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Is there a cartridge that does the best of both?

Brett a

Brett a

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Hi
I recently bought a used Rega P2 (with Incognito wiring) that came with a Grado Gold. I'd been using an AT440MLa for the last year and, long story short, now when I am listening to the AT440MLa (which I have mounted on the P2) I miss the Grado richness and presence, and when I'm using the Grado, I miss the detail, openness and tracking ability of the MLa.

Is there a cartridge (~$200) that would work well with my P2 w/RB 250 arm that will perform like the AT 440MLa while at the same time delivering the mid/low richness of the Grado Gold?

Thanks in advance.
 
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That's a tough one. I've never heard the AT150MLX, but I've heard others sing it's praises over the 440MLa. But at $350, it should sound that much better, I guess.

I would try perhaps a vintage Shure V15 Type II or III with the Jico stylus. I've heard other AK'ers tell that it's about what you're describing. You can find one with a crap stylus fairly inexpensively, used, on auction sites. A new JICO will run you a C-note and a half or so.
 
I have a Sumiko Pearl and it does just that! Though its not quite as lush as a Grado it still has a good mid and lower band. Its a very good tracker also, so you don't have to worry too much about inner grove distortion. Heres a link to info about my thoughts and others about the Pearl, Nick
 
I would put both of my vintage carts (ADC XLM, Sonus Gold Blue) againts all the above. I believe they both do everything well.
 
I think the Denon DL-160 or the Ortofon 2M Blue might also come close. I don't know if you're going to find anything quite as luscious as the Grado.
 
Thanks for the suggestions so far. I'll do some reading.

How about the 150MLX (as was mentioned above). I wonder if that is smoother and fuller than its little brother the 440MLa
 
I had a Rega for a short time, and it had the cheap Dynavector (I forget the model, but is replaced by the 10X5 ). It sounded great.
 
ET16 said:
I had a Rega for a short time, and it had the cheap Dynavector (I forget the model, but is replaced by the 10X5 ). It sounded great.
Click to expand...
What Dynavector was it? Did it sound like the best of a Grado Gold combined with the best of an AT440MLa?
 
Brett a said:
Thanks for the suggestions so far. I'll do some reading.

How about the 150MLX (as was mentioned above). I wonder if that is smoother and fuller than its little brother the 440MLa
Click to expand...

I have the 150mlx but I've never heard the 440mla, so I can't make a direct comparison. All I can say is I've had it for at least 6 months and am only just now really liking it, after using it with my new/old Fisher and Audio Research tube preamps. On everything else I ran it with, I found it to be a tad too bright and a tad too thin sounding. I've read that this cartridge is very sensitive to load capacitance, so maybe that is what I was running into even though I always set it as low as possible if a given preamp had the option. It sounds great on the tube preamps, however.
 
secretguy said:
I would put both of my vintage carts (ADC XLM, Sonus Gold Blue) againts all the above. I believe they both do everything well.
Click to expand...

I have to agree with you. On the Rega P2 the ADC XLM MkII improved is so far the closest I've heard to the Grado followed closely by the Ortofon OM20. Both cartridges should deliver what you're looking for Brett. You can pickup NOS ADC XLM MkII and Ortofon OM20 for a little over $100.

You might ask why I want a cartridge that sounds like a Grado when I can just use a Grado? Well because the Grado hums on the P2 and it ruins the listening experience for me.

I tried the Denon DL-110 on the P2 and it sounds good but is not capable of the genuine warmth of the Grado. If I wasn't happy with the ADC or Ortofon, my next choice would have been to try the Pearl.

I'm a big Grado fan and can say I no longer miss it when listening to the XLM MkII improved on the P2.
 
If you want something that is a luscious as the Grado and yet a lot more open and detailed, well, you really have to spend a bit more than your budget....offerings from Benz, like the MC20 will get you there, an ACE even more so, so will a Grado Sonata, which has about the best sound from a Grado for the least amount of money and has exactly the qualities you are looking for...the Master and Reference are better still, but you might as well budget for a higher line table by then...

The Incoginito rewired RB250, though, will let the beauty of a decent cartridge shine through, and upgrades to the platter and subplatter can be done on the Rega table that will elevate it a bit...

But that arm will support a decent cartridge...you ought to save up and go for it...

.
 
From one P2 owner to another, just get the DL-160. Trust me, it's just a rich and detailed as the Grado (once it's run in), and it tracks like a MoFo.
 
RickB said:
The Incoginito rewired RB250, though, will let the beauty of a decent cartridge shine through, and upgrades to the platter and subplatter can be done on the Rega table that will elevate it a bit...
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Click to expand...

In addition to the Incognito wiring, My P2 also has the thick glass platter and Expressimo Heavy Weight upgraded counterweight.

I just got this rig and am curious about the sub platter upgrade in the future. But for now, I've gotta get a cart i can be happier with. :yes:

And I think my budget is capped at ~$200 for the foreseeable future.
 
2 carts were mentioned here, the Shure V15III and Sumiko Pearl. I have both, the V15 is equipped with the Jico SAS and is currently my top runner. Incidently, just this last week I remounted the Pearl to give it another listen since I haven't used it in over a year. I do like it, it has a nice midrange most of the time, decent hf although leans towards being slightly rolled off on some music. And as others have said, is slightly bloated on the bottom, but not bad. By comparison, the Shure is more neutral- it doesn't add anything nor does it remove anything from the music. It just seems to do most things right. And it always tracks flawlessly, with no hints of sibilence. I like it. Of course on your table with your amp and your speakers, the Pearl might perform better. It is however a great bargain for it's price, which is roughly the same as the SAS stylus for the V15.
 
Brett a said:
In addition to the Incognito wiring, My P2 also has the thick glass platter and Expressimo Heavy Weight upgraded counterweight.

I just got this rig and am curious about the sub platter upgrade in the future. But for now, I've gotta get a cart i can be happier with. :yes:

And I think my budget is capped at ~$200 for the foreseeable future.
Click to expand...

Well, in that case I would consider the Denon DL160 and the Benz MC20 in the low output if your preamp can handle it or the high output if it can't....

The Pearls are OK, I set up one last weekend, but not really in the same league as the Benz...

Buying a used Shure can get you a good cartridge, or you might get one with problems unrelated to the stylus, which as others have stated, is best obtained via the JICO folks....which isn't cheap...around $100.00...and you still don't know the provenance of the cart you bought...a new one has a warranty...I also have a V15III w/HE stylus and it's good and it's enjoyable, but your arm is capable of so much more...the Shure would probably work better on a different arm....

Then again, I am an unabashed moving coil aficionado...and nothing up to and including the Ortofon 2m Black and the Clearaudio Aurum Beta Woods have made me change my mind....I guess I'm just twisted that way! I actually prefer my old Linn Asak to those two...

Put as much money into a cartridge as you can afford....I've got a Benz H20 that I got used, never would have been able to afford one new, and I can tell you it smokes everything else I have by a large margin....and it walked all over the Glider I traded to get it...it really is in the league of cartridges that when you listen to it after something else you kind of just say "Oh. Now I understand." You really don't know how much better a higher level of cartridge can be until you hear one...surprised the dookie outta me! I keep it for special occasions and only mount it on my Linn when I get ready for some serious listening...the rest of the time I use the Asak...or the Sonata...or the Ortofon X-3MC...or the DL103S...or an ADC body with a ZLM stylus....or the Shure M-3D...well, you get the idea...

.
 
Brett a said:
Thanks for the suggestions so far. I'll do some reading.

How about the 150MLX (as was mentioned above). I wonder if that is smoother and fuller than its little brother the 440MLa
Click to expand...

Yes it is, but it's not a Grado. I'm with SansuiLouie, get a good used Shure V-15 III and install a JICO SAS. that's about as close to your original question as I can come :)

Howards idea of the Denon is cool, but I don't have any so far, so I can't comment. I'll get a Denon this year, but it's a ways off yet.
 
I haven't heard the DL 160 but I can tell you that the Denon DL103 sounds very very good on my Rega P3. I have used Rega Elys, Shure M97xe, AT 440 mla, Dynavector 10X4, Denon DL 103 and of those, the Dyna and the Denon are a tossup but I like the price on the DL103 a lot better than the Dyna
 
Brett a said:
Hi
I recently bought a used Rega P2 (with Incognito wiring) that came with a Grado Gold. I'd been using an AT440MLa for the last year and, long story short, now when I am listening to the AT440MLa (which I have mounted on the P2) I miss the Grado richness and presence, and when I'm using the Grado, I miss the detail, openness and tracking ability of the MLa.

Is there a cartridge (~$200) that would work well with my P2 w/RB 250 arm that will perform like the AT 440MLa while at the same time delivering the mid/low richness of the Grado Gold?

Thanks in advance.
Click to expand...

What you want pretty well describes a Grado Sonata; the only difference being that the Sonata is better in all respects than the best qualities of either mentioned cartridge. It out-Grado's the Gold on the low end, and its closer to a decent moving coil than the AT on the high end, with tons of richness and detail in the middle.

Find a dealer to listen to one, that will make the decision easy.
 
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