Tame my Heresy II's

Yankee Dog

Yankee Dog

Well-Known Member
So, I have had these Heresy's for a little over a year. I recapped them using the kit Bob Crites sells about 8 months ago. It made an improvement in the harshness of the high end. I have even played with the tissue paper/thin layer of foam over the tweeter thing for the past few months. That seemed OK for awhile.

Then I got (a gift) a pair of Large Advents circa 1976, and started listening to them and put the heresy's aside for awhile.

Just pulled the Heresey's back out to run with my 1060 (fully recapped 1060), and the heresy's sound harsh as ever. I am sure it is because I am used to the smoother east coast sound of the advents, but, I really feel I need to smooth these heresy's out. Bass is not an issue, I get plenty of that.

I have read things like "it's not the tweeter, it the mid", "the tweeter leads need to be reversed at the crossover", "the tweeter needs to be attenuated, the mid need to be attenuated, the tweeter and the mid need to be attenuated", "the leads need to be moved to a different terminal" etc.

I guess what I am getting at is, I would really like to calm down the harshness, and am not sure where to start. I'm thinking of experimenting with attenuation, and would like to know if others have done the same, what worked, what did not, etc. These are circa 1985 Heresy II with the crossover in the rear terminal plate. I have had some success with the tone controls on my 1060, but, wondering what else I can do to make them softer, smoother, more mellow sounding.

Maybe I'm barking up the wrong tree and need to sell these and get something else. Who knows. Thanks, YD
 
Register to hide this ad
Did you ever think that your Heresy IIs and your Marantz just don't play well together???...I have tried Outlaw Audio RR2150 with my Klipschorns and I thought it sounded bright and harsh (others report this combination sound great together)...I then tried the Klipschorns with an older Nakamichi STASIS TA-2A...sounded great...Tubes sound the best but are not required with Klipsch despite what many say...(although mine soind wonderful with NOSValves VRDs)

My Heresys have sounded wonderful with Crites crossovers and the self same Nakamichi as it does with an older Yamaha CA-610 II Natural Sound amplifier...

My Quartets and RB-5s sound great with the Outlaw Audio RR2150...less so with some Outlaw Audio for Home Theater...

My Chorus IIs sound wonderful with a NOSValve'd EICO HF-81...

As you can see, I like the Klipsch sound and perhaps you just don't like the sound...anyway, you should try a different amp/receiver to get a better picture...I recall a buddy on Klipsch forum buying new Heresy IIs and not liking them after listening to his bought new kg4s prior...he picked up a NOSValve'd Scott integrated and loved this combination...

Sometimes it's just the synergy of the pieces you put together...that's part of the journey...good luck with yours...

Bill
 
You could look into some interconnects, maybe go a little on the dark side such as the older Audioquest models like Ruby, also look into a speaker cable change, audition first from Cable Co. Another cheap fix you can experiment with is try 1, 2 or 3 pieces of grill cloth over the mids and tweeters, you can find the black cloth at most fabric stores.
 
Get yourself a push-pull EL84 stereo amplifier (e.g., EICO HF-81 or a Scott 222C); it will help a lot. Those mid-1970s Marantz amps and receivers had a grainy "solid state" sound that's sure to displease with Heritage Klipsches, I'd opine.
 
I'm listening to my 1976 Heresy decorators ,(still in in raw birch) as we speak. I recently re-capped the speakers with Sonicaps. But the amp is a Dynaco Stereo 70 with the VTA70 driver board and 3 sweet little 1960's Hammond 12AU7s on it, and a new quad set of Mullard EL-34s. Levon Helm, "Electric Dirt" . You just haven't found the right amp to mix them up with. I'm voting with the Silversport.
 
Try ordering a pair of Crites CT 125 tweeters,

$172 shipped to your door.

Highly recommended :thmbsp:
 
I have a love/hate relationship with Heresys. They are VERY placement sensitive, and very unforgiving of input sources. In all honesty, I'd say your Advents are a MUCH better match to your 1060 (which is a fine amp).

If I were you, I'd look for a second pair of Advents for stacking, and forget trying to make the Heresys work with the Marantz.

Or get some tubes.
 
Firstly, many of the suggested mods you cite are for the originals with the metal horns and not the IIs. The originals really lend themselves to some easy mods to get dialed in. The IIs. So not react as well. One thing you may want to consider is getting an equalizer such as a Soundcraftsman. You can tame them with judicial use without introducing the distortions of the usual tone controls. The other is finding the right accessory components if not near perfect synergy overall, they are just frustrating. Power is not the key, nor loud SPL. Look for a small 6bq5 based amp as a starting point such as a Dyna SCA35, an EICO or Sherwood. If you are not afraid of a soldering iron and willing to dig around try to find an old Magnavox or similar tube console and pull the amp and convert it's inputs, etc. Another nice amp for these is the Little Jewel from Grommes though these are usually 6v6 outputs IMSM.

A problem with SS amps is the low wattage increase in distortion and this is not a good characteristic to run with the Heresy.

I've had mine for almost 20 years and it has always been a love/hate relationship so be you are not alone. It is a speaker that goes against so much of the established contemporary thinking about system development. Also, the speakers shine at low volume and are not as good at higher levels where so many drive them thinking that since they are used in discos, etc., they should be listened to at high levels. They just tend to blow out in terms of sound quality and sound like cheap disco speakers.
 
Sadly, the problem you describe is one of the key reasons I have never sought out a pair of heresys. Don't get me wrong, though, on the whole I love the klipsch sound, but heresys always seems to be either a) lacking in bass and/or b) harsh to point of irritating. Not sure why this is, but the amp probably has a lot to do with it. So I'm with everyone else. Try another amp or two... and do try some tubes! :)

You will hit on an amp that sounds MUCH different, I'm sure of it. Thats just the way heresys seem to roll, unfortunately.
 
They were originally designed as a center channel. The bass came from a pair of Klipschorns! If you took two center channel speakers (smaller than your mains) would you expect them to have thundering bass?
 
while originally designed to be a Center speaker that is no excuse if they still sound thin today...there have been many changes and at least three generations since the originals...I don't find them bass shy unless I do a side by side with a speaker that has more bass output (Quartets, KG 5.5s)...I find them a clean and balanced sounding speaker...that required me to update to titanium diaphragms on my Quartets (and KG 5.5s :D) after comparing them side to side...hope you find the amp/receiver that gives you the synergy to love your speakers...
Bill
 
Last edited:
pmsummer said:
They sound good with a little Tripath T-Amp.
Click to expand...

Yea. I have this and it's very good:
http://www.trendsaudio.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=37&Itemid=28
TA-10_onhandAug08.jpg
 
Bass shy the IIs are not. They do not have the bass hump so many speakers have that make them seem to have more bass extension than they actually have and emphasize the bass falsely. The bass is so well balanced and refined as opposed to so many other speakers it is unassuming. Sadly, too many people are not used to correct bass any longer. They are good to about 50hz which is lower than so many speakers that are acoustically dead at about 60hz and there is so little requiring below 50hz unless you are into organ, with proper placement you'll miss very little. The problem with them is at the other end of the frequency range where they are hot.
 
I using a 15 watt per Pilot 602 receiver with stock Heresey II's and it sounds great at common sense levels and it is loud but if you try to use the Heresys past their comfort level which is very loud they just fall apart in the mids and highs and sound harsh and lose definition. I'm going to try new caps and the Titanium tweeter from Crites sometime in the future. The 6BQ5's in the Pilot sound so much better with Heresys than the Fisher KX-200 with 7591's that it sounded like new speakers came with the Pilot. The 6BQ5's are just a more musical sounding tube that suits the Heresy's better. There's a lot of amps and receivers new and vintage using the 6BQ5/EL84. You could check out the YAQIN MC-84L EL84 at 12 watts per channel brand new and shipped to your door for around $350.00 on that auction site we all love.
 
Heresey 11's Mod's

The biggest issue with ALL horns is a combination of various things .
First issue all horns have "Cavity resonance" , which is a resonance either adding or subtracting significantly to the response curve ( IE add or subtract numerous dB at some specific frequencies)
The only way I know of to handle that particular issue is to use a small diameter (ie 1/2" to 3/4") cardboard tube aprox 2/3's the length of the horn
mounted on axis with the phase plug with one end closed and the other end facing the the driver , fill the tube with felt or wool .
It'll significantly cut down the cavity resonance if you happen to get the formaula right.

Next a lot of these horns are made from metal (usually steel or aluminum) which rings like a fire alarm at various frequencies due to shape and physics.
THe best way to deal with ringing is to serious damp the horn itself , I have found the best way to handle this is to use Dynamat acoustic mat ( used for damping car interiors ) on the back side of the horn and magnets.
To many people think the way to mod these speakers is to just replace caps,
while thats a good place to start , there are many many other things , like what cable are you using . I typically always use a large 12Ga OFC ( Oxygen free copper) high strand count (typ 250 or more) to re-wire most speakers.
This type of speaker wire typically sounds as good or better than most " Audiophile" type cable. ( ie In a double blind listening of cable , 12 GA consistently rated in the top 2)
Next is many horns are using mylar diaphrams which tend to dry up and get hard with age . change them if they are Mylar .
Next issue cabinet resonances .....All cabinets with parallel walls exhibit standing wave type of resonances . USe a lot of long fiber dampening !!
Raw COtton is actually and exceptional damping material , if you can find it.
ANother way to deal with cabinet wall resonance is again using Dynamat .
It'll make the cabinets significantly heavier, but works like crazy.

NExt on the Heresey' , I would use an aperiodic damper or 2 ( seas) on the back of the cabinet to open up the bottom end.
Thats about all I've got time for now,
Cheers...Dr Fet ... and have fun.
 
I had to sell mine............

I had a pair of Tangent 500s which were actually the Heresy IIs with an additional passive radiator. I rebuilt the entire crosover with better parts and they did sound so much better, but that still did not tame the harsh midrange. I think the Heresy IIs need a better mid driver and horn, just like the K-horns do. I used to lightly tuff a wadded up Kleenex in the Tangent midhorns throat, then I could listen to it for a while. I ended up selling my Tangent 500s and my Klipschorns because they hurt my ears. I now have a pair of KLF-20s and I'm very happy.
 
I'm using the Sure Electronics Tripath board with upgraded caps and it sounds fine driving my Heresy II's. That said, I'm betting the ST-70 with Triode Electronics boards upgrades--which I'm getting on Festivus Day!--will stomp the Sure in the "lovely musicality" sweepstakes. I have my Heresies a foot off the floor and I use a PSB subwoofer. The Heresies knock my BK-16's (with Fostex FE166E drivers and Sansui supertweeters) into the dirt. They sound very satisfying now and I expect they will sound better with a somewhat beefy tube amp.

I'll probably upgrade the Heresies' with a Crites tweeter. And I hope to snag a pair of GPA 604's eventually--but that's another topic.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom