Full Range Speaker with decent bass?

J

JVB

New Member
I currently listen primarily to Vandersteen 2C's , Sansui SP300 , DCM Time Windows, and B&W 601 s2.
I mostly listen to jazz vocalists and blues. Very happy with all the speakers,I enjoy variety, they are scattered about the house with the 2C's in the main listening room.
I enjoy wood working and cabinet making, and have rebuilt / repaired many speakers.
I would like to build a nice looking pair of floor standing speakers and am intrigued with the hype
over "Full Range" speakers, however the more research I do the more it seem's that most who
build them love the mid-range but feel it neccessary to add for base and then somehow compensate
for the highs being too bright.
I don't want over done base , and even being old with ears to match, I don't like overly bright.
Should I just pick a good two or three way design or multi speaker TML and call it a day, or is
there a FR diy system with decent bass that won't hurt my ears on the top end?
Cost wise under $1000, just looking for building fun that I could enjoy listening to.
Thanks for any suggestions.
J
 
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I recently got some 12" Tannoy HPD's which I ported. My room is all wood. With the Energy level turned down on the crossovers the bass is very good, not too little or too much.
 
JVB said:
I currently listen primarily to Vandersteen 2C's , Sansui SP300 , DCM Time Windows, and B&W 601 s2.
I mostly listen to jazz vocalists and blues. Very happy with all the speakers,I enjoy variety, they are scattered about the house with the 2C's in the main listening room.
I enjoy wood working and cabinet making, and have rebuilt / repaired many speakers.
I would like to build a nice looking pair of floor standing speakers and am intrigued with the hype
over "Full Range" speakers, however the more research I do the more it seem's that most who
build them love the mid-range but feel it neccessary to add for base and then somehow compensate
for the highs being too bright.
I don't want over done base , and even being old with ears to match, I don't like overly bright.
Should I just pick a good two or three way design or multi speaker TML and call it a day, or is
there a FR diy system with decent bass that won't hurt my ears on the top end?
Cost wise under $1000, just looking for building fun that I could enjoy listening to.
Thanks for any suggestions.
J
Click to expand...

Well, I have to recommend the Monitor Audio RS6 or RS8. I did a review and a popular YouTube audio guy did a review. I think they could be your answer:

https://reddit.com/r/audiophile/comments/e9cse7/monitor_audio_rs6_silver_speakers_absurd/

 
lattiboy- thanks for reply but I want to build not just go out and buy another pair, have heard audio mo itor speakers agree that they sound nice

70's Rockfan - those look very nice and shouldn't be too hard too build, but way too many drivers for me, cant imagine the crossovers involved, really was hoping to get steered towards a Full Range speaker ( as in single speaker system) that had good base and wasn't overly
bright. I'm guessing this won't be your first speaker build.
 
Rockfan , those look awesome , your woodworking looks top notch. What drivers did you use
and are you happy with the results?
 
Tom, you are correct. My dilemma is that I have done a lot of looking and reading and as I said in the original post , seems like
most people are happy with many different single FR builds excepting they want more base and so add a sub and or
fiddle around trying to tame highs. I was leaning towards putting a 6-8" FR (Audio Nirvana, Mark Audio, Fostex ) in a quarter wave or TL cabinet but having several TL's (Time Frame 500's, and Time Windows) I am aware of how that design can muddy the waters a bit , very evident when A / B ing against some other speakers I have.
 
@JVB:
If you are a fan of jazz & don't need chest pounding bass and ear bleed SPLs, then you may find some single full range drivers interesting.

I suggest you avoid ones w/ whizzer cones; many find them unpleasant, although some can be good if handled properly.

For a very modestly priced project, you might enjoy the Frugal Horn XL using Mark Audio pair 10.3 drivers. But there are a host of caveats about dealing with the A10.3--I would be happy to provide advice if you choose to go this route. They are very fragile and easily destroyed. Break in is crucial, requiring great patience and care--expect them to really come into their own by 1000 hrs. (I know this as I have a pair of A10.3 in Bigger Is Better tapped horns.). If you want to get an idea of how the driver sounds before you start making saw dust (and to get a jump on break-in), put the A10.3 in 0.25 ft^3 sealed cardboard boxes.

For a bit more SPL, less fragility, and a slightly larger foot print, you might look at Fostex FF225wk drivers (which I used in one of my best builds, but note that I supplement with a super tweeter, as those drivers drop off around 8KHz). If you do a search on: "Pappa's TL DIYaudio" you should come up with my thread on this build. It's on another audio website which will require you to register and login in oder to see the images.

Cheers, Jim
 
JVB said:
Tom, you are correct. My dilemma is that I have done a lot of looking and reading and as I said in the original post , seems like
most people are happy with many different single FR builds excepting they want more base and so add a sub and or
fiddle around trying to tame highs.
Click to expand...

Well, I can't help much; it's been years since I played around with single drivers and I'm way out of the loop. The last things I played with were some 5" Tang Bands with bamboo paper cones that I put in Red Wing boot boxes and used with a sub. They sounded pretty nice.

An easy build that IMO sounds really good is an old EV Wolverine 12" fullrange mounted on an open baffle. For some reason that speaker makes a nice robust bass on an open baffle and IMO no sub is needed. A guy in our old Chicago Horn Club built a pair on plexiglass baffles about, oh, 4 feet high and 2 feet wide? Something like that. They sounded very smooth---no raspiness. Nice tone.
 
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Thanks Jim, I'll check it out, my taste is Jimmy Vaughn, Buddy Guy, Saraugh Vaughn, Georgie Fame, Jane Monheit, the loud rock
days are a blur in the back view mirror ...
 
Are large drivers not to be considered?
I have some E/V SP15b in E/V Empire cabinets, the top end is "not" adequate. This is not an acceptable full range speaker. E/V said yes, but no, it's not. I had to add the horns
I also have E/V LS12a in a Knight 1280 cabinets. This one performs very well. E/V says it's 40 to 14000 Hz in a 3 cubic feet vented cabinet. Maybe it is. The tonal balance is good. The treble is not bright or dull, the bass is not heavy or lean, the midrange lacks coloration or "apparent" peaks or dips. The result is a speaker that reproduces voices and acoustic (and some other) music very well, but not organ. Sensitivity is very high.
When I compare it to other speakers in the room, some go higher, some go lower, some go louder. But I use this pair the most. I think it "is" a full range speaker.
The Knight-E/V LS12a.
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The other speakers.
P4180005.JPG P4180006.JPG
 
The URIE/JBL 803 duplex IMO is a very good full range driver. These can be had in very good condition used well within your budget. The URIE 809 studio monitor is loaded with these drivers. Along with a heck of a time aligned crossover circuit with gain and contour controls. JBL specs for these monitors are 50Hz - 17.5KHz + - 3db in a smallish 23 x 16.5 x 13.5 cabinet.

This driver is very closely related to the 12 inch driver in the JBL 4425. This slightly lower tuned cabinet achieved 40Hz on bottom.

I say pick up a pair of the URIE 809 monitors in good shape used. Build yourself a nice pair of cabinets of similar dimensions to the 4425 and enjoy.
 
JVB said:
Rockfan , those look awesome , your woodworking looks top notch. What drivers did you use
and are you happy with the results?
Click to expand...
Thanks
I had a pair of Sony speakers I wasn't using so I pulled
the drivers and crossovers out of them and put in the clones.
I did not intend for them to stay in but they sound so good I
have just left them that way.
 
Some Lowther PM 6s in back loaded horns or perhaps in tapered quarter wave pipes might be the ticket.
On the other hand, if you are willing to use a subwoofer, or if you intend to already, there are a host of small drivers that can get up fairly high, and down low enough that the subwoofer can mate easily. I've had a pair of CTS 5 inch drivers in TQWPs with a little Kenwood powered sub that sound much better than the five or ten bucks I have in them (all the wood for the cabinets came from the dump, the drivers from a homebrew Bose 901 clone, and the sub cost five at a garage sale). But at a way higher price, the Jordan Watts module might blow you away. I think Pete Basel has a bunch of them.
Going farther, you can get many of the benefits of a full range driver, and get around many of the problems, by using a full range driver and a sub and supertweeters. The EMI ellipticals and the Bozak 8 inch mid/woofer then become contenders, as do a bunch of other drivers that are very reasonably priced - EVs and Universites come to mind, and even several JBLs.
 
Tom Brennan said:
The Urei driver isn't a full range one as the term is currently understood among single driver enthusiasts; rather it is a 2 drivers on a common chassis with the tweeter mounted coaxially to the woofer, like an Altec 604 (which was used in many Ureis) or 605 Duplex or a Tannoy Dual Concentric.

Regards
Click to expand...

Ah ok thought coaxial or duplex was still considered full range. Well hope the OP finds what he is looking for.
 
Using multiple tweeters is a mistake unless the centers are very close together and the travel distance to your ears are the same.
 
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