lorne
Sonic Lizard
NOTE: I have posted a rather long and completely fresh point of view in regards to a range of Toshiba DVD players. Please see Post 51 in this thread. I have attempted to outline a number of points about the development, marketing and technical variations in these mass-market, but nevertheless interesting appliances. This post (immediately below) remains unedited despite what I now consider inaccurate due to more information and research. Lorne, Sendai, November 2, 2008.
Bear with me because I am not rambling. I hope that we can gather information and facts about the family of budget Toshiba DVD machines as STOCK units. So much has been done in the mods field that enthusiasts are beginning to ask about the genuine lineage.
I believe that the Toshiba family of cheap DVD players featuring a celebrated, attractive audio capacity is the result of an orchestrated, generational development by the manufacturers. Might we be on the edge of something interesting and special here? After all, this is a spin-off to audio from the AV craze that has hitherto subtracted interest in two-channel audio so dramatically?
Toshiba’s current low-end DVD model in Japan is the SD-270J (see below). A net search on this model will yield results numbering in the thousands. Mine had to be back-ordered as they had run out of stock. The Toshiba family of cheap DVD machines has definitely struck a chord in terms of price and function around the planet. I believe the story gets more interesting.
We have two related Toshiba DVD players in the house. They are Japanese domestic models made in Thailand. I bought the first one a year ago so my wife could watch DVDs in the family room. It's an SD-260J which appears to be the equivalent of the 3960. The chassis is plastic like the 3960 and has the same internal metal shield.
My first impressions were decidedly underwhelming. Bright, bold brassy ... ummm interesting, but I remained unconvinced and persisted with the old Sony 222ES on the same system. But Mrs Wife went with the Tosh, and a year later I tossed a CD in it ... and ... I was a new acolyte at the Toshiba shrine. Only my very worked-over NAD-502 in Lorne’s audiomania room could come up to it. And then I killed it in an accident with DC. (I will spare the embarrassing details.)
I had other (vintage) units to replace the NAD, but recently I bought a Toshiba SD-270J (the current model here) for the audiomania room. Could it be the equivalent of the European 3970? In turn could the 3970 be the equivalent of the 3980? I think so. Vinnie Rossi of Tosh mod fame has cited the 3980 as his favourite. It has an all-metal case, but more than that it is just different from the earlier models in some interesting ways. I am guessing at some of this because I have seen no pictures of the 3980’s boards.
On the surface of things, it would seem that the Toshiba boardroom lizards have been reading discussions on all the various audio forums. They have embraced a number of updates we might have asked for, albeit at a price. Duh ... we ARE talking about a $60-$70/7,000 Yen machine.
The latest SD-2XXJ/39XX rests in an all-metal chassis, except for the usual plastic bezel. The PSU PCB is now larger. Perhaps it is borrowed from a more upscale model as a lot of real estate is unfilled yet silk screened for additional or alternate components. The little transformers appear similar, but many, if not ALL the electrolytic cap values have been increased — so entirely that I am wondering if the Vinnie mods to the cap contingent are really necessary in terms of mere capacitance. One is left with ESR and more arcane matters to consider. The caps in the 270J are the standard Rubicon YK series except for the big 200V cap, which is a WA at 82uF. A polyester 22uF X2 rated cap sits on the AC lines as a filter. Much of the ribbon connecter has been replaced by a harness of 300 Volt, 1001 AWG 24 wires. What I take to be the controller chip has a separate black wire threaded around to the far side of the other board. The AC cable is still 0.75mm square, but it is housed in a more robust VCTFK insulation case. (It is annoyingly unmarked as to polarity.) The PSU is simply a new board.
Similarly the 270J/3980(?) AV board is new with 8-10 more caps (all Rubicon YK) than the 3950. The display is mounted on it as well. The big processor is a Zoran — perhaps someone can shed light on this one. The BB-1751, which I take to be the DAC in the 3950, is now a BB-1753. The op-amp is an 8 DIP JRC 4580. Someone might like to comment on whether that is an improvement. I have noted some mixed opinions around the net.
SOUND: this time I did NOT have to wait for a favourable impression. As soon as I popped a disk in it I knew I had a winner. Response from the remote was improved over the 260J, and the disks were loading into process/read much faster. The emotional magic of the earlier emanation was still evident — the very ingredient that got the rage started in the first place. The 270J may be less congested, and the sound stage appears larger in every dimension. I won’t say much more on that score, because I have had both machines on the mania-room system, and I like them both. And, the day is still young. Still, I have to be thinking that the younger unit is better.
Anyway, to tie this up and hopefully kick off some info-sharing on the STOCK Toshiba models, I’ll say this. Seldom do I get the idea that in the electronics world — in particular audio — the boardroom lizards are listening and actually making good on the feedback. But in this case they seem to have been tuned in. Here is a machine family that if anything has been enriched and developed in successive generations without losing its original charm and effectiveness. Successful families often just decline.
Sure, it is not all perfection. No one would expect that. But I am enjoying disks again — enjoying them more than ever before. Considering my current predilection for smoking anything with chip tech in it, I may leave this unit unmodded except for mechanical stuff like dampening etc. Electronically speaking, it’s good enough as is — something not always said about the original grandparent, the 3950. And I’ll be looking out for the next Tosh emanation, which I hope will remain cheaper than a single 300B tube. Keep it up Toshiba!
Over to you guys in Audio karma. Hopefully we can pool enough info to be of use in mod projects down the road. Lorne
Bear with me because I am not rambling. I hope that we can gather information and facts about the family of budget Toshiba DVD machines as STOCK units. So much has been done in the mods field that enthusiasts are beginning to ask about the genuine lineage.
I believe that the Toshiba family of cheap DVD players featuring a celebrated, attractive audio capacity is the result of an orchestrated, generational development by the manufacturers. Might we be on the edge of something interesting and special here? After all, this is a spin-off to audio from the AV craze that has hitherto subtracted interest in two-channel audio so dramatically?
Toshiba’s current low-end DVD model in Japan is the SD-270J (see below). A net search on this model will yield results numbering in the thousands. Mine had to be back-ordered as they had run out of stock. The Toshiba family of cheap DVD machines has definitely struck a chord in terms of price and function around the planet. I believe the story gets more interesting.
We have two related Toshiba DVD players in the house. They are Japanese domestic models made in Thailand. I bought the first one a year ago so my wife could watch DVDs in the family room. It's an SD-260J which appears to be the equivalent of the 3960. The chassis is plastic like the 3960 and has the same internal metal shield.
My first impressions were decidedly underwhelming. Bright, bold brassy ... ummm interesting, but I remained unconvinced and persisted with the old Sony 222ES on the same system. But Mrs Wife went with the Tosh, and a year later I tossed a CD in it ... and ... I was a new acolyte at the Toshiba shrine. Only my very worked-over NAD-502 in Lorne’s audiomania room could come up to it. And then I killed it in an accident with DC. (I will spare the embarrassing details.)
I had other (vintage) units to replace the NAD, but recently I bought a Toshiba SD-270J (the current model here) for the audiomania room. Could it be the equivalent of the European 3970? In turn could the 3970 be the equivalent of the 3980? I think so. Vinnie Rossi of Tosh mod fame has cited the 3980 as his favourite. It has an all-metal case, but more than that it is just different from the earlier models in some interesting ways. I am guessing at some of this because I have seen no pictures of the 3980’s boards.
On the surface of things, it would seem that the Toshiba boardroom lizards have been reading discussions on all the various audio forums. They have embraced a number of updates we might have asked for, albeit at a price. Duh ... we ARE talking about a $60-$70/7,000 Yen machine.
The latest SD-2XXJ/39XX rests in an all-metal chassis, except for the usual plastic bezel. The PSU PCB is now larger. Perhaps it is borrowed from a more upscale model as a lot of real estate is unfilled yet silk screened for additional or alternate components. The little transformers appear similar, but many, if not ALL the electrolytic cap values have been increased — so entirely that I am wondering if the Vinnie mods to the cap contingent are really necessary in terms of mere capacitance. One is left with ESR and more arcane matters to consider. The caps in the 270J are the standard Rubicon YK series except for the big 200V cap, which is a WA at 82uF. A polyester 22uF X2 rated cap sits on the AC lines as a filter. Much of the ribbon connecter has been replaced by a harness of 300 Volt, 1001 AWG 24 wires. What I take to be the controller chip has a separate black wire threaded around to the far side of the other board. The AC cable is still 0.75mm square, but it is housed in a more robust VCTFK insulation case. (It is annoyingly unmarked as to polarity.) The PSU is simply a new board.
Similarly the 270J/3980(?) AV board is new with 8-10 more caps (all Rubicon YK) than the 3950. The display is mounted on it as well. The big processor is a Zoran — perhaps someone can shed light on this one. The BB-1751, which I take to be the DAC in the 3950, is now a BB-1753. The op-amp is an 8 DIP JRC 4580. Someone might like to comment on whether that is an improvement. I have noted some mixed opinions around the net.
SOUND: this time I did NOT have to wait for a favourable impression. As soon as I popped a disk in it I knew I had a winner. Response from the remote was improved over the 260J, and the disks were loading into process/read much faster. The emotional magic of the earlier emanation was still evident — the very ingredient that got the rage started in the first place. The 270J may be less congested, and the sound stage appears larger in every dimension. I won’t say much more on that score, because I have had both machines on the mania-room system, and I like them both. And, the day is still young. Still, I have to be thinking that the younger unit is better.
Anyway, to tie this up and hopefully kick off some info-sharing on the STOCK Toshiba models, I’ll say this. Seldom do I get the idea that in the electronics world — in particular audio — the boardroom lizards are listening and actually making good on the feedback. But in this case they seem to have been tuned in. Here is a machine family that if anything has been enriched and developed in successive generations without losing its original charm and effectiveness. Successful families often just decline.
Sure, it is not all perfection. No one would expect that. But I am enjoying disks again — enjoying them more than ever before. Considering my current predilection for smoking anything with chip tech in it, I may leave this unit unmodded except for mechanical stuff like dampening etc. Electronically speaking, it’s good enough as is — something not always said about the original grandparent, the 3950. And I’ll be looking out for the next Tosh emanation, which I hope will remain cheaper than a single 300B tube. Keep it up Toshiba!
Over to you guys in Audio karma. Hopefully we can pool enough info to be of use in mod projects down the road. Lorne