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KENWOOD KA801 - kind request of info.

B

beppe61

Active Member
Dear Sirs,

I have the opportunity to bid for a nice Kenwwod KA801 integrated amp.
I know very little about it:
1) max power comsumption = 710W !
2) nice looking front panel. I like it very much indeed.
I would like to get some opinions about its sound in full range applications.
I intend to use it to power a pair of Dynaudio.
Does it have the separation between pre and main sections?
Is it reliable ?
I like powerful and warm sound.

Thank you so much.
Kind regards,

beppe61
 
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Hi beppe61

I have had a KA-801 from new, bought it back in 1980 for £420.
It's been very reliable, the only problem I've had was the "stereo/reverse/mono" switch which got a bit intermittent - easily fixed with some contact cleaner.

There is no seperation between the pre and power sections.

Main specifications are as follows :
Power 110W into 8 ohm, 160W into 4 ohm
Distortion 0.015%
Damping Factor 100
Frequency Response DC to 450kHz :yikes:
Signal to Noise 105dB
Weight 17.5kg

I used to use it with B&W 802 speakers, the sound quality was detailed and powerful but I would not describe it as "warm" sounding.

Hope this helps you - Richard B.
 
Dear Richard,

thank you very much for your extremely kind and valuable reply.
Let me please put other questions between the lines.

>
240 Volts said:
Hi beppe61
I have had a KA-801 from new, bought it back in 1980 for £420.
It's been very reliable,

This is indeed very important to me. The unit then should be about 25 years old. It seems in good shape from the photo.

> ... I used to use it with B&W 802 speakers, the sound quality was detailed and powerful but I would not describe it as "warm" sounding.
Hope this helps you - Richard B.
Click to expand...

I would like to ask you something more on this.
1) how was the control of the amp on the woofers? did it act as the classic iron fist in a velvet glove?
2) how good it was at reproducing sound stage? could you get some depth in the image? I know that the B&W 802 were a champion at this.

I am looking for a powerful amp but also nice with more delicate music (accurate and musical).

Thank you again.
Kind regards,

beppe61
Torino
ITALY
 
Hello Beppe61,

I will try to answer your questions, but it is quite a few years since I listened to the KA-801 through the B&W 802's (the KA-801 is now in my second system and does not get much use these days).

In my opinion the KA-801 had very good control of the woofers, it sometimes seemed as if the low frequencies were slightly attenuated but I think that this was because of the good control - there was no "booming".

As to depth of image and soundstaging, I find it very difficult to comment on these aspects of it's performance. Either I am not very sensetive to depth of image, or the kind of music I listen to is not critical in this respect - I mainly listen to Rock / Pop. Perhaps if I preferred Classical music I would be better able to answer your question. :scratch2:

One word of caution - a 25 year old amplifier may or may not prove to be reliable. I think it all depends on how it has been used and looked after. I am an electronics engineer by profession and so can do my own repair work if necessary - of course it can be extremely difficult, if not impossible, to get certain replacement parts. In the end everything depends on how much the amplifier costs and what condition it is in. :)

I hope that everything works out OK for you if you decide to buy the amplifier. :thmbsp:

Regards, Richard B.
 
Dear Mr. Richard,

thank you so much again for your very kind and helpful reply.
I will try to get a nice price on that amp.
I had the opportunity to see some photo of the inside: very impressive indeed.
Actually 25 years is quite a lot but I think that those amps were built with a high standard of quality.
Thank you very much again. :D

Kind regards,

beppe61
Torino
ITALY
 
Time to update with Mr beppe.

beppe,
I bought a Yamaha B-2 V-fet power amp about a month ago,it replaced the Kenwood M1 as the treble amp(frequencies above 800Hz) in my system.
I have to say that this amp is amazing,using it in my system was like a wind blowing away a fog to reveal a hitherto unknown landscape.There has been a lot of praise heaped upon this amp on this and other forums,and this amp deserves all the superlatives and more.The speed of this amp is out of this world,it not only resolves fine detail but makes it readily identifiable even in the midst of thunderous sounds of other instruments.
It is very revealing of the upstream components,which may work against it in some systems.It mates very well with the Kenwood M2 in my system,much better than the Kenwood M1 which seemed to have a degree of lower-mid emphasis,which added an enjoyable sense of body but was not at all accurate.
There is an increased sense of "3D",and a much better deliniation af ambience,decay of notes etc.
I just thought I'd pass this on because I know you are looking for a good amp,and this is definitely a good amp.
Good luck with your search. :thmbsp:
 
Dear Theophile,

thank you so much for your always kind and much appreciated support.
You may think I am going crazy with this search for an amp with an unusually high quality/ratio price.
Let me please reply between the lines.

>
theophile said:
beppe, I bought a Yamaha B-2 V-fet power amp about a month ago,it replaced the Kenwood M1 as the treble amp(frequencies above 800Hz) in my system.
I have to say that this amp is amazing,using it in my system was like a wind blowing away a fog to reveal a hitherto unknown landscape.
There has been a lot of praise heaped upon this amp on this and other forums,and this amp deserves all the superlatives and more.
The speed of this amp is out of this world,it not only resolves fine detail but makes it readily identifiable even in the midst of thunderous sounds of other instruments.
It is very revealing of the upstream components,which may work against it in some systems.

Thank you so much for your precious suggestion.
Unfortunately this amp is very very uncommon in Italy, much less than the M1 and M2 that appear on ebay.it sometimes.
Anyway I record your suggestion in my brain.
I have to say that currently my biggest problems are in the bass region.
I need more body, impact and control from 100 Hz down.
Can you tell me something about the Yamaha B-2's performance in the bass?
How do you rate it when used full range?
And what about the M1 and M2 used full range? which is the more balanced of the three?
I thought about the biamplification but I abandoned the idea.

> It mates very well with the Kenwood M2 in my system,much better than the Kenwood M1 which seemed to have a degree of lower-mid
emphasis,which added an enjoyable sense of body but was not at all accurate.

Very very interesting indeed.
So you mean that in a full range use the M2 could be the best option ?

> There is an increased sense of "3D",

This is a thing that always fascinate me. very difficult to achieve usually.
I would say that a system that fails in this department is a "fundamentally wrong" system.

> and a much better deliniation af ambience,decay of notes etc.
I just thought I'd pass this on because I know you are looking for a good amp,and this is definitely a good amp.
Good luck with your search. :thmbsp:
Click to expand...

Thank you very very much again.
I start to think that to find an amp really great for a full range use is not an easy task.
Actually the requirements for the bass and the high are quite different.
Iron fist with the woofers and velvet glove for the tweeters.
I remember John Curl writing that at the beginning he used biamplification with tubed amps on the mid-high frequencies and solid state on the bass.
Anyway if you have any experience of good power amps good full range and easy to find in the used market please let me know.
With the occasion I wish you wonderful listening sessions.

Kind regards,

beppe61
 
Beppe,
Unfortunately,for the last few years there hasn't been an amp I've bought which I've used full-range.I'm sufficiently intrigued by the Yamaha B-2 to look for another one to try out as a possible replacement for my Kenwood M2.That's a future project.
I don't mean to dismiss the Kenwood M1 out of hand because in my system 800Hz and up encompasses a great deal of the audible range,and I've heard the M1 sound really nice.It's just that the B-2 is in another league. :yes: I'm left wondering what two B-2s would sound like. :headscrat
Vintage is definitely the best value for money out there,and I feel you are doing the best thing by gathering as many opinions on gear that you can.
So once again I wish you good luck on your search and keep us informed of your eventual purchase. :)
 
Dear Teophile,

thank you very much again for your extremely precious advice.
On the basis of your opinions I am more and more convinced that the multi amplification is ultimately the best option.
With active crossovers 24db/octave filter slops are easily obtainable.
And I read that this is a key for a great soundstage reproduction (my ultimate goal always).
One day may be I will have such a system.
I promise to report on my final purchase.

Thank you sincerely again.

Kind regards,

beppe61
 
Beppe,

I have an impression that lots of people here on AK are enjoying their vintage gear not strictly in the "audiophile" way.

Enjoying vintage gear is also about admiring the build quality and looks, something that is hard to find in many modern gear.

But if you want top performance, you must invest some additional time and money to bring some 25+ year old amp back to its spec.

I got these KA-907s:
http://audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=49581

I need it to drive my recently restored AR98LSi speakers:
http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showpost.php?p=898076&postcount=27

I compared the big Kenwoods to my tiny Mission Cyrus 3/PSX-R combo.

Kenwoods have stronger and firmer bass, but they also have harsh treble that sounds somewhat compressed, kind of a synthetic sound that you get when listening to mp3 files.

This of course will change after the restoration.

I paid 400EUR for a KA-907, but the cost for new capacitors is 360EUR!
...I bought the best that I could find :)

I'll also replace the internal wiring with solid core silver wire in teflon insulation and stuff like that.

Ill also install new speaker binding posts, new gold plated RCA inputs, etc...

My point is that you can not expect just to get that KA-801 and immediately have a cheap but top performing amp.

Be prepared for a lot of work!!!

I also got a service manual, since I'll need it for DC and bias adjustments.

Check this link out:
http://www.amplifier.cd/Verstaerker/Kenwood/KA907_english.htm

I got my AR98 speakers for 300EUR but had invested 1200EUR (!!!) in their restoration.

But I'm extremely pleased with the result since I can not find new 1500EUR speakers that would come close to the sound quality I'm enjoying right now :)

Aleksandar

There is one KA-907 on German eBay right now:
http://cgi.ebay.de/Kenwood-KA-907-H...564148402QQcategoryZ40162QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
 
Last edited:
Dear Aleksandar,

thank you so much for your kind and very valuable reply.
At the end I bought the KA-801. I should receive it during this week. :banana:
I paid 150 euro shipping included. :thmbsp:
Let me please answer to you between the lines.

>
Kuja said:
Beppe,
I have an impression that lots of people here on AK are enjoying their vintage gear not strictly in the "audiophile" way.
Enjoying vintage gear is also about admiring the build quality and looks, something that is hard to find in many modern gear.
But if you want top performance, you must invest some additional time and money to bring some 25+ year old amp back to its spec.

I have to say honestly that I wanted to try for a very resonable money a drop of vintage sound.
In the 1979 it was near the top of the integrateds' line.

> I got these KA-907s:
http://audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=49581
I need it to drive my recently restored AR98LSi speakers:
http://www.kujucev.com/ar98ls/ar98.htm
I compared the big Kenwoods to my tiny Mission Cyrus 3/PSX-R combo.
Kenwoods have stronger and firmer bass, but they also have harsh treble that sounds somewhat compressed, kind of a synthetic sound that you get when listening to mp3 files.
This of course will change after the restoration.

Did you perform the restoration yourself?
Could you tell me which parts did you address?

> I paid 400EUR for a KA-907, but the cost for new capacitors is 360EUR!
...I bought the best that I could find :)
I'll also replace the internal wiring with solid core silver wire in teflon insulation and stuff like that.

I understand that you wanted high-end performances.
It is not the same here. Just an honest, powerful sound.

> Ill also install new speaker binding posts, new gold plated RCA inputs, etc...

Just think that I am using a 2x1,5 mmq zip cord as speakers cable!

> My point is that you can not expect just to get that KA-801 and immediately have a cheap but top performing amp.

Well for a mere 150 euro it should be a miracle.

> Be prepared for a lot of work!!!

If you mean a simple recapping maybe I could do it myself. But no much more.

> I also got a service manual, since I'll need it for DC and bias adjustments.

I will try to trace a service manual.

> Check this link out:
http://www.amplifier.cd/Verstaerker/Kenwood/KA907_english.htm
I got my AR98 speakers for 300EUR but had invested 1200EUR (!!!) in their restoration.
But I'm extremely pleased with the result since I can not find new 1500EUR speakers that would come close to the sound quality I'm enjoying right now :)

My speakers are Dynaudio 3 way. I have just add some weight (lead) to the enclosure to dampen some resonances.

> Aleksandar
> There is one KA-907 on German eBay right now:
http://cgi.ebay.de/Kenwood-KA-907-H...564148402QQcategoryZ40162QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
Click to expand...

Wait wait dear Aleksandar,
I have to receive the KA-801 yet.
This is my first adventure in the vintage field.
But all things considered I am quite optimistic and enthusiastic.
I cross my fingers.

Thank you very much again for your very kind and valuable advice. :thmbsp:

Kind regards, :D

beppe61
Torino
ITALY

P.S. nevertheless I would be very interested in knowing about your modifications on the stock KA-907.
Maybe some of them could be carried out also on the 801. :banana2:
 
Hello Beppe,

this is just to let you know how nice is to find a country fellow with my same insane passion :)
I've recently acquired a KA-7100 at a very budget price, passed him into the "recap room", carefully adjusted bias and DC-offset, changed the speaker connectors and took care to clean and shine every part outside and inside...

I can hardly describe the joy that I obtain listening to such a beauty, also from an audiophile point of view :thmbsp:

Warmest regards,
Carlo
Como, Italy
 
MeAN said:
Hello Beppe,

this is just to let you know how nice is to find a country fellow with my same insane passion :)
I've recently acquired a KA-7100 at a very budget price, passed him into the "recap room", carefully adjusted bias and DC-offset, changed the speaker connectors and took care to clean and shine every part outside and inside...

I can hardly describe the joy that I obtain listening to such a beauty, also from an audiophile point of view :thmbsp:

Warmest regards,
Carlo
Como, Italy
Click to expand...


Hello Carlo!

Welcome to AudioKArma!

Since you are already a proud owner of a KA-7100 I think you will feel at home here among many others who share your passions... although I would like to think that it is not so insane.

If you can I would encourage you to start a new thread and post a more detailed description of the modifications to your KA-7100. I would be especially interested in seeing photos of the new speaker terminals you installed.

Regards!

Henry
 
Ciao Carlo,
so we italians are at least in two here.
Let me please put some questions to you.

> QUOTE=MeAN]Hello Beppe, this is just to let you know how nice is to find a country fellow with my same insane passion :)
I've recently acquired a KA-7100 at a very budget price, passed him into the "recap room", carefully adjusted bias and DC-offset, changed the speaker connectors and took care to clean and shine every part outside and inside...

Did you do everythink by yourself? if you are not a pro, well congratulations!
I think that I have also to plan some bias and DC-offset adjusting.
The unit is 25 years old.

> I can hardly describe the joy that I obtain listening to such a beauty, also from an audiophile point of view :thmbsp:

Do you mean that the sound is good also by today standards?
Maybe the 7100 is so much better than the 801. I really do not know.
I saw some photos in ebay.de of the 801 open and I quite liked the clean lay-out.


> Warmest regards, Carlo Como, Italy[/QUOTE]

Kind regards to you Carlo

beppe61
torino
 
Henry, thank you for the warm welcome !
I've been lurking around on AK for months before I finally move to post..
I've been an avid reader of every thread in the vintage section, enjoying expecially Mr. EchoWars' knowledge.

So, to answer also Beppe's questions, I've done all by myself, but guided and inspired by a superior knowledge :D

About the differences between the 7100 and the 801.. I don't know the former, but looking at some XXX (naked) pictures, it seems to be a top class ampli, the same class of the 9100 (that btw I'm looking for to increase my collection).

Trust me when I say that the emotions of listening at these old "ladies" is only partially coming from the sound itself (which is good indeed).. it's kind a "psychoachoustic" experience :) : after you've spent some hours on a PCB for recapping, cleaning and adjusting, after you've felt the difference that your restoration has done, bringing back to life an abandoned piece of hardware... well.. how could it sound less than GREAT ?! :yes:

To Henry: I'll take care to take some shoots of the 7100 to post here in the next days.

Thank you all again,
Carlo
 
beppe61 said:
P.S. nevertheless I would be very interested in knowing about your modifications on the stock KA-907.
Maybe some of them could be carried out also on the 801. :banana2:
Click to expand...

Hello!

I'm not performing the restoration myself.
I left that to a very experienced friend of mine who does restoration & upgrade for local audiophile community.

I asked him to document every step with his digital camera and I will put up a nice web page, similar to one that I did for my AR98 speakers, but with much more detail.

There will be some additional things like bridging the large power supply caps with smaller and faster ones and stuff like that.

Your KA-801 is also a very nice amp, it is from the same lineup as my KA-907 - it was a model just below it.

So it was Kenwood's second best integrated at that time :)

I wish you much luck with your new amp!

Aleksandar
 
Last edited:
Dear Aleksandar,

thank you so much for your kind reply.
I answer hereunder.

>
Kuja said:
Hello! I'm not performing the restoration myself.
I left that to a very experienced friend of mine who does restoration & upgrade for local audiophile community.
I asked him to document every step with his digital camera and I will put up a nice web page, similar to one that I did for my AR98 speakers, but with much more detail.

I have to tell you that I would like very much to have time, space,money and above all skills to do this myself.
I like very much the idea of restoring old nice audio equipment.
It is very demanding but also fascinating.

> There will be some additional things like bridging the large power supply caps with smaller and faster ones and stuff like that.
Your KA-801 is also a very nice amp, it is from the same lineup as my KA-907 - it was a model just below it.
So it was Kenwood's second best integrated at that time :)

So it should be a really interesting unit.
I hope it works just fine.
As it is a 25 years old unit I think that some control is needed (bias, offset).
Maybe even a recapping.

I wish you much luck with your new amp!
Aleksandar
Click to expand...

Thank you very much indeed. This is very kind of you.
Anyway I have to say that reading all the good stuff about the Kenwood brand here and looking at the inside of this 801 (and also at its SR price in the 1980) I am quite optimistic.

Thank you sincerely again.
Kind regards,

beppe61
 
Dear Carlo,
buongiorno (good morning)
let me please say my opinion between the lines.

> >
MeAN said:
Henry, thank you for the warm welcome !
I've been lurking around on AK for months before I finally move to post..
I've been an avid reader of every thread in the vintage section, enjoying expecially Mr. EchoWars' knowledge.

I had the opportunity to exchange some e-mails with Mr. Echowars.
I appreciated his extremely kindness and very high competence.
If the shipping costs to Italy of these wonderful beasts (i.e. power amps) were not so high he can very well count me between his faithful customers.
His posts are full of precious technical information, advice, suggestion.
Thank you sincerely, Mr. Echowars.

> So, to answer also Beppe's questions, I've done all by myself, but guided and inspired by a superior knowledge :D

lucky you that have a tutor!
My goal is to be able to check the offset at least.
In second place the bias current.

> About the differences between the 7100 and the 801.. I don't know the former, but looking at some XXX (naked) pictures, it seems to be a top class ampli, the same class of the 9100 (that btw I'm looking for to increase my collection).

They were just those naked pictures that convinced me.
Very nice lay-out. I like order in general.
A friend of mine has a old Accuphase P-250 (that I liked very much).
The layout of these big Kenny seems a little to those of Accuphase.

> Trust me when I say that the emotions of listening at these old "ladies" is only partially coming from the sound itself (which is good indeed).. it's kind a "psychoachoustic" experience :) : after you've spent some hours on a PCB for recapping, cleaning and adjusting, after you've felt the difference that your restoration has done, bringing back to life an abandoned piece of hardware... well.. how could it sound less than GREAT ?! :yes:

I tell you that I decided for the purchasing on the basis of:
1) power supply execution
2) specifications
3) brand fame.
I hope the sound is also fine. I like clean and powerful sound.

> To Henry: I'll take care to take some shoots of the 7100 to post here in the next days.

They will be very interesting indeed. I will try to do the same.
Thank you all again,
Carlo
Click to expand...

Kind regards,

beppe61
 
So, to answer also Beppe's questions, I've done all by myself, but guided and inspired by a superior knowledge

lucky you that have a tutor!
My goal is to be able to check the offset at least.
In second place the bias current.
Click to expand...

I was really referring to EW himself! :D
He may not know this, but reading his thread about the DC offset was really illuminating... all you'll need - after carefully reading the entire thread (yes, it's LOONG) - is just the service manual of the KA801.
Unlike other brands, Kenwood (at least the 7100 and the 9100, but I've no reasons to think that the 801 has not the same facility) uses adjustment trimmers both for bias and DC offset: it's just an easy task.

About Accuphase and Kenwood, well, that's no surprise.. read this (excerpt taken from www.stereomanuals)
Accuphase Laboratories, Inc. was originally known as Kensonic Laboratories, Inc. It was founded in 1972 by Jiro Kasuga, a former Kenwood engineer who supposedly left Kenwood over conflicting design issues. He was able to recruit some engineers from other well-known audio companies and began producing high-end audio equipment. Kenwood was however, a part owner of the new company and various parts were common to both companies in the early years. Reportedly, Kenwood still owns some portion of Accuphase.

Early Kensonic units were highly praised throughout the audio community in 1973 and 1974. Some of those first units were P-300 amp, C-200 preamp, E-202 integrated amp, T-100 tuner and revised T-101 tuner. Here is PART ONE of a 1974 Basic Engineering Policy.

Kensonic started with a good reputation for quality products and that is still the case under the Accuphase name. Their products frequently remain in their lineup for many years. The Accuphase company name is derived from a combination of the "Accu" portion of the word "accurate" plus the word "phase," an important audio term. Products were distributed in Canada by MAL (Morishita & Associates Limited) till summer of 2004. Distribution in the USA and Canada is currently handled by AXISS Distribution Inc. in California.
Click to expand...

BTW.. when is your 801 expected for ?

Ciao,
Carlo
 
Dear Carlo,
thank you so much for your extremely kind and valuable reply.

>
MeAN said:
I was really referring to EW himself! :D
He may not know this, but reading his thread about the DC offset was really illuminating... all you'll need - after carefully reading the entire thread (yes, it's LOONG) -

He is really a great man. As I said very very kind and polite as well as extremely competent.
I will read carefully the thread you mention. Thank you so much.

> is just the service manual of the KA801.

I will trace it. It is very fundamental.

> Unlike other brands, Kenwood (at least the 7100 and the 9100, but I've no reasons to think that the 801 has not the same facility) uses adjustment trimmers both for bias and DC offset: it's just an easy task.

That is indeed a very nice information. I am not an expert for sure.

> About Accuphase and Kenwood, well, that's no surprise.. read this (excerpt taken from www.stereomanuals)

Well, a touch of Accuphase for just 150 euro. It would be a miracle.

> BTW.. when is your 801 expected for ?
today or tomorrow. I will report in the weekend as I am quite busy at work.

Ciao,
Carlo
Click to expand...

To the next time
Ciao
Beppe
 
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