Dolby sucks! Waitaminute... does it? (confessions of a convert)

T

tourmax

Super Member
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Dolby seems to be a pretty polarizing subject. I'm not trying to start anything nor get into a highly technical discussion over what Dolby is and isn't (or should that be "was and wasn't"?), just relating my life arc with the format.

Back when Dolby was "a thing", I was young and the predominant medium was compact cassette. Like most of us when we are young (and dumb) I just popped a cassette into a deck and then turned Dolby on or off. I didn't really understand much about it other than I didn't like what I heard and I ended up in pretty firmly in the "Dolby sucks" camp for a long time. Actually, I stayed there up until fairly recently.

What started my Dolby "renaissance" was a format you wouldn't normally associate with Dolby: 8 track. A Superscope TDR830 to be precise:

fr_5838.jpg

I collect 8 track as a curiosity and a bit of a nostalgia item. We had one in the console stereo in the house and dad had them in his cars.

I'm also a RUSH collector and recently acquired some carts that were Dolby encoded.

One day, I popped in "A Farewell to Kings":

fr_5830_size1024.jpg

Sounded good, considering the format's limitations. It's recorded with Dolby and the TDR does Dolby, so I pushed the button and......what?!? This is 8 track? It sounded damned good! Better than any 8 track I've ever heard. Little bump on the EQ and some processing in the 482i and it sounds damned good! Not "CD good", but about as close as I've ever heard 8 track get to "CD good".

Then, picked up a Wollensak 8075 some time later:

fr_5887.jpg

If you know 8 track, the 8075 is the top dog. The TDR830 is up there on the top shelf with the others for 8 track players, but the 8075 is "The King" for the format.

After a rebuild, in goes Farewell to Kings. Sounded good. Then flipped the dolby on and again; tape went from "Well, it's 8 track, what do you expect?" to "that's wonderful!"

In both cases, there was a noticeable drop in tape noise/hiss. Enough that I had to strain to pick it out.

OK, lets do compact cassette.

My main deck is a simple Pioneer CT-F750:

fr_4597.jpg

Circa approx 1982. It's been gone through in terms of azimuth and calibration, although it could use a recap in a few areas (most notably the power section). But it does Dolby. Pop in a "regular" tape and sure enough, the Dolby issues I remember from my youthful introduction to it that turned me off were still there. Went through my clutch of tapes and pulled out a "recorded with Dolby" tape, CrO2 as well. Popped it in and yep, sounded good. Flipped Dolby on and while it wasn't as dramatic as the 8 track, there was a definite reducing oin tape noise and it all just became...."clearer".

Alright, that's 3 for 3.

What about Reel to Reel:

fr_6060.jpg

I only have one: an Akai 4000DB. Running at 7.5ips and Dolby off, it sounds good. Now, that's on it's own recorded tapes. I make a recording with Dolby on and play it back. Yep, it is quieter. But it's far less of a difference from 8 track and Compact cassette. Makes sense with the wider tracks on the the tape and the higher IPS, but the improvement (even if incremental) is still there.

So yeah, I'm a Dolby convert. At least for tape formats. I didn't really understand it when I was young that you need the right gear and recordings but now, it seems worth it to me. enough so that i won't buy tape gear anymore hat doesn't have Dolby implemented.

Toss in a little EQ and some processing and tape becomes a very enjoyable format for me now rather than something I used to just accept because it was the only option for "portable".

Kinda enjoyable to sink back into the Eames chair and listen to music on tape now. It's a nice change from vinyl or digital listening.

Now I'm on the hunt for the tapes/equipment I need to learn how to properly calibrate the Dolby circuits in my various machines.....great, one more thing to sink my bucks into...lol!

:)
 
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Interesting and, thanks for the tests !
For my part I was and still am as you were: against Dolby
:)

My decks back then were B and C compatible.
Even if I do admit the noise reduction when recorded with and played with Dolby, I also notice a huge drop in high frequencies.

So, to my ears, even now, of course the sound is "better" as it doesn't come with that background noise anymore.
But loosing high frequencies is even more annoying to me.

I have a "Nak", not a Dragon, and I still use it without any Dolby...

That Dolby processing is in fact what made me buy my first DAT in 1991.
And, THAT was a different world :-)
 
parman said:
Wasn't that CT-F750 near the top for Pioneer?
Click to expand...
Don’t know, couldn’t tell ya.

I picked it up because it is a “blueline” model, has the piano key style action and the transport is all mechanical. As far as plastic parts go, this one has some, but its pretty minimal, which is another thing that made it appealing to me (ie: fewer plastic bits to age and crack/break).

ToTL ones were the 900/1000/1250’s, etc and had servo action and three heads.

750 is a two head autoreverse deck.
 
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If you like Dolby, you should try dbx!

I used it exclusively back when tape was the dominant way to record stuff. I think it beats Dolby hands down but the tapes really can’t be listened to without decoding.
Dolby B is pretty tame and most of us have used the B button as a treble control in our mediocre car decks…
It does help noticeably with 3 3/4 ips speed on the RTR. Though for me why ever record a tape slow in 2026? At 7 1/2 ips I don’t use NR.
In fact I don’t use any NR on any new recordings I make.
I figure that today maximum compatibility with different decks is best on all my tape formats. Doesn’t hurt that tinnitus really overwhelms the tape hiss anyway.
I use the right NR decoding for the tape but don’t add any anymore.
Part of the reason is that all the NR systems amplify the frequency response errors of the tape upon decoding.

That said, the old tapes I made with dbx on my Teac V850X back in the ’80’s sure sound good played back on the same deck!!
 
tourmax said:
Don’t know, couldn’t tell ya.

I picked it up because it is a “blueline” model, has the piano key style action and the transport is all mechanical. As far as plastic parts go, this one has some, but its pretty minimal, which is another thing that made it appealing to me (ie: fewer plastic bits to age and crack/break).

ToTL ones were the 900/1000/1250’s, etc and had servo action and three heads.

750 is a two head autoreverse deck.
Click to expand...
So perusing some catalogs from 80/81, it seems the CT-F750 is teh first of the CT-F series and it goes up from there. IE; 850, 950, and 1250 the top dog.

So the 750 appears to be "the bottom of the top".

;)

I'm guessing the "F" denotes the "Fluororscan" display, which was the upper end pioneer stuff at the time.
 
If you experience a loss of highs in a tape you record, using Dolby, COMPARED TO THE SOURCE, then there is something wrong with either the calibration or alignment of your deck. Obviously, there is a loss of highs heard when switching Dolby in on playback. There better be, as that is the whole point. Reduce the upper spectrum of recorded music BACK to where it is supposed to be, and reduce hiss the same amount. I calibrate tons of tape decks (mostly Nakamichi) and I can absolutely verify that there is zero loss of HFs through 20kHz with Dolby, when properly aligned and calibrated.

Prerecorded tapes, especially CrO2, lose level and HF over time, so they probably do sound better than with Dolby off. But most times, as the OP stated, you are better off using Dolby, then adjusting the highs with tone or eq controls. Better tone & eq are active in a range above the general frequency of hiss, so you return the music highs and leave the hiss behind. But it seems that most people with good gear refuse to use tone or eq as it is some sort of admission that their gear has HF lacking, instead of using it to get the best sound they want out of it.
 
Never thought much about Dolby when first using it on cassettes. Dolby B offered a useful reduction in tape hiss. Dolby C went further, but playing them on a deck without any Dolby, they sounded too weird. Dolby B tapes could be made passable by turning down the treble. This was back before Walkmans and car stereos had Dolby, or before I could afford the Dolby units.
 
The only cassette deck that I have that worked well with Dolby was my NAK cassette deck 1.5, recording on that deck with Dolby B or C seemed to work well. Unfortunately, the belts are now shot. Otherwise, on the other decks that I have used, Dolby never seemed to sound that good. I did like the sound of JVC's proprietary noise reduction circuit better. The best tape noise reduction unit that I always use is my DAK 1, which is a renamed DBX SNR 1, and it works great on all tapes.
 
Elite-ist said:
I believe the 'F' prefix in Pioneer casssette decks means front load.

Nando.
Click to expand...
I dunno about that.

In the 1980 Pioneer catalog, the four fluoroscan models are designated “CT-F”, the three non-fluoroscan models (some type of led of VFD display I believe) are designated “CT”.

All 7 are “front load”. The CT-F’s are open transport and the CT’s are the more “period common” front loading doors.

Seems to me that would indicate the “F” is for “Fluoroscan”. But I’m certainly not the authority on “all things Pioneer” by any means….

:dunno:


For example:

Untitled-1 copy.jpg
 
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If you are using a deck, (not a NAK), and it sounds overly muffled while using Dolby B Noise Reduction, it's almost always a problem with the alignment of the head. Usually a pretty simple adjustment.
 
The belts & service in a Nak Cassette Deck 1.5 is a pretty straightforward one. Not hard at all.

But it would benefit from the mode motor solder fix, which is a bit more involved.
 
Dolby is great if it's properly calibrated to the tape you're recording on. The problem with it was that the vast majority of consumer cassette decks didn't come with calibration tapes, tone generators and user-adjustable controls.
 
tourmax said:
Don’t know, couldn’t tell ya.

I picked it up because it is a “blueline” model, has the piano key style action and the transport is all mechanical. As far as plastic parts go, this one has some, but its pretty minimal, which is another thing that made it appealing to me (ie: fewer plastic bits to age and crack/break).

ToTL ones were the 900/1000/1250’s, etc and had servo action and three heads.

750 is a two head autoreverse deck.
Click to expand...

No, that particular 750 was not. It's a piano key deck, all the good pioneer decks of that era were solenoid actuated decks. Here's a list from the top of my head:

Ultra ToTL, quartz-locked capstan speed, 3-head, 2-motor direct-drive decks. However, these have heads that wear dramatically and it's hard to find one with good heads. They're stupid expensive even with knackered heads. (I just bought a Phase Linear version of the CT-A1 for $1500, mostly not working.)
CT-A1(holy grail) Pioneer version is black with white and red VFD. Also sold silver-faced as "Phase Linear Series II Model 7000". Includes auto biasing circuitry.
CT-F1250 - includes bias and level controls with test tones and indicators so you're not just adjusting by ear.

One step down, but still ToTL. No quartz lock. Still 3 heads and 2 motors. Simple one-knob bias control with no tones or meters. Includes time start and repeat functions.
CT-F900 (CrO2, FeCR)
CT-F950 (adds metal)
CT-910 (This is a 900 with white and red VFD instead of blue. Rare.)
CT-920 (This is a 950 with white and red VFD instead of blue. Rare.)

One further step down. Still 3 heads and 2 motors. Exactly the same transport and heads as the two decks above, without timer start and repeat features. Solid pushbuttons instead of soft-touch buttons, but still a solenoid-actuated deck. I actually prefer these, as they're not as tall, the simplified circuitry gives me some peace of mind, and the pushbuttons are very satisfying to mash compared to the tiny dainty buttons on the above decks. They're also far cheaper on the 'bay.
CT-F800 (CrO2, FeCR)
CT-F850 (adds metal)
CT-710 (This is an 800 with white and red VFD instead of blue. Rare.)
CT-720*** (This is an 850 with white and red VFD instead of blue. Rare.)

Do note that all of the above decks of all 3 series have issues with the takeup reel motor. The motor needs to be disassembled and cleaned and then run in correctly. It's very easy to ruin these motors while disassembling them too.

2-head, 1-motor piano key decks. Different transport entirely. Not bad, but older-tech budget models and not TOTL. As above, the x50 models add metal capability.
CT-F600
CT-F650
CT-F750 - this is an auto-reverse deck.

Interestingly enough, Pioneer also made budget solenoid actuated decks with florouscan. They're 2-head 1-motor of course. These are still decent decks, sporting a simplified motherboard and fewer components compared to the ToTL units. Most model numbers drop the "F". These are very short decks, so may fit your stack better. All have tall skinny buttons. These match the later SA-710 integrated amps and TX-710 tuners. I would prefer one of these over the piano key decks. Note, all of these have metal capability regardless of model number. There may be a few more of these than I have listed, I'm not super familiar with this series of decks.
CT-200
CT-300* (mark II)
CT-400 (world) / CT-615 (US)
CT-520 (adds track seeking to the 400)
CT-F550* (mark II, and the only one in this series still sporting the "F" designation. This is just a CT-300).
CT-550** (not CT-F550) - technically part of this lineage, but they changed the blue display to green and added a bunch of dark gray plastic to the face.
CT-720*** This version of the CT-720 has the tall skinny buttons, 2-heads, and auto-reverse.

*Mark I's had regular VU meters. Pioneer changed the style without changing the model number for some reason.
**The green display was just a color filter; You can easily convert it to blue by removing the green filter and using a blue flash gel cut to size.
***There are two versions of this deck with the same model number.

Charlie.
 
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So that's the Pioneer decks. Now for Dolby....

Dolby is great in decks from the late 80s through the 90s. Once Dolby was put on a single chip, it just always worked and worked WELL at that. But before that, Dolby circuits were all individual components and subject to drift. ANY old Pioneer with discreet component dolby circuits has sounded like utter crap until calibration. And the calibration is not for the layman, it's very difficult, the manuals assume you took all the Pioneer training classes and have expert-level tech knowledge, and they're also flat-out wrong in many places.
 
Bradbrews said:
If you like Dolby, you should try dbx!

I used it exclusively back when tape was the dominant way to record stuff. I think it beats Dolby hands down but the tapes really can’t be listened to without decoding.
Dolby B is pretty tame and most of us have used the B button as a treble control in our mediocre car decks…
It does help noticeably with 3 3/4 ips speed on the RTR. Though for me why ever record a tape slow in 2026? At 7 1/2 ips I don’t use NR.
In fact I don’t use any NR on any new recordings I make.
I figure that today maximum compatibility with different decks is best on all my tape formats. Doesn’t hurt that tinnitus really overwhelms the tape hiss anyway.
I use the right NR decoding for the tape but don’t add any anymore.
Part of the reason is that all the NR systems amplify the frequency response errors of the tape upon decoding.

That said, the old tapes I made with dbx on my Teac V850X back in the ’80’s sure sound good played back on the same deck!!
Click to expand...

If you like DBX, you should try the Phase Linear Series II Model 1000 Auto-Correlator and/or 1300 Noise Reduction System. Unlike DBX, these units are single-ended. The 1000 includes a range expander and is rack-mountable. The 1300 is much smaller and contains only the noise reduction system. These are both extremely effective at reducing tape hiss without touching the highs. They work like magic. My RT-909 when played back at 19cm/s through these systems has zero hiss, even playing back commercially recorded tapes. With Dolby on my 1990s Aiwa, Sanyo, and Nakamichi cassette decks have zero hiss when Dolby B is used through the 1000 or 1300 units. My Pioneer CT-F950 and Kenwood KX2060 do have some hiss still, but they were always hissier than 90s decks and they both need a calibration.

Truly those 1000 and 1300 (and later 1300AV) units are wonderful. Maybe technically not as good as DBX, but they work for any source, and don't require special encoding. I have a 1000 on my EQ loop in my basement Phase Linear stack and two 1300s on my main system connected to the RT-909, CT-F950, and KX-2060. I don't have an EQ loop in that system, but each 1000/1300 has a main and tape monitor input so two decks can be attached to each device. And the 1300s are cheap, under $100 on the 'bay.

Charlie.
 
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