Clash of the Titans Pt II...QLS-1 vs Model 19

CarnahanBB said:
I heard that! I really couldn't care less what the QLS has contributed to speaker design. All I really care about is that it sounds good! :yes:

Perhaps a metaphor for speakers like the QLS-1 and Model 19 would be akin to cars like the Porsche 959, Lamborghini Countach or Ferrari F40 - You can see them as the end of an era (ostentatious 80s hyper cars) or having laid the groundwork for a future generation of more refined more reliable super cars.

Is one distinct better than another? Perhaps that answer depends upon the criteria of the person posing the question?
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Agreed. If one happened to be a car and audio guy in the 70's it's a damn good thing it was an ostentatious period for the speaker manufacturers 'cause the auto industry wasn't offering up jack squat. There was practically nothing to be excited about for an entire decade if you were into performance cars....maybe the SD/HO 455 TA, 928 or 240/260/280 Z-cars. The horsepower was definitely in the audio showrooms and I can certainly testify to that having been exposed to a few of the big hitters of the era. 'Cause if there's one thing both of these designs undeniably do it's pack one hell of a sonic punch. :yes:
 
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Getting back to the 19's nuts 7 bolts.........you mentioned the terrible access under the speaker. How would you re-do this? Do you plan to have a selectable (in or out) crossover network switch? You keeping the original network + a recap or going the Z19? Durst foams for sure. Pardon my curousity here, inquiring minds want to know....btw Ms. Howel for the $$$$!! I would be her cabana boy anyday.

I know you will probably chunk those toe boards in favor of 2" x 2" solid wood and then put them on proper casters. (There is/ was a big caster/ wheel store place on 121 around the Carson Exit.) You have any cabinet finish plans?
DC
 
dc270 said:
Getting back to the 19's nuts 7 bolts.........you mentioned the terrible access under the speaker. How would you re-do this? Do you plan to have a selectable (in or out) crossover network switch? You keeping the original network + a recap or going the Z19? Durst foams for sure. Pardon my curousity here, inquiring minds want to know....btw Ms. Howel for the $$$$!! I would be her cabana boy anyday.

I know you will probably chunk those toe boards in favor of 2" x 2" solid wood and then put them on proper casters. (There is/ was a big caster/ wheel store place on 121 around the Carson Exit.) You have any cabinet finish plans?
DC
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Well Doug, I thought I'd just let you figure all that out for me! :D

If you're able to come over this weekend (Sunday sound good?) we can get all that figured out. I was hoping to bypass existing networks altogether and bridle 'em up to my Ashly active crossover so I can hit the 802's with tubes and the 416's with one of my SS beasts. The cabinets are in very good condition and could be brought back to showroom new with a light sanding and tung oil. I already have the foam to do the Durst mod.
 
Sure Michael, Sunday works for me. We can figure this out with no problem. I might suggest putting in a larger connection cup complete with proper binding posts x 4 ea to be biampable and two DPDT switches to engage or dis-engage the passive xovers. One switch per driver. You can have your cake and eat it too, switching your passiver xovers in/out would be slick!

I'll get to work on a parts list for us,
DC
 
If bi-amping the 19 keep in mind the need to mimic the EQ the speaker's own crossover supplied to depress the mids and extend the highs. If that isn't taken into account the speaker will not be voiced as intended.
 
Tom Brennan said:
The 19 is based on motion picture theater speaker technology, not simply public address. High fidelity was born in the picture business.

There's a great deal of refinement in the Altec drivers and crossovers, as I've already explained. If you don't think a woofer with a short 3" edgewound coil running in a long gap is a refined driver I have to wonder how you define refinement. I fear you confuse complication with sophistication.

In any event what are your impressions of the actual sound of the speakers involved?
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Tom,

A violin is a simple yet it can be refined. An organ is complex yet it can be refined... I am not the one who thinks of complexity as refinement by default, it was solely your train of thought. I never said having 9 tweeters vs single compression driver makes the QLS refined. But strangely it is what you keep struggling with. If a manufacturer keeps tweaking their product for decades he is refining the product. However, their success at it measured by your index value for level of refinement is just time itself? :scratch2:

Here's how I see it.

Each of these compared speakers is somewhat a culmination of manufacturers work in its own way (its why we name them Titans). Only common ground to compare performance of two different concepts and builds is by comparing the end result - their performance by specs. Everything else is fan cheerleading. :D

OP is doing the listening and I am checking out the specs. The numbers shout to me clearly the Infinity is in a different league. Listening to them playing is just a subjective personal preference that cannot be used as a common ground for performance discussion. Which I thought we were doing here while the OP enjoys the listening. One does not debate over personal "taste". We just share the experience of "I like what I like".

When I say the Infinity QLS-1 is a more refined speaker for audiophile everyday listening :yes: compared to the Altec Model 19, I am looking at their measurable performance and design concept and interpreting it.

What the OP ends up preferring is fine by me. Sometimes you hear the performance and sometimes you hear the character and one of them inside you wins eventually. This is also mixed with precognition and history of brand preference. I am a Tannoy fan and the sheer brand name in a comparison of its models with other manufacturers will give me the edge for the final stretch. Its been tested, its been proven, science went inside your brain and knows why you prefer Coke over Pepsi. The brain isn't a mystery if you read the book. Read the specs Tom.

Remove the Altec sticker from the Model 19s and they are out of this race IMO. :thmbsp:
 
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I wish I used that slab of text for discussing the actual speakers and not explaining what I meant to Brenan. But hey... you gotta do what you gotta do.

My apologies to the OP.
 
Pandovski said:
Tom,

A violin is a simple yet it can be refined. An organ is complex yet it can be refined... I am not the one who thinks of complexity as refinement by default, it was solely your train of thought. I never said having 9 tweeters vs single compression driver makes the QLS refined. But strangely it is what you keep struggling with. If a manufacturer keeps tweaking their product for decades he is refining the product. However, their success at it measured by your index value for level of refinement is just time itself? :scratch2:

Here's how I see it.

Each of these compared speakers is somewhat a culmination of manufacturers work in its own way (its why we name them Titans). Only common ground to compare performance of two different concepts and builds is by comparing the end result - their performance by specs. Everything else is fan cheerleading. :D

OP is doing his own the listening and I am checking out the specs. The numbers shout to me clearly the Infinity is in a different league. Listening to them playing is just a subjective personal preference that cannot be used as a common ground for performance discussion. Which I thought we were doing here while the OP enjoys the listening. One does not debate over personal "taste". We just share the experience of "I like what I like".

When I say the Infinity QLS-1 is a more refined speaker for audiophile everyday listening :yes: compared to the Altec Model 19, I am looking at their measurable performance and design concept and interpreting it.

What the OP ends up preferring is fine by me. Sometimes you hear the performance and sometimes you hear the character and one of them inside you wins eventually. This is also mixed with precognition and history of brand preference. I am a Tannoy fan and the sheer brand name in a comparison of its models with other manufacturers will give me the edge for the final stretch. Its been tested, its been proven, science went inside your brain and knows why you prefer Coke over Pepsi. The brain isn't a mystery if you read the book. Read the specs Tom.

Remove the Altec sticker from the Model 19s and they are out of this race IMO. :thmbsp:
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Tom, the floor is yours.
 
Pandovski said:
I wish I used that slab of text for discussing the actual speakers and not explaining what I meant to Brenan. But hey... you gotta do what you gotta do.

My apologies to the OP.
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No apology necessary. It's a discussion forum......

.....and I'm looking forward to the discussion that follows. :D
 
Pandovski said:
...Listening to them playing is just a subjective personal preference that cannot be used as a common ground for performance discussion...One does not debate over personal "taste". We just share the experience of "I like what I like"...
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:yes: :thmbsp:
 
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