Sansui 5000 works but no FM reception

pchilson

Active Member
Hi,

I know this subject has been broached before without closure. It may be that it can't be solved.

This is a barn find. It was full of dirt and debris from sitting for 30 years. It was stated it blew a channel and off to the barn it went. Well it may have blown a channel at one time as there is only one original output transistor remaining, the others have been changed and the original driver boards have been changed out to the F-6013 boards. Once cleaned up a bit and the switches and pots addressed the unit works in all functions except anything to do with FM.

I know nothing about FM circuitry other than to leave it alone if it is working. Well it isn't, so... I have been trying to discover the problem sporadically for about 2 weeks now and I am finally at the end of what I can comprehend.

I have printed the 5000 schematic, cut and taped the pages together so I have a good working copy. However, I have boards in my unit that are not listed in any of the 5000 model schematics or service manuals. All of these list the muting circuit board as the F-1120 and my unit uses the F-1098 muting circuit board so given that I can't be sure my working copy of the 5000 schematic is absolutely correct for my unit.

I may not find a solution to this and you guys may not be inclined to cipher it out but I'm going to try.

What I can say is all areas of the unit work as they should with the exception of the FM. All voltages given on the schematic, which are few, check out as they should. I can't find a discrepancy in the stated voltage and what I get at the given points. Mostly the schematics don't list voltages so when that is the case who knows if what I read is good or not?

I do hear static from FM with the muting off and silence with muting on. I never get any activity on the signal strength meter while in FM. The signal meter works as it should in AM. I have never seen the tuning meter as much as twitch because AM doesn't employ it and obviously there is no signal to tune in FM.

I don't know what else to try. Short of taking it to a tech or just selling it, is there anything I can test to see where in the chain the fault could lie?

Thanks for any pointers you might think of.

Attaching 3 photos of the schematic. The first is a full shot to give perspective. The second is the left (input) side of the FM and the third is the right (output) side of the FM.

1_zpsducxegwk.jpg


2_zpsvx4chl3h.jpg


3_zps6drnrajz.jpg
 
Without a RF signal generator and a scope your pretty much in the dark… IF you can find an OL SKOOL tech it shouldn't be THAT MUCH $$ to have him check it out… I have heard that the IC's are prone to failure in the FM section.

Does AM work??
 
Yes, the AM works. Every bit of the receiver works with exception of the FM services.

I have a scope but no RF sig gen.

Thanks
 
What are you using for an antenna? Make sure the 75~300 ohm switch is CLEAN & working. Is there debris in the tuning cap? AND the trimmers ? A laptop generates a fair amount of wideband HASH… park it next to the antenna.. and see if you can tune through it…... Can you post a pix of the tuner section?
 
Same problem with my 2000x

Suddenly, one day I turned it on and the FM stopped working in the same manner you described.
 
Antenna is a 3' to 4' length split like what you received with a new receiver.

The 75~300 ohm switch was really dirty and hard to operate. I used a faderlube on it and worked it and it is smooth and easy to use now.

The unit sat for about 30 yrs acording to whom I picked it up from so, yes there was lots of dust, debris, cobwebs and such but the tuner does have a cover which kept it a little more protected. See the pics.

I sat a laptop next to the antenna. It made no impact on any sounds.

Thanks for your attention.

8_zps5gngfszz.jpg


4_zpsvsspnwvp.jpg


6_zpslol5yfwf.jpg


7_zpsgkoj56lm.jpg


5_zpsgb3qrdxc.jpg
 
Bit of an update. I jumped the output of my Sherwood S-7210a's tuner and injected it into the front end of the F-1005 board at 2A, 2B and 2C and I had a radio station playing out of the Sansui.
So, it appears the problem is relegated to the F-1011 tuner on the Sansui.

I do have the listed 12vdc going into the F-1011 board.
Any tips to trace this F-1011 "board" out? Can this be the result of 30 years of dirt/dust accumulation in the barn?
I would love to know if the FM worked when this was put away but I don't.

Thanks

9_zpse5sfp6nw.jpg
 
Ok, just figured out I only have to inject into 2A and I get playback from the Sansui loud and clear. The signal meter and tuning meter working and all.
 
Ok, a little more progress. I think.
I have been working my way from output to input on the F-1011 tuner contraption. I can get full sound injecting at the base of TR101. I get nothing injecting at the gate of FET101. Does this suggest my MPF102 FET is toast?

Thanks

10_zpsff8cv5ky.jpg
 
Well just an FYI the Di Pole antenna should be in the 300 ohm position if it is in fact a factory T antenna...

Yes it could " suggest " that BUT I would bet something else is shorting...those front end boards are REALLY dirty.... do you have access to compressed air ??
 
New developments.
I ruled out the fet by subbing in another, no change. Put it back.
I clipped an alligator lead to the tuner side of that local/distance switch and spun the dial and started hearing faint changes. I finally dialed in a station at roughly the 99Mhz position on the dial face. It is very faint but there, you can tune it in and out.

So, what does this mean? Is the alignment so far out from the years of debris and dust, heat and cold along with the switch standing in the way of any signal getting through?

Thanks
 
What are you using for an antenna? Make sure the 75~300 ohm switch is CLEAN & working. Is there debris in the tuning cap? AND the trimmers ? A laptop generates a fair amount of wideband HASH… park it next to the antenna.. and see if you can tune through it…... Can you post a pix of the tuner section?

You nailed it right there vigman. You da man!

Where do I go from here now? Is this down to alignment or could I have "weak" components still lingering?
 
I remember reading somewhere that if the mpl251 fails that is located on the f-1120 board, it will act as if the muting switch has been activated.

Just a quick thought.

George.
 
Nailed it… what did I nail ( which bit ) ??
If this was mine … I would tale some LONG Q tips and alcohol and CLEAN CAREFULLY around all the IF shielded sections… WITH THE POWER OFF…
Clean 1 section at a time & test…
It's all about capacitance & reactance in these sections…
Any stray CRUD MIGHT effect that tuning.

As far as alignment goes… once it's ALL cleaned up THEN we can revisit that.

I would get a proper Di Pole antenna and check for 2 things.
1) Do MOST of the radio stations come in @ 5 on the tuning meter and sound CLEAN in mono.
2) Kick it into stereo… still clean AND does the station DRIFT over time??

Cool 1 step CLOSER !!!
 
Nailed it… what did I nail ( which bit ) ??
If this was mine … I would tale some LONG Q tips and alcohol and CLEAN CAREFULLY around all the IF shielded sections… WITH THE POWER OFF…
Clean 1 section at a time & test…
It's all about capacitance & reactance in these sections…
Any stray CRUD MIGHT effect that tuning.

As far as alignment goes… once it's ALL cleaned up THEN we can revisit that.

I would get a proper Di Pole antenna and check for 2 things.
1) Do MOST of the radio stations come in @ 5 on the tuning meter and sound CLEAN in mono.
2) Kick it into stereo… still clean AND does the station DRIFT over time??

Cool 1 step CLOSER !!!

Well, you nailed it about the local/distance switch. Once I attached antenna after the switch is when I started to receive signal.

The signal is very weak and I can only pickup one station at present. I will do the cleaning as you suggest and go from there and use a good antenna.

Thanks
 
I remember reading somewhere that if the mpl251 fails that is located on the f-1120 board, it will act as if the muting switch has been activated.

Just a quick thought.

George.

My unit doesn't have the F-1120 muting board. It is equipped with F-1098 muting board which doesn't seem to exist in the ethernet... :sigh:
 
My unit doesn't have the F-1120 muting board. It is equipped with F-1098 muting board which doesn't seem to exist in the ethernet... :sigh:

Ok, I do remember reading that they did some revisions. Darn, hoping that would have helped.

I would do as vigman has suggested and give it a good cleaning. Especially if it is grody and carrody as being a barn find. There's a good tutorial on here about cleaning the tuner cap, have to use the right cleaner, and lube in the proper points. Vigman has you going in the right direction.

Keep going, i know you'll be able to figure it out.

George.
 
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