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Participate in AK CD vs MP3 ABX test online!

ev13wt

ev13wt

Super Member
We shall start off simple. The aim of this thread is to see if we can hear differences between the original CD quality and various levels of MP3 encoding bitrates. This thread is meant to be fun, not anything scientific or here to prove or disprove anything.


What you need: Foobar player, latest version and the plugin ABX comparator. Both are free.

First install Foobar. Then install the comparator.
Links:
Foobar: http://www.foobar2000.org/download
ABX Comparator Plugin: http://www.foobar2000.org/components/view/foo_abx

Then, download the test samples here: ZIP: http://s000.tinyupload.com/index.php?file_id=01672209526889323564

Original WAV: http://www.filedropper.com/vivaldisample
LAME MP3 103Kbit (low quality): http://www.filedropper.com/vivaldisamplemp3lamelevl6105kbit
LAME MP3 175kbps: (mid quality) http://www.filedropper.com/vivaldisamplemp3lamelevl3175kbit
LAME MP3 320kbit (highest quality): http://www.filedropper.com/vivaldisamplemp3lamelevl1320 CBR kbps
FLAC lvl1: http://www.filedropper.com/vivaldisampleflaclvl1

Update edit: More samples
Herbie Hancock River Track 2 Edith and the Kingpin SAMPLES for AK
http://s000.tinyupload.com/index.php?file_id=97712256719191631194


From user "botrytis" Here is some files to listen to - John Williams 'Bourree all Polacca' from the Baroque Album - classical guitar. This will show the differences quite well.. http://www.filedropper.com/johnwilliams


Load the Original WAV and the low quality MP3 into Foobar, select both, right click and then click "utilities" and "ABX tracks"

Settings as is, make sure you have level gain edit: "use replay gain/simple gain track" checked and DSP unchecked. Do the test with at least 10 repetitions and post the results in this thread.

ROUND 1 (EASY) // WAV vs. 105 kbps (Low quality)

foo_abx 2.0 report
foobar2000 v1.3.7
2015-02-02 21:57:15

File A: Vivaldi Sample.wav
SHA1: 8740e27fac3bbda22ecd15c57d7b9aa2b608174b
Gain adjustment: +5.10 dB
File B: Vivaldi Sample MP3 LAME levl6 105kbit.mp3
SHA1: ea10304ff649fb7940643657bc416949498da071
Gain adjustment: +5.09 dB

Output:
ASIO : ASUS Xonar ASIO driver
Crossfading: NO

21:57:15 : Test started.
21:57:25 : 01/01
21:57:34 : 02/02
21:57:42 : 03/03
21:57:51 : 04/04
21:58:00 : 05/05
21:58:08 : 06/06
21:58:15 : 07/07
21:58:24 : 08/08
21:58:31 : 09/09
21:58:39 : 10/10
21:58:39 : Test finished.

----------
Total: 10/10
Probability that you were guessing: 0.1%

-- signature --
85b712b4bd5338c26174f3dc3d024862cb1a6381


Since the background noise is quite high here right now, I will ABX the next rounds later.
 
Last edited:
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It would be interesting if more members would post their results.

I am not familiar with Foobar and don´t really know how to take the test and save the results.

I compared the WAV file to the 105kbps mp3 and I could hear a difference, albeit not that big of a difference.

I really couldn´t hear a difference between the WAV and the 175 kbps mp3.

I was only using my 30 Euro Sennheiser headset on my computer and not my main system. I think I would have heard more of a difference using my speakers.

That doesn´t say much about my audiophile ears, does it? :)
 
^^ Thanks for trying it out!

This thread is meant to calibrate peoples eats to "Night and day differences".

I, like you, need to really listen to clues to distinguish the 172 LAME to CD WAV.

Results:

foo_abx 2.0 report
foobar2000 v1.3.7
2015-02-03 14:42:28

File A: Vivaldi Sample.wav
SHA1: 8740e27fac3bbda22ecd15c57d7b9aa2b608174b
Gain adjustment: +5.10 dB
File B: Vivaldi Sample MP3 LAME levl3 175kbit.mp3
SHA1: eea1af0f7900b9d95abd8ea16a79cea0d63e5a7d
Gain adjustment: +5.10 dB

Output:
ASIO : ASUS Xonar ASIO driver
Crossfading: NO

14:42:28 : Test started.
14:43:29 : 01/01
14:44:24 : 02/02
14:44:53 : 03/03
14:45:06 : 04/04
14:45:21 : 04/05
14:45:35 : 04/06
14:45:54 : 04/07
14:46:04 : 05/08
14:46:24 : 06/09
14:46:41 : 07/10
14:46:41 : Test finished.

----------
Total: 7/10
Probability that you were guessing: 17.2%

-- signature --
cc313e41149ba302eee890dbd25f59eb26b0a37f


Pretty much already a statistical fail. I can do better if I try REALLY hard. I challenge everyone that says they can hear a difference between CD and MP3 to participate!
 
To me, 320 kbps mp3s sound fantastic. I hear absolutely no difference compared to a CD.

I think that if someone hears a difference, I think he just knows what to listen for. But does he feel that the WAV sounds BETTER than the mp3?
 
Judas Priest said:
To me, 320 kbps mp3s sound fantastic. I hear absolutely no difference compared to a CD.

I think that if someone hears a difference, I think he just knows what to listen for. But does he feel that the WAV sounds BETTER than the mp3?
Click to expand...

I've tried listening to cues such as: Positioning, noise, low level signals like rustling or noise floor differences, spatial cues (As in can I hear the hall it was recorded in?) I also tried listening to nothing; still guessing.

I even tried bumping up 16k to +20dB. Nothing. I am totally guessing.

If one of the MANY members here that say they can hear a difference actually can, they can prove it here. The signature from the posted test results will show if they are cheating or not.
 
I bought a Play Station a while back because it is said to be a very good CD player.

I tried REALLY hard to hear a difference. I just couldn´t (other than the level being lower).

Glad I´m not an audiophile :D
 
Yea, I'm pretty frustrated myself. On the Herbie tracks I am straining to even filter out the 110kbps lowest quality MP3.

These codecs have gotten much better or I just am totally deaf.

Lets see some audiophiles pass this test!
 
ev13wt said:
Yea, I'm pretty frustrated myself. On the Herbie tracks I am straining to even filter out the 110kbps lowest quality MP3.

These codecs have gotten much better or I just am totally deaf.

Lets see some audiophiles pass this test!
Click to expand...
Oh, I´m not frustrated; I´m glad!

I have been happy with my system for years and don´t have to constantly spend lots of money looking for those last few percent. Some enjoy the search, I don´t need or want it.

I enjoy my system and my music immensely!
 
Judas Priest said:
Oh, I´m not frustrated; I´m glad!

I have been happy with my system for years and don´t have to constantly spend lots of money looking for those last few percent. Some enjoy the search, I don´t need or want it.

I enjoy my system and my music immensely!
Click to expand...

Same here, for me it is about the music and good enough is good enough. But I though that it would be easier to distinguish, especially using decent headphones amd a great soundcard.
 
Ok, gave it a whirl through some Bose QC15's (tried my son's Sony NC-60's but the Bose has more HF detail).

First try 103 vs. 1411:

foo_abx 2.0 report
foobar2000 v1.3.7
2015-02-03 10:39:06

File A: Vivaldi Sample MP3 LAME levl6 105kbit.mp3
SHA1: ea10304ff649fb7940643657bc416949498da071
Gain adjustment: +5.09 dB
File B: Vivaldi Sample.wav
SHA1: 8740e27fac3bbda22ecd15c57d7b9aa2b608174b
Gain adjustment: +5.10 dB

Output:
DS : Primary Sound Driver
Crossfading: NO

10:39:06 : Test started.
10:39:21 : 01/01
10:39:29 : 02/02
10:39:38 : 03/03
10:39:47 : 04/04
10:40:01 : 05/05
10:40:11 : 06/06
10:40:17 : 07/07
10:40:24 : 08/08
10:40:32 : 09/09
10:40:45 : 10/10
10:40:45 : Test finished.

----------
Total: 10/10
Probability that you were guessing: 0.1%

-- signature --
4b802417949588c1877fa50400316f523610285b



Ok, that was pretty easy, lots of atifacts.

Next try with 176 vs. 1411:


foo_abx 2.0 report
foobar2000 v1.3.7
2015-02-03 10:57:13

File A: Vivaldi Sample MP3 LAME levl3 175kbit.mp3
SHA1: eea1af0f7900b9d95abd8ea16a79cea0d63e5a7d
Gain adjustment: +5.10 dB
File B: Vivaldi Sample.wav
SHA1: 8740e27fac3bbda22ecd15c57d7b9aa2b608174b
Gain adjustment: +5.10 dB

Output:
DS : Primary Sound Driver
Crossfading: NO

10:57:13 : Test started.
11:00:27 : 00/01
11:02:54 : 01/02
11:03:51 : 02/03
11:05:16 : 03/04
11:07:07 : 04/05
11:07:58 : 04/06
11:08:12 : 05/07
11:08:27 : 06/08
11:09:46 : 06/09
11:10:37 : 07/10
11:10:37 : Test finished.

----------
Total: 7/10
Probability that you were guessing: 17.2%

-- signature --
ca31abca3a6022bcee641b55209d4da9c5ba11d6



That was definitely harder, really had to strain and rest ears between trials. I will try 320 next, though I think I know what the result will be.
 
botrytis said:
Here is some files to listen to - John Williams 'Bourree all Polacca' from the Baroque Album - classical guitar. This will show the differences quite well..

http://www.filedropper.com/johnwilliams

uncompressed WAV, FLAC and 4 different MP3 versions.
Click to expand...

Did a little better with these files:

110 vs 1411

foo_abx 2.0 report
foobar2000 v1.3.7
2015-02-03 13:15:31

File A: 01 Bourree Alla Polacca (2).mp3
SHA1: bda4d982b30f698f7c53c315b9dc2e50ba81face
Gain adjustment: +4.27 dB
File B: 01 Bourree Alla Polacca.wav
SHA1: 8ecbd6dd2da2a58f120b6407792d1ad2b153c28f
Gain adjustment: +4.28 dB

Output:
DS : Primary Sound Driver
Crossfading: NO

13:15:31 : Test started.
13:15:50 : 01/01
13:15:54 : 02/02
13:15:58 : 03/03
13:16:02 : 04/04
13:16:06 : 05/05
13:16:14 : 06/06
13:16:17 : 07/07
13:16:21 : 08/08
13:16:25 : 09/09
13:16:31 : 10/10
13:16:31 : Test finished.

----------
Total: 10/10
Probability that you were guessing: 0.1%

-- signature --
f644e0c42874dd432edbad85849a968bc6eaeb69
Click to expand...



Easy-peasey...lots of artifacts
139 vs 1411:

foo_abx 2.0 report
foobar2000 v1.3.7
2015-02-03 13:18:28

File A: 01 Bourree Alla Polacca (1).mp3
SHA1: 4c9dcc3843b67d13d296010dd15b634b3834d509
Gain adjustment: +4.28 dB
File B: 01 Bourree Alla Polacca.wav
SHA1: 8ecbd6dd2da2a58f120b6407792d1ad2b153c28f
Gain adjustment: +4.28 dB

Output:
DS : Primary Sound Driver
Crossfading: NO

13:18:28 : Test started.
13:19:30 : 01/01
13:20:28 : 02/02
13:20:44 : 03/03
13:20:56 : 04/04
13:21:19 : 05/05
13:21:35 : 06/06
13:22:01 : 07/07
13:22:17 : 08/08
13:23:10 : 09/09
13:23:22 : 10/10
13:23:22 : Test finished.

----------
Total: 10/10
Probability that you were guessing: 0.1%

-- signature --
d7e6411a6007f59186a4c0009216811ae40a3d60
Click to expand...



...A little tougher, was actually surprised I got 100%


252 vs. 1411

foo_abx 2.0 report
foobar2000 v1.3.7
2015-02-03 13:41:04

File A: 01 Bourree Alla Polacca.mp3
SHA1: d5bc8af27b39f07aa99bac64d0538d23319d61b4
Gain adjustment: +4.28 dB
File B: 01 Bourree Alla Polacca.wav
SHA1: 8ecbd6dd2da2a58f120b6407792d1ad2b153c28f
Gain adjustment: +4.28 dB

Output:
DS : Primary Sound Driver
Crossfading: NO

13:41:04 : Test started.
13:42:12 : 00/01
13:42:23 : 01/02
13:42:48 : 01/03
13:42:58 : 01/04
13:43:26 : 02/05
13:43:38 : 03/06
13:43:59 : 03/07
13:44:12 : 04/08
13:44:24 : 05/09
13:44:41 : 06/10
13:44:41 : Test finished.

----------
Total: 6/10
Probability that you were guessing: 37.7%

-- signature --
34e5ccc70325fe96a28683284df65e8b69065c49
Click to expand...

Now, I'm straining to hear ANYTHING different, as you can see by my result!
 
botrytis said:
EXACTLY.

The ASUS is the only one that would do better than the onboard. Also, do you have foobar setup properly? Since I don't know much about foobar, in JRiver, you can tell the DSP how you want files played. Foobar is, by default, set to up convert all files based on the manual. That is why you are not seeing any difference.

Now if you were using an External DAC, etc there would be differences. Onboard soundcards max is 44.1/16-24 or 48/16-24 - so don't expect much from them.
Click to expand...

In the ABX comparator, the default setting is DSP off. Also, it makes no difference if the files get upconverted, nothing gets added where nothing can be added. ;)

All the files in this test are 44.1/16. It will be fine. You'd fail (or pass) the test similarly using any outboard DAC. But be my guest and post results!
 
Last edited:
ev13wt,
Fun test, I wanted to mention that your link the abx plug-in in the first post isn't correct.
 
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