DACs impact on older vinyl

aramirez626

aramirez626

Well-Known Member
I am recently learning more about DACs and their use. From what I understand, and obviously by their name, they convert the digital signals to analog signals which theoretically produces an analog sound. In a nutshell. I know not much more. Anything I missed?

If this is true, how does a DAC process analog vinyl recordings?
 
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A DAC is just a way to listen to digital files of music. It can also be hooked up to a CD player or other digital disc spinner to bypass the onboard DAC. If using with a computer, main benefit is to bypass low quality on-board sound cards.

If you are playing vinyl in real time, the DAC has no benefit and wouldn't be used for that. If you are playing a "needledrop", e.g. a digital recording of a record, you can use the DAC for that though it won't fix any problems the needledrop may have baked into the recording.

If you are looking for something to fix clicks and pops in real time or while the needledrop is being recorded digitally then you would want some kind of computer set up using Click Repair software or something similar, or a device like the Sugarcube.
 
Not at all. Once an analog recording is transferred to digital it is no longer an analog recording. It is simply an inferior copy because it is now another generation farther from the master recording.
 
imral3 said:
DAC stands for Digital to Analog Converter. Since vinyl is already analog, there's nothing to convert. A DAC would not be in the signal path for the playback of any analog source.
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Do you mean it would not be used, or does it need to be turned off? The newer vinyl records are digital I believe, so would they benefit from a DAC?
 
Digital source (for example: cd player via coaxial or optical digital cable / computer via usb converter ...) - DAC - Integrated amp or Pre/Power amp combo - Speakers

Turntable (vinyl) - Phono Preamp - Integrated amp or Pre/Power amp combo - Speakers.

So DAC ans Phono Preamp are not the same thing,

Best,
 
Simply it is impossible to hook turntable analogue RCA cable to DAC. DAC basically accepts only digital inputs, such as coaxial, optical, usb, hdmi ... inputs. Different stuffs
 
hugh811 said:
Simply it is impossible to hook turntable analogue RCA cable to DAC. DAC basically accepts only digital inputs, such as coaxial, optical, usb, hdmi ... inputs. Different stuffs
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Semantics make this a bit confusing.

The term "DAC" is colloquially used to describe the complete device, including its power supply, DAC chips, opamp, and other components. It is also used to refer to just the chipsets witin the DAC, which convert 1s and 0s to voltages...ie DAC chips.

In the case of the entire, integrated device, there are some which allow for analog input. From what I have seen, this application is most common in DACs that pass the converted signal into a tube buffer or provide tube amplification. Basically, it allows the user to "flavor" the analog ouput of a source device (for example, a tape player, a phono amp, or even a smartphone) with the analog circuitry of the DAC, mking it potentially more pleasing.

In such applications, the signal going into the DAC is analog, remains analog, and goes out as analog. Such DACs have separate analog-in jacks. This functionality has virtually nothing to do with digital to analog conversion...but it does indeed demonstrate the viability of analog input into a "DAC" (albeit one not being used as a DAC!).
 
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imral3 said:
Only if your CD player has digital output. Remember, a DAC only accepts DIGITAL inputs.
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Excellent point for the OP to understand.

Most digital music devices, including CD players, have their own internal DAC.

To use an external DAC, the digital music device must allow for digital output. In other words, it must allow a means of bypassing its internal DAC and instead send the digital signal to an external DAC.

Better CD players often provide both digital (coax and/or optical) and analog output. However, many (most) provide only analog output. In this case there is no way to take advantage of the assumedly better performance of an external DAC.
 
spark1 said:
Excellent point for the OP to understand.

Most digital music devices, including CD players, have their own internal DAC.

To use an external DAC, the digital music device must allow for digital output. In other words, it must allow a means of bypassing its internal DAC and instead send the digital signal to an external DAC.

Better CD players often provide both digital (coax and/or optical) and analog output. However, many (most) provide only analog output. In this case there is no way to take advantage of the assumedly better performance of an external DAC.
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My CD player has coaxial, optical and line out (RCA) connections. I have to check if it has an internal DAC. If it does, would I not benefit from an external DAC?
 
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aramirez626 said:
My CD player has coaxial, optical and line out (RCA) connections. I have to check if it has an internal DAC. If it does, would I not benefit from an external DAC?
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It definitely has an internal DAC. It converts the digital CD music to analog for the RCA outputs. If you like its sound, then don't worry about an external DAC. If you want to experiment, and maybe improve the sound, try an external DAC.
 
Your CD player certainly has its own internal DAC. Otherwise it would not be able to put out an analog signal.

Whether or not bypassing its internal DAC (and sending its digital output to an external DAC instead) will provide any benefit in sound quality depends upon the quality of the external DAC vs the internal DAC.

It is certainly NOT valid to assume that an external DAC is always better than the one inside.
 
imral3 said:
It definitely has an internal DAC. It converts the digital CD music to analog for the RCA outputs. If you like its sound, then don't worry about an external DAC. If you want to experiment, and maybe improve the sound, try an external DAC.
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My setup is in my sig:

Audio Research SP 9 Mark II
DENON POA 1500, Yamaha CDX 2020
Thorens TD 160, Nagatron 185 E Cartridge, Juicy Music Tercel II
Anthony Gallo Acoustics Nucleus Reference 3 (Ohm Walsh 2000 tall on order)
 
aramirez626 said:
My setup is in my sig:

Audio Research SP 9 Mark II
DENON POA 1500, Yamaha CDX 2020
Thorens TD 160, Nagatron 185 E Cartridge, Juicy Music Tercel II
Anthony Gallo Acoustics Nucleus Reference 3 (Ohm Walsh 2000 tall on order)
Click to expand...

OK. Nice gear.

By the way, there is nothing theoretical about the fact that a DAC puts out an analog signal...a signal which, by definition, "sounds like analog" (because it is). It will NOT sound like vinyl, as vinyl playback has its own unique characteristics.

And, as with any recording, its distance from how the music sounded in the studio or the concert venue can vary greatly, depending upon how well engineered it is, its production quality, and the quality of the playback components.
 
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