Your package will be professionally packed

[fropiler]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=5717449520&ssPageName=STRK:MEWN:IT

This was a close one. I contacted the seller and asked him to please take extra care in packaging, as I've seen some really bad packaging from ebay sellers. He assured me that my item would be "professioally packaged" What some people will call "professional packaging" is a mystery to me.

My heart sank when I saw the box at my door. The box was clearly on the verge of coming apart at the seams. Single box, item wrapped in bubble wrap, surrounded by peanuts. Box taped shut with wide scotch tape. (This is a 65lb sx-1250!)

Fortunately, there is no visible damage to the unit. As usual, the description of the item was overly optimistic. There is some scratchiness in the filter buttons that will cause the left channel to go away. A little contact cleaner has helped this along though.

Cosmetically, it'll clean up just fine. What some people consider clean is a mystery to me. Now what to do about this seller: He has a great feedback rating, and the item at least works, but is certainly not in "superb working condition". Frankly, I'm tired of letting people who do this get by just because I'm afraid of retaliation.

Is it really so hard to accurately describe an item and then use common sense in packaging it?

Any thoughts appreciated...

Ed

 

[ProAc_Fan]

Hell for $60USD shipping, a naked geisha should have hand deliverd this beast.


Mike

 

[digtubeess]

don't those go up to 500.00 for mint retail ?

well .. ebay is a gamble unless its a brick and mortar store that takes plastic direct, that way there is always a way to get out of it.

Packing is whole different matter, for electronics ebay should step in and give clear instructions on acceptable packing and back it up! I think also they should offer the buyer a limited warranty for a nominal fee , then if theres a problem ebay has the sellers card
and can charge them instead of burning the buyer.

Ebay has turned into the highest priced stuff that half the time junk. for me its only local pickup if I intend on buying audio equiptment. Also I like to talk to the guy 1st to see if he sounds like he has any marbles in his head.

My money is hard earned to gamble with some ebay joker!

cheers, Nancy

 

[fropiler]

Originally posted by digtubeess
don't those go up to 500.00 for mint retail ?

well .. ebay is a gamble unless its a brick and mortar store that takes plastic direct, that way there is always a way to get out of it.

Packing is whole different matter, for electronics ebay should step in and give clear instructions on acceptable packing and back it up! I think also they should offer the buyer a limited warranty for a nominal fee , then if theres a problem ebay has the sellers card
and can charge them instead of burning the buyer.

Ebay has turned into the highest priced stuff that half the time junk. for me its only local pickup if I intend on buying audio equiptment. Also I like to talk to the guy 1st to see if he sounds like he has any marbles in his head.

My money is hard earned to gamble with some ebay joker!

cheers, Nancy

Yeah, Grumpy had one listed here for 500.00, and I've seen them go for more on ebay. Don't get me wrong, this is one great receiver! but just once it would be nice if the item were as described and well packed. This is my third amp/receiver type purchase on ebay. Not one has been as described or well packaged. I think I'll be done for a while.

I like your idea of getting ebay involved in the standards of acceptable packing area. Would sure weed out alot of potential headaches.

Thanks,
Ed

 

[asynchronousman]

That's why I don't savor eBay. But I have lots of local goodies usually and variety on top of that. I pack by building solid foam sheets, etc. and peanuts is a cartoon. I usually have a guarentee on something and my money is on the line (if it's my fault definitely I will refund). Some of the eBrainless leave the recipient out of the loop and they can for the most part, because SO DOES eBay!:uzi: :uzi: :uzi:

 

[piece-it pete]

Mike, that's a great idea, I bet you'd get some bids on that alone!!

Ed, Whenever the seller makes claims like "ALL THE LIGHTS WORK EXCEPT THE INDICATOR LIGHT FOR SPEAKER (A) WHICH IS THE ONE THAT IS ALWAYS ON... THERE ARE A FEW MINOR SURFACE DINGS ON WOOD VENEER... OTHER THAN THAT THIS RECEIVER IS IN EXCELLENT COSMETIC CONDITION... BETTER YET, IT IS IN SUPERB WORKING CONDITION... "

then says: " THIS ITEM IS BEING SOLD AS-IS WITH NO WARRANTY IMPLIED AND NO RETURNS DUE TO AGE AND WEIGHT... "

I email them and ask them if they will guarentee the item for a week, or even a day or two after receipt, to be "as described". I keep the response, which for me has always been so far yes. I put that statement (guarenteed as listed) right in my listings.
I don't know the value of this unit but if you think you paid a premium for EC condition I wouldn't let it go totally unfought, based on his description, scratchy/cutting out channels is hardly "superb working condition", and I'd chew him out over the crappy professional-my-eye packaging. We've got to at least try to self-police these semi-shady sellers.

BTW did he refund the frt difference as advertised? And nice unit! It could have been far, far worse.

Pete

PS Looking at his FB he might not sell a lot of this stuff. That would explain some packing, but still not the scratchy/cutting out channels.

"Is it really so hard to accurately describe an item and then use common sense in packaging it?" I believe there's no excuse for the shoddy descriptions. The packing, well I just saw a coworker put a '58 name brand guitar (don't remember the make, but very nice looking) that his jazz playing son sold for $1000 into a single box with a bit of bubblewrap. I explained "the big brown grinder" to him and all he said was, "Who cares, it's insured". Even when I told him that UPS wil not settle if the packaging is inadaquate he still just didn't care!

 

[Wardsweb]

When someone tells me "professionally packed", I always ask a few questions:

packed by whom?
what does the BMC on the box state?
what is the mullens or ECT rating?

If they can not answer these questions, it is not being professionally packed.

 

[fropiler]

Originally posted by piece-it pete
Mike, that's a great idea, I bet you'd get some bids on that alone!!

Ed, Whenever the seller makes claims like "ALL THE LIGHTS WORK EXCEPT THE INDICATOR LIGHT FOR SPEAKER (A) WHICH IS THE ONE THAT IS ALWAYS ON... THERE ARE A FEW MINOR SURFACE DINGS ON WOOD VENEER... OTHER THAN THAT THIS RECEIVER IS IN EXCELLENT COSMETIC CONDITION... BETTER YET, IT IS IN SUPERB WORKING CONDITION... "

then says: " THIS ITEM IS BEING SOLD AS-IS WITH NO WARRANTY IMPLIED AND NO RETURNS DUE TO AGE AND WEIGHT... "

I email them and ask them if they will guarentee the item for a week, or even a day or two after receipt, to be "as described". I keep the response, which for me has always been so far yes. I put that statement (guarenteed as listed) right in my listings.
I don't know the value of this unit but if you think you paid a premium for EC condition I wouldn't let it go totally unfought, based on his description, scratchy/cutting out channels is hardly "superb working condition", and I'd chew him out over the crappy professional-my-eye packaging. We've got to at least try to self-police these semi-shady sellers.

BTW did he refund the frt difference as advertised? And nice unit! It could have been far, far worse.

Pete

PS Looking at his FB he might not sell a lot of this stuff. That would explain some packing, but still not the scratchy/cutting out channels.

"Is it really so hard to accurately describe an item and then use common sense in packaging it?" I believe there's no excuse for the shoddy descriptions. The packing, well I just saw a coworker put a '58 name brand guitar (don't remember the make, but very nice looking) that his jazz playing son sold for $1000 into a single box with a bit of bubblewrap. I explained "the big brown grinder" to him and all he said was, "Who cares, it's insured". Even when I told him that UPS wil not settle if the packaging is inadaquate he still just didn't care!

Pete,

No refund on the shipping. The channel only seems to cut out when input is set to phono. The aux input seems fine. Seller probably didn't go to the bother of trying all the inputs and such. Probably just hooked up a cd player and some speakers and called it a day. (er, "superb working condition")

Same type thing with this one: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=73369&item=5713857181

Left channel noise while in phono mode, quiet in aux mode. Packed in single box, bubble wrap and newspaper. Seller told me to file a claim, because it worked fine when he had it...

I won't be letting this one slide, as I paid top dollar.

Ed

 

[fropiler]

Originally posted by Wardsweb
When someone tells me "professionally packed", I always ask a few questions:

packed by whom?
what does the BMC on the box state?
what is the mullens or ECT rating?

If they can not answer these questions, it is not being professionally packed.

Those sound like good questions to ask, Except I don't know what they mean either! (I get the first one)

Thanks,
Ed

 

[jerrymrc]

See the pic from the UPS/9-11 Thread. Thats what I call professional. P.S. That big Optonica 5605 got here today. I was worried. Seems to be OK but it was packed with a little bit of bubble and alot of waded up paper. It sure did move around in the old box though.

 

[Wardsweb]

Originally posted by fropiler
Those sound like good questions to ask, Except I don't know what they mean either! (I get the first one)

Thanks,
Ed

See, it's already doing it's job of weeding out the people that don't know how to correctly (read professionally) associate the weight of an item and the box that must handle it.

Hint: has to do with box construction and certification to handle a specific weight and crush threshold.

 

[fropiler]

Originally posted by Wardsweb
See, it's already doing it's job of weeding out the people that don't know how to correctly (read professionally) associate the weight of an item and the box that must handle it.

Hint: has to do with box construction and certification to handle a specific weight and crush threshold.

Good one!

See my feedback on this item.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=32841&item=5705890893

I brought this bad boy to a Professional shipping company where they custom made the shipping crate on site.

Point is, if I don't know what I'm doing, I don't pretend that I do. I enlist the services of someone who does!

I wish we could all expect the same in return.

Ed

 

[DS1784]

I stopped worring about getting the retalitory negative feedback. i have over 800 feedbacks for buying and selling. somewhere we must start leaving negative feedbacks if they are deserved. people must start being accurate with there descriptions. i have gotten negatives from people because they did not pay for an auction after two months. now, i leave a negative if it is deserved. when go into peoples feedback you can tell when there are retalitory negatives. read mine, i have over 800 glowing positives and six negatives, they would just as soon burn me at the stake. after reading a few of these you can see what kind of person you are dealing with. but if you don't leave a negative and it is deserved, shame on you your fellow audio hobbiest, collector, or aker, may be that persons next victim. i think its all the more important, especially the way some of these prices are going. you know out of control. so help protect your other on line shoppers and leave the appropriate feedback. after awhile the bad ones will be weeded out

 

[fropiler]

Here's the latest. Turns out it WAS professionally shipped!

I'm going to paste in the e-mail trail between us and have you folks here comment. My impression is that I've just been very politely "blown off".

Hi Ed,

Sorry to hear about the shoddy UPS packaging, I thought they were supposed to be professionals... I'm happy to hear that it arrived safely and that it was insured for the full amount...
No, I didn't test it, I had a friend of mine check it out as he has all of the components needed to test it... He said that he didn't test all the bells and whistles, but I didn't use most of them when I used it years ago as I didn't find it necessary... I kept my records in mint condition and wanted the pure quality sound... He told me all of the components that he hooked up worked fine...

Take Care................Mike


----- Original Message -----
From: Ed Johnson
To: mbrimmer
Sent: Tuesday, September 14, 2004 9:33 PM
Subject: Re: Pioneer Receiver


Mike,

You may want to have a word with UPS. This 65lb unit was packed in a single box with no reinforcement, wrapped in bubble wrap, and surrounded by peanuts, box was taped with shut with wide scotch tape. By the look of the box when it arrived, I'm amazed that there is no visible damage to the unit itself.

Also, the filter switches are very noisy and will cause the left channel to fade completely if turned on while using the phono input. Were these aspects of the unit tested by you?

Thanks,
Ed
----- Original Message -----
From: mbrimmer
To: Ed Johnson
Sent: Tuesday, September 07, 2004 6:54 PM
Subject: Re: Pioneer Receiver


Hi Ed,

Your Pioneer receiver was professionally boxed and shipped today via UPS... The shipping total was $60.00 as it was packaged by them and insured for $300.00... It should arrive by Friday 9/10... Here is the tracking number: # 1Z 5478 5803 2246 5215....
Please let me know when it arrives... Positive feedback will be left upon your satisfaction... Thanks again and take care...

Mike
----- Original Message -----
From: Ed Johnson
To: mbrimmer
Sent: Saturday, September 04, 2004 12:08 AM
Subject: Re: Pioneer Receiver


Hi Mike,

Sound goods. Please take extra care in packaging this bad boy. I've had some items show up in pretty rough shape, (Like my last amp purchased on eBay) wouldn't want that to be the case with this one.

Have a great weekend!
Ed

 

[fropiler]

Originally posted by fropiler
Here's the latest. Turns out it WAS professionally shipped!

I'm going to paste in the e-mail trail between us and have you folks here comment. My impression is that I've just been very politely "blown off".

Hi Ed,

Sorry to hear about the shoddy UPS packaging, I thought they were supposed to be professionals... I'm happy to hear that it arrived safely and that it was insured for the full amount...
No, I didn't test it, I had a friend of mine check it out as he has all of the components needed to test it... He said that he didn't test all the bells and whistles, but I didn't use most of them when I used it years ago as I didn't find it necessary... I kept my records in mint condition and wanted the pure quality sound... He told me all of the components that he hooked up worked fine...

Take Care................Mike


----- Original Message -----
From: Ed Johnson
To: mbrimmer
Sent: Tuesday, September 14, 2004 9:33 PM
Subject: Re: Pioneer Receiver


Mike,

You may want to have a word with UPS. This 65lb unit was packed in a single box with no reinforcement, wrapped in bubble wrap, and surrounded by peanuts, box was taped with shut with wide scotch tape. By the look of the box when it arrived, I'm amazed that there is no visible damage to the unit itself.

Also, the filter switches are very noisy and will cause the left channel to fade completely if turned on while using the phono input. Were these aspects of the unit tested by you?

Thanks,
Ed
----- Original Message -----
From: mbrimmer
To: Ed Johnson
Sent: Tuesday, September 07, 2004 6:54 PM
Subject: Re: Pioneer Receiver


Hi Ed,

Your Pioneer receiver was professionally boxed and shipped today via UPS... The shipping total was $60.00 as it was packaged by them and insured for $300.00... It should arrive by Friday 9/10... Here is the tracking number: # 1Z 5478 5803 2246 5215....
Please let me know when it arrives... Positive feedback will be left upon your satisfaction... Thanks again and take care...

Mike
----- Original Message -----
From: Ed Johnson
To: mbrimmer
Sent: Saturday, September 04, 2004 12:08 AM
Subject: Re: Pioneer Receiver


Hi Mike,

Sound goods. Please take extra care in packaging this bad boy. I've had some items show up in pretty rough shape, (Like my last amp purchased on eBay) wouldn't want that to be the case with this one.

Have a great weekend!
Ed

Hey, on the bright side, at least the components that were tested with the unit tested good...

 

[fropiler]

Here's the latest...

Straight from my auction description: "THIS ITEM IS BEING SOLD AS-IS WITH NO WARRANTY IMPLIED AND NO RETURNS DUE TO AGE AND WEIGHT"...

I'm sorry to hear that everthing isn't working perfectly... I didn't have the receiver professionally serviced to as new condition like some people do or you would have had to pay much more for it, but I believe you know that... The receiver is in superb working condition for being almost 30 years old... All the components that were hooked up to it worked perfectly... You purchased a serious piece of gear at a very modest price...

Take Care....................Mike
----- Original Message -----
From: Ed Johnson
To: mbrimmer
Sent: Monday, September 20, 2004 9:06 PM
Subject: Re: Pioneer Receiver


Straight from your auction description: "... BETTER YET, IT IS IN SUPERB WORKING CONDITION... ". Yet you admit that you didn't test the unit at all, and your friend didn't test it completely either. (Although I'm glad to hear that his components tested fine...)

This is not a $10.00 auction. I purchased a serious piece of gear from you that is not as advertised by your own admission. What do you propose to do to about this?

Ed

 

[fropiler]

The final outcome

Well, I gave it my best shot. I even paid $20.00 for a Squaretrade mediator. Seller refused to respond.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=5717449520&ssPageName=STRK:MEAFB:IT

Add this seller to the list of bad ones. :thumbsdn:

 

[gyusher]

270.65

270.65 is a great price for a SX-1250 however that in no way excuses the poor packing or the inaccurate description. If this guy would have posted decent pics it might have gone much higher compounding a already crummy job and poor description.

I have had buyers ask questions about the function of each and every switch and all the inputs and outputs. I am happy to tell everything I know about everything. Stops the misunderstandings. . . One phrase I hate is this one ;considering it's age it is in superb condition

or the one; For a 30 year old receiver it is in excellent condition

Like somehow the receivers age excuses the fact that it doesnt work right.

In my mind it works or it doesnt work. . . Age is no excuse. . .

Also when it comes to heavy gear I have been buying from known or trusted sellers only, mainly sellers on this forum. . .

One last thing. . . 60 bucks is cheap to ship and pack a 1250. . . if done right. It takes 8 bucks worth of bubble wrap + 9 bucks for boxes + 3 bucks for tape and about 10 bucks for the foam panels to help cushion any impact. In full shipping trim that receiver weighs from 70 to 72 pounds. . So 30 bucks for packing materials only that leaves 30 to ship it. . . If you are coast to coast you are going to pay a buck a pound so it can get spendy to pack it properly.
It can be done for 60 but the seller better know what he is doing. Thats a big boy and very hard to handle without throwing it around.

 

[LPD]

I for one sell on e-bay and take great pride in packaging my items. I have a set of rules I follow that are never comprimised in order to guarantee an item will safely arrive. I double box, use hard foam as outer shell and soft as inner wrap. I secure all loose parts in a seperate box inside the box (ie tubes ect.) and most importantly I over grade X 100 so when an item arrives it is better than described. I also have items professionally packaged by Mailboxes Express. The ladies that work there are top of the line packagers and the best part is the packaging is insured!!! I use this as an option for expensive gear (I recently sold a pair of 15" Tannoy Golds and charged $40.00 packaging.

Just thought I'd put a plug in for the E-Bay sellers who do have integrity.

Peter

 

[john_w]

I stopped worring about getting the retalitory negative feedback. i have over 800 feedbacks for buying and selling. somewhere we must start leaving negative feedbacks if they are deserved.

I use e-bay only rarely -- just 3 purchases to date. No problems yet w/shipping, but one retaliatory negative feedback because I dinged someone a little for never answering questions I had about the product.

He basically said that I made unreasonable "demands" and tried to negotiate something after the sale. Say what??? All I did was politely and clearly ask a question about the condition of the grills, and ask another after the fact about shipping cost details. And my payment was still prompt. Nothing even closely resembled "negotiation". I just replied that this was obviously retaliation and referred the reader to my original rating of his sale.

But someone with only a couple of feedbacks can't afford a negative one so much as someone with 800, and he darn well knew this.

I see this as a major problem with e-bay. I think reviews lean heavily toward the glowingly positive side in fear of jerks like this, and in hopes of having the favor returned: It turns into the "good ol' boy network".

Well, screw that! I agree with DS1784 that we should leave negatives when they're deserved, regardless of the consequences and whether you have 800 feedbacks, or just 8.