Zilch's AK Design Collaborative - Econowave Speaker

Discussion in 'Speakers' started by Zilch, Feb 23, 2008.

  1. EvaXoXo

    EvaXoXo New Member

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    14
    Id probably be sticking with the original econowave, waveguide and crossover but Im intrigued by your suggestion. Have you used that combo successfully? Does anyone have any experience with this combination using the Ewave crossover?
     
  2. 300Z

    300Z Leo

    Messages:
    70
    Location:
    Recife, Brazil.
    I don't use this combo, but there's plenty of people who have used that waveguide with the Selenium D220Ti.
    I use the 6x6 PT waveguide with JBL2408H CD and B&C 8PS21 woofer, all active.
     
  3. EvaXoXo

    EvaXoXo New Member

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    14
    BTW this project may change if we can't completely recone these old woofers that both blown out from bieng overpowered with 600 watts... I can post more pics of the progress including the T/S parameters, we will measure them after the recone...

    [​IMG]

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    EarlK likes this.
  4. 4343

    4343 Super Member

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    1,100
    From the PE link just above your post:

    "PRV Audio's WG35-25-B waveguide is designed to emulate the sound of a QSC PL-000446GP waveguide, which is popular with Econowave DIY speaker builders! This 90° x 60° waveguide is designed to be used with 1" 2-bolt compression drivers, and allows for crossover points as low as 1,000 Hz due to how it loads the driver, resulting in amazing off-axis power response.

    Specifications: • Horn type: Exponential • Minimum frequency: 1,000 Hz • Nominal dispersion: 90° H x 60° V • Throat diameter: 1" • Mounting type: 2-bolt • Dimensions: 10.1" H x 14.2" W x 5.5" D."

    I think someone at PE or PRV is confused. They seem to be a pretty good approximation of the original QSC flare. Also they are cheap! I got 4 of them last year, one pair has the cheapo PRV drivers on them. Not all that impressed with the drivers. The other pair got drilled out to fit a 1.4" Altec clone driver. Now that set is nice!

    Page says clearance, get 'em while you still can, although to be honest, it said that last year too.
     
  5. Vladi

    Vladi New Member

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    25
    What driver would you recommend for it?
     
  6. turnitdown

    turnitdown AK Subscriber Subscriber

    Messages:
    1,240
    Location:
    Tallahassee, FL
    The nicest Econowave build with that horn was with a B&C DE250 driver, if I recall correctly
     
  7. EvaXoXo

    EvaXoXo New Member

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    14
    Some updates on my project. woofers are re coned :smoke: They measure 3.7 ohms and we painted them black. They have been doing very well for sub duty in a pair of well built 2.7 cu ft car subwoofer boxes and hitting deep down in the 20's hz range but they are gonna be full range soon:music:

    [​IMG]
     
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  8. Vladi

    Vladi New Member

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    25
    but PRV Audio's WG35-25-B little bit deeper than QSC PL-000446GP. What about delay?
     
  9. turnitdown

    turnitdown AK Subscriber Subscriber

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    1,240
    Location:
    Tallahassee, FL
    SO stoked. I have been busy in the last year with family crises, work loads and building tube amps. My system is as good as it has ever been (a relative term, surely.) I now have time and a little disposable and want to revisit E-waves. I have built Pi3s, Pi4s and E-waves with anything I could get my hands on. They are ALL revealing and easy thanks to the main players here. That led me to my 4430 purchase. If this is not heaven, it's only a half block away. I read the entire E-wave thread, completely, for the third time recently. It's what compelled me to join here. Well, with that education and soldering and math time under my belt I felt it was time to go big or stay home and enjoy what I have. So, let's go big AT home (to me) and build a nice set of smaller speakers that will rival (possible?) my 4430s.
    On their way to me are a pair of LE14As that only need foam. 4430s are 4.5 cu. ft. I ran the models and the LE14s have the same response as the 4430s to F3 in a 3.2 cu. ft. box. Enter the 4315s I was reading about a couple days ago and the XPL200s during the same research session. The 4315s inspired me to run the 3.2 cu. ft. number and the XPL200s inspired me because of the narrow baffle. If Greg Timbers saw the beauty in both those, I asked why I couldn't make them horn monitors and get deep bass, great mids AND highs. I'll build the box with a narrow baffle and the woofer at the top of my 33.5x16.14 box and then, keeping the crossover external to the box, run every top end that's been proven here now that I have measuring equipment. I have not been here as long as some, but longer than many. This thread is what brought me here and whether you build Wayne's Pis or an E-wave, this is the best, most rewarding value in audio, to me.
     
    EarlK likes this.
  10. turnitdown

    turnitdown AK Subscriber Subscriber

    Messages:
    1,240
    Location:
    Tallahassee, FL
    All that having been said (above), my baffle will be 16" across which puts my baffle step at (approx.) 418Hz. I would like these as flat as possible. 900Hz crossover point (acoustic.) What is the circuit to address this using the Econowave crossover specifically for the LE14A? There is a dead link to the westhost site that this query points me toward. Maybe you folks know.
     
  11. EvaXoXo

    EvaXoXo New Member

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    14
    My crossovers are done:cool:

    [​IMG]


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    We tested them on the lower end of my JBL 4722's, they sound pretty good even crossing over so high, (stock on the 4722 is 630 hz ).

    [​IMG]

    Just have to build some boxes now... These are the plans I came up with but Im all ears on the port design, my concern is the ports might be too small...

    [​IMG]

    This is what I found for the LE 14 crossover.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2017
    turnitdown likes this.
  12. djnagle

    djnagle Lunatic Member

    Messages:
    11,603
    Location:
    Albuquerque, New Mexico
    Looks good to me. It might be easier to buy ports from PE.
     
  13. EvaXoXo

    EvaXoXo New Member

    Messages:
    14
    turnitdown likes this.
  14. turnitdown

    turnitdown AK Subscriber Subscriber

    Messages:
    1,240
    Location:
    Tallahassee, FL
    LE14A pair just arrived and surrounds from Rick Cobb are ordered. Thanks for the LE 14 crossover schematic. Turns out I had it in an old dusty backup file. Oh well, I appreciate the help. I've modeled them in 3.2 cu. ft. boxes tuned to 34Hz. Puts my F3 at 34. I have the wave guides and drivers. The crossovers are almost finished. All that's left is to build the boxes and...

    Just ONE burning question left. Is there any baffle width (wide or narrow) that I should stay away from? Why?


    Thanks in advance. This is getting serious again. I have two 2235Hs with original cones waiting in the wings.
     
  15. turnitdown

    turnitdown AK Subscriber Subscriber

    Messages:
    1,240
    Location:
    Tallahassee, FL
    Right this minute, I am on the phone with JBL Professional ordering the 6x12 Econowave horns, part# 338800-001. I wanted the embossed logo for my LE14A project. They are currently $25.50 each plus shipping. After my order, there are 15 left in stock. Have fun!
     
    300Z likes this.
  16. wianieq

    wianieq AK Subscriber Subscriber

    Messages:
    625
    Hi everyone,

    I built the LE14a version in the large Barzilay cabs. Some recent changes to my system, new plinth, tonearm and cart, have made it so my high end has become a little harsh. Most of the time if I turn the lpad almost as far as it will go before cutting the high end all together I'm happy with it. When playing louder, or on certain records I would like to lower just a bit more but have no more room on the lpad. Can I throw a resister in there right before the lpad, and if so what are the values I should be looking at to bring the knob back to around 12 oclock?

    Thanks in advance for any ideas.
     
  17. djnagle

    djnagle Lunatic Member

    Messages:
    11,603
    Location:
    Albuquerque, New Mexico
    It could be a room issue. Is your room treated?
     
  18. wianieq

    wianieq AK Subscriber Subscriber

    Messages:
    625
    Partially treated. It was fine before I switched the plinth and cart on my tt so it must be one of those, or both. But I want to try a simple crossover adjustment rather than use something else.
     
  19. EvaXoXo

    EvaXoXo New Member

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    Well this project took a new direction I think Im gonna really like:)
    These were JBL JRX 125's...

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    They will be getting new drivers. Im using a $79.00 JBL 15" "car sub" and the CV 12" for a mid/bass and I have some $10.00 QSC horn clones with the B&C DE-250, OR the stock "econowave" wave guides. For these I have a choice between the Selenium D220ti or the Dayton Audio DT250 polymide CD.

    [​IMG]

    We turned the cabs upside down and added a 3/4" mdf baffle board, a brace and a partition, the two cavities are 1.79 cu ft for the top 12" with dual 2" ports Id like ported to 80HZ and highpassed at 80 hz 12 db/octave. For the 15" "subs" Im gonna start with a single 4" port tuned around 20 hz with an 80 hz lowpass 12 db/octave. The high and low pass will be passive and we will be bi amping them with Crown XLI 2002 and XLI 1002. They have built in DSP for an active setup or I can use my DBX VENU360 and go all active but Id like these to have an all passive plug and play option. The cabs are designed with a removable port section that goes through the old hole for the horn. I can easily try a dual 4" port just by changing it out with a different one:D

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    Horns and crossovers will mount to the top like a JBL theater speaker.

    [​IMG]

    So we have a "3 way" e wave :rockon: I have 3 choices for crossovers that will all be tried, stock ewave 4ohm high efficiency, stock JBL JRX crossover at 2.5 khz, or some JBL networks from my 4722N's... The 4722N network is set at 800 hz and it will be interesting to see if the QSC/B&C setup will handle being crossed that low...

    [​IMG]

    More pics to come soon as things progress...
     
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2017
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  20. EvaXoXo

    EvaXoXo New Member

    Messages:
    14
    Additionally the stock woofers used in the JBL JRX is the same 15 used in the lower line JBL 3722n cinema speaker with the exact same bass cabinet as the 4722 and tuned a lot deeper than the JRX. Im planning on either doing another single or dual 15 2 or 3 way center channel between my 4722 mains OR these 4 spare 15's might end up in a riser underneath my couch that will raise up the seating in my HT...

    Also coming soon is this ewave mini with the Eminence beta 8 and the Selenium HM17-25 WG, I have all the parts here including the final design crossover:cool:

    http://techtalk.parts-express.com/forum/tech-talk-forum/39016-e-wave-mini/page26
     
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2017
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