Bi-Amp/Bi-Wiring question...

kyle01

kyle01

New Member
First off, brand spankin new on here- so hi all.

Couple questions- I fully understand Bi-wiring... maybe not so much Bi-amping. This is what I want to do, essentially bi-amp and bi-wire all at one time. Let me explain:

I have a Yamaha RX-V663 receiver that I use solely as a pre-amp. My current setup is an Adcom GFA545II 2-channel amp, one channel for each of my current floor speakers. I just picked up another Adcom, this one a GFA2535 which can run 3 or 4 channel. My intention is to run my new center channel (Polk CS20) from the bridged (200w) 3rd channel. My new mains (just ordered Polk TSi500's which are bi-wirable and will be here next week) I would like to run the bass drivers from the GFA545II and the rest of the drivers from the remaining 2 channels of the GFA2535...

Is this just cut and dry bi-amping?

I already have Legend Audio making up all the cables for me so I hope I'm not overlooking something.

Oh, I should mention- I don't intend to add any rear surround speakers or presence speakers, just a music-based 3.1 system with a lot of balls.

Thanks for looking,
Kyle
 
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the difference between the 60w from the single channel of the 2535 and the 100 from the 545,is likely to lead to quite impressive sounding bass,you might even like it,it'll certainly have balls :) ...but it's not going to be accurate,the gains will be mismatched

hopefully you have gain controls on the 545 to level things out?[i looked up power ratings but i'm not familiar with these amps]...without some way to rein in the higher power your gonna get somewhat uneven output ...but if things can be turned down to even it all up...then no problem.
 
kyle01 said:
First off, brand spankin new on here- so hi all.

Couple questions- I fully understand Bi-wiring... maybe not so much Bi-amping. This is what I want to do, essentially bi-amp and bi-wire all at one time. Let me explain:

I have a Yamaha RX-V663 receiver that I use solely as a pre-amp. My current setup is an Adcom GFA545II 2-channel amp, one channel for each of my current floor speakers. I just picked up another Adcom, this one a GFA2535 which can run 3 or 4 channel. My intention is to run my new center channel (Polk CS20) from the bridged (200w) 3rd channel. My new mains (just ordered Polk TSi500's which are bi-wirable and will be here next week) I would like to run the bass drivers from the GFA545II and the rest of the drivers from the remaining 2 channels of the GFA2535...

Is this just cut and dry bi-amping?

I already have Legend Audio making up all the cables for me so I hope I'm not overlooking something.

Oh, I should mention- I don't intend to add any rear surround speakers or presence speakers, just a music-based 3.1 system with a lot of balls.

Thanks for looking,
Kyle
Click to expand...

Quick explanation FYI ....Bi amping is using two amplifiers on one set of speakers in a horiz or vertical setup. ie; Horiz setup One amp for woofers on both speakers one amp on the mids and highs on each speaker or vertical .... two identical amps are needed, one for each speaker, each amp uses one channel for the woofers the other does the highs. The speakers need two sets of binding posts on the back to be biamped ( Bi ampable )
 
Yeah, it's biamping of a sort.

The gains of the 2535 and 545 are both listed at 27dB by Adcom so the relationship of the bass and mid/highs should work out OK within the limits of the smallest amp. However, be advised that the power of the two amps does not add so you will not have 160 watts per channel to the front left and right. The maximum real power you can claim will be about what the smallest of the two amps feeding the speaker can do.
 
the gains on the 2535 are adjustable, but not on the 545... I do have another 545 available- though I'm doubting I need it. Bi-amping is not required for me, I was just curious as my new mains come equipped for bi-wiring, and I happened to have 2 extra channels doing nothing on my 2535. If this is a bad idea- well, I've had worse!

Thanks for the input!
 
I'm not necessarily saying it's a bad idea, I'm just usually quick to point out that the power of both amps is not added in this scenario. That is a common misunderstanding and one of the top reasons people typically cite as a reason to do it.

You have the amps, so all it will cost is some speaker wire and some cables and or adapters to feed the signal to all the necessary amp inputs. Trying it will not hurt anything as long as you get the amp outputs connected properly to the speakers. Key point...don't forget to remove the jumpers on the speaker input terminals. ;)
 
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The links posted by Avionic lead to very good information, just bear in mind that info is virtually all about biamping with frequency splits before the amps and minimal in-speaker crossovers. It's generally not relevant to "biamping" where you merely connect two amps to biwirable speaker.
 
Augy said:
Quick explanation FYI ....Bi amping is using two amplifiers on one set of speakers in a horiz or vertical setup. ie; Horiz setup One amp for woofers on both speakers one amp on the mids and highs on each speaker or vertical .... two identical amps are needed, one for each speaker, each amp uses one channel for the woofers the other does the highs. The speakers need two sets of binding posts on the back to be biamped ( Bi ampable )
Click to expand...

Identical amps might be nice but are certainly not 'needed'. If you (properly) biamp and use an active crossover in the signal chain, you can many times, make any adjustments you need in the crossover to allow for different amps.

I once had a 300B SET amp plumbed into my top horns while at the same time it was mated to a Crown K2 to my woofers. So I had something like an 8 watt amp mated to a 500 watt amp??

Worked like a CHARM as long as I kept the volume within the performance window of the 300B amp.

Today, the 300B is gone and I in fact have identical K2's for each speaker.... running out of headroom is no longer a concern.

Nice to have identical amps, but not 'needed' (I'm being retentive I know)

:D
 
Difference between vertical and horizontal...

Coytee said:
Identical amps might be nice but are certainly not 'needed'. If you (properly) biamp and use an active crossover in the signal chain, you can many times, make any adjustments you need in the crossover to allow for different amps.

I once had a 300B SET amp plumbed into my top horns while at the same time it was mated to a Crown K2 to my woofers. So I had something like an 8 watt amp mated to a 500 watt amp??

Worked like a CHARM as long as I kept the volume within the performance window of the 300B amp.

Today, the 300B is gone and I in fact have identical K2's for each speaker.... running out of headroom is no longer a concern.

Nice to have identical amps, but not 'needed' (I'm being retentive I know)

:D
Click to expand...

Using two different amps the way you state is a horizontal setup in which two different amps can be used..In a vertical setup two identical amps are needed one for each speaker....Using two different amps in a vertical setup makes no sense. If you use two different amps in a vertical setup on each speaker , each speaker will have a very different sound. In a horizontal set up you can use two different amps one for woofers and the other for mids & highs as you suggested above...
 
In my case, my bi-amping would be "horizontal" I can give it a shot or I can be happy with what i've got! either way, happy guy.

Kyle
 
Give it a try....nothing to lose

kyle01 said:
In my case, my bi-amping would be "horizontal" I can give it a shot or I can be happy with what i've got! either way, happy guy.

Kyle
Click to expand...

Unless you have a single monster amp Many speakers sound better bi amped nothing to lose to try, but later , do try to get two amps with similar ratings ...ideally you want the same amount of power on each set of binding posts....
 
The reason I searched out the 2535 was for it's 3channel capability. What do others do for powering a larger center channel speaker? My center channel is not bi-wired, so using a 2channel wasnt going to help me... Did I want to find a mono amp? I can't complain I guess, the 2535 was a good deal and I'm an Adcom guy. Worst case, I will have an amp that's a little under utilized. I'm sure I can find something to do with the extra capacity.

Kyle
 
Hi,
I'm system is Creek 4330R int-amp for Highs 200Hz-20KHz & Creek A42 power amp for lows 20Hz-2000Hz, speaker Dayton III bi-wired crossover at 2000Hz this is a passive bi-amp system because the crossover is in the speakers.
IMG_1391.jpg
 
How do you know how much power you need? My speakers are biamp ready but the manual says nothing about power specifications. They are rated for 350w rms for a single amplifier, but don't mention biamp specs other than for the crossover. Do you also need an amplifier that is 4 or 6 ohm ready? If the sound isn't going through the entire speaker and is eliminating the internal crossover network and its resistance, is this necessary?
 
78_towncar_4 said:
How do you know how much power you need? My speakers are biamp ready but the manual says nothing about power specifications. They are rated for 350w rms for a single amplifier, but don't mention biamp specs other than for the crossover. Do you also need an amplifier that is 4 or 6 ohm ready? If the sound isn't going through the entire speaker and is eliminating the internal crossover network and its resistance, is this necessary?
Click to expand...

One first must be perfectly clear about the type of biamping one is talking about.

If all you're doing is removing jumpers from the speaker terminals and connecting two power amps then the power requirements of the speaker don't change at all. Connecting two 100 watt amps to the speaker in this way is still basically 100 watts to the speaker, not 200.

If you're taking about "real" biamping with frequency splits before the amp and no crossover components between the amps and drivers, then you have mostly have to look at each driver's parameters, crossover slopes, frequenices, etc. to determine how much power it can handle and the ratio of power to the various drivers that will be necessary to balance each driver to the others.
 
That is all that is required on my speaker setup. There is a post between the negative terminals.

The manual says you need a crossover at 350hz. It does not mention anything about speaker specifications.
 
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