Yamaha C-4 pre
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Bauhausler
Rational Subjectivist
I'll get to make the comparison soon. I'm going to repair a friend's C-2 and I'll listen to it next to the C-4.
The C-4 is definitely a keeper. Looks fairly ordinary inside but man does it get the job done.
Most definitely...:thmbsp:
Susurus
Resolution:6.62×10^-34
Which of my C-4's sounds better? 
2 pre's with different mileage, heat exposure, etc.. lotsa factors to determine which sounds better with which sources... potentially, the C-2 specs have the edge there? Practically, it's up for grabs. C-4's may be newer. Avionic has the right stuff there, I remember the pic of all the new caps for his total redoing.
Pic of my latest rack-mount, yours is really superb there. :thmbsp::thmbsp: Ordinary? I'm still doing the upgrade thing so anything with Alps controls looks high end to me.
2 pre's with different mileage, heat exposure, etc.. lotsa factors to determine which sounds better with which sources... potentially, the C-2 specs have the edge there? Practically, it's up for grabs. C-4's may be newer. Avionic has the right stuff there, I remember the pic of all the new caps for his total redoing.
Pic of my latest rack-mount, yours is really superb there. :thmbsp::thmbsp: Ordinary? I'm still doing the upgrade thing so anything with Alps controls looks high end to me.
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Glad to help out.
I'd say the C-4 is nearly on par with my C2a, one that I resurrected from the dead as well. The C2a is truly "wire with gain," whereas the C-4 gives you a little cartridge loading control and that wonderful parametric tone control. Certainly one of the more under appreciated models. I've enjoyed them since I bought my first one in 1983. Alas, that particular unit is now living on as parts in Bauhausler's C-4 and other's surely to come. :thmbsp:
The C-4 runs warm like other Yamaha preamps because it has so much active circuitry compared to other preamps. I have a C-60 preamp, which is STATED to draw 30 watts in use. This at least twice what most other manufacturers preamps use. Yamaha seems to do even simple jobs in the most complicated way possible, which means using LOTS of parts, many of which produce heat.
Frankly, it is possible to produce excellent audio results with simpler circuit design approaches than Yamaha uses. They don't seem to be aware of this fact.
Frankly, it is possible to produce excellent audio results with simpler circuit design approaches than Yamaha uses. They don't seem to be aware of this fact.
I recall that when I was using my C2x,that it produced a lot of heat.My conclusion was that it was biased heavily into Class A,or was Pure Class A.
Now I use an attenuator and a Buffer.The Buffer is purely discrete(no chips/discrete regulation),and runs so hot that one can barely hold it long enough to move/lift it.
Now I use an attenuator and a Buffer.The Buffer is purely discrete(no chips/discrete regulation),and runs so hot that one can barely hold it long enough to move/lift it.
Susurus
Resolution:6.62×10^-34
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Bauhausler
Rational Subjectivist
I've been using the C-4 for a while and I see no reason to switch to another. I've owned and used literally dozens of preamps, tube and solid state. I wouldn't say that this pre reaches into another dimension and adds magic unicorn sparkles to the music but it certainly does nothing wrong that I can hear. Compared to my C-2x it does have a couple of features that I use such as switchable outputs, tone turnover control and a separate balance knob. I also like havin ga separate headphone control so I can leave the phones plugged in and just turn them down when not in use.
On my bench I now have a C2 belonging to an AK/SMAC (Southeast Michigan Audio Club) member. He came by this afternoon to drop off a SE 300B amp I lent him, pick up an Ampzilla that I put a new lighting circuit into and to drop off this C2 for service. Cosmetically it's very similar to the C-2x but is completely different indoors. I'll try to get some usable pix of it for comparison.
I'm looking forward to 'testing' the C2 in my system but I have to get it back to him on Sat. when we get together for the monthly SMAC meet.
On my bench I now have a C2 belonging to an AK/SMAC (Southeast Michigan Audio Club) member. He came by this afternoon to drop off a SE 300B amp I lent him, pick up an Ampzilla that I put a new lighting circuit into and to drop off this C2 for service. Cosmetically it's very similar to the C-2x but is completely different indoors. I'll try to get some usable pix of it for comparison.
I'm looking forward to 'testing' the C2 in my system but I have to get it back to him on Sat. when we get together for the monthly SMAC meet.
I agree about the internals of the 'C2' family.The C2x is a whole different critter internally from the others.Looking at the C2x is like looking at a Saturn rocket compared to a ox-cart.
I've only got pics of the C2a and the C2x.
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C4 voltage woes
Have just ordered a C4 with 110V/60Hz supply from theUSA.
Problem is, in INDIA we have 220V/50Hz??
Any ideas how to set it up?
Will the 60Hz to 50Hz have any effect on the sound?
Using a YAMAHA Power Amp M45+ JBL L110 Speaker+THORENS TD160+ SME 3009+DENON DL 301 cartridge. Great sounding rig till the C40 died out with crackling sound.
Have just ordered a C4 with 110V/60Hz supply from theUSA.
Problem is, in INDIA we have 220V/50Hz??
Any ideas how to set it up?
Will the 60Hz to 50Hz have any effect on the sound?
Using a YAMAHA Power Amp M45+ JBL L110 Speaker+THORENS TD160+ SME 3009+DENON DL 301 cartridge. Great sounding rig till the C40 died out with crackling sound.
Put in some LEDs in place of the bulbs and you probably won't have to do the job again unless you get unlucky and get a bad batch of LEDs like I once did.....:tears:
Bauhausler
Rational Subjectivist
I have a C-4 and a C2x. if you look at the circuitry, the signal path is pretty clean. I'm using the C4 and love it. No texactly minimalist but I do use most of the features.
I have problems with loose RCA jacks on these causing intermittents. The C2x is a flaming b**ch to get apart and work on. The C2x has one of the quietist phono sections I've ever used, even after decades of use it's DEAD quiet.
I have problems with loose RCA jacks on these causing intermittents. The C2x is a flaming b**ch to get apart and work on. The C2x has one of the quietist phono sections I've ever used, even after decades of use it's DEAD quiet.
Bauhausler
Rational Subjectivist
Take a look at how the power regs are installed. Mine had only glue attaching the heat sinks to the PCB and it had all decayed and come loose. Because, you know, HEAT. The HS is drilled for a screw and there's a hole in the PCB for it but none was installed. that's just lazy.
A lot of Yamaha gear is known for cracked PCB traces and cracked solder joints. These can be a bear to find and fix.
Yep,Thats usually one of the first places I check for cracked solder connections then use some self tapping screws and fiber washers to secure heatsinks to the board after chipping the crusty dried glue off the board and surrounding components-remove transistor and wipe off old thermal compound then reapply new.
I had to do the same thing with a newly acquired C-85 pre-amp that I got from AK'er CDfac.
I had to do the same thing with a newly acquired C-85 pre-amp that I got from AK'er CDfac.
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