in should be addressed as well as the equipment you use. If you don't do this, don't expect to hear much difference between anything because sometimes those differences are very subtle, but they are there.
 
XLR advantages are cancellation or vast reduction of hum, lower noise. And the biggest of all for some, the ability to do long cable runs. In broadcasting plants, a necessity as well as recording studios and professional uses. In digital, the AES/EBU connections on professional equipment are equivalent.
 
Exactly. 60hz hum picked up on long cable runs is cancelled out on balanced amps, which amplify only the difference signal between the two input wires. Hum is common mode, in phase on both inputs, so is cancelled out. Not a concern on home systems with 3' cables.
 
Thanks to the op for taking the time to test and relay his thoughts and findings.

I built balanced cables of Mil Spec Silver plated copper mission critical cable using Neutrik Connectors and Cardas silver solder. These run between my ARC LS15 preamp and my crossovers, and my Sony SCD-XA5400ES CD player. The runs are short (4ft.) but to me they did make a difference in the noise floor. They replaced RCA cables of the same material that now reside in my vintage rig. I went balanced with the thought of building a cabinet for my 2 crossovers and 3 amps so I could use shorter speaker wire runs. I still plan on doing that somewhere down line, but even the shorter Balanced cables made a difference to my ears.
Regards,
Jim
 
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