Is this the end of vinyl, again?

With the appropriate sample rate and depth a signal can be faithfully reconstructed. This is the old "stair step" argument, which is false. If you "coarsen", or reduce, the sampling frequency you lower the highest frequency you can capture. Regardless, no amplification device, transducer, EQ or reverse-EQ is perfect, so really all reproduced sound is an approximation to some degree.

To the topic, almost assuredly the vinyl resurgence is a fad. No idea how long it'll last, and certainly a number folks will stick with it after it ends, growing the core niche. Enjoy it while it's here.
 
JP said:
With the appropriate sample rate and depth a signal can be faithfully reconstructed. This is the old "stair step" argument, which is false. If you "coarsen", or reduce, the sampling frequency you lower the highest frequency you can capture. Regardless, no amplification device, transducer, EQ or reverse-EQ is perfect, so really all reproduced sound is an approximation to some degree.
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The reality is you can't recreate or recapture missed events or detail through interpolation. Bandwidth-limiting is a punt that preemptively destroys data (events) so that they don't get "missed". Even if your sampling rate was sufficient for the frequencies involved quantization error would wipe out detail along the amplitude axis.
 
Happy to continue this discussion in a different thread - I don't want to drive this one further off topic.
 
loopstick said:
The reality is you can't recreate or recapture missed events or detail through interpolation. Bandwidth-limiting is a punt that preemptively destroys data (events) so that they don't get "missed". Even if your sampling rate was sufficient for the frequencies involved quantization error would wipe out detail along the amplitude axis.
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In 16-bit linear PCM, quantization noise is 96 dB below maximum signal. Adding dither at 1/2 LSB to decorrelate the noise from the signal raises the noise floor to -93 dBFS. Vinyl's best signal-to-noise ratio is in the 70-75 dB range, so please tell me how vinyl does a better job than digital of preserving low-level amplitude detail. I would really like to know.

As for your point about bandwidth limiting, the data that's left out above 20 kHz is in a frequency range that dogs, bats, ferrets, and dolphins -- and several other species, not including humans -- can hear. If you belong to one of those non-human species, you have a legitimate gripe about digital's upper frequency limit. If not, I hope you can cite a peer-reviewed study or two in psychoacoustics that clearly demonstrates that frequencies above 20 kHz matter in music reproduction for humans.
 
Is this the end of vinyl, again?

restorer-john said:
Now that the hipster fad is over, is this the end of vinyl, again?

It appears 'peak beard' was reached six months ago and being a hipster is no longer cool, basically because commercialised hipster is now so mainstream.

All those skinny jeans, thrift store outfits and single origin coffees are passe.

I'm making a prediction here. Vinyl is dying, again. New $50+ pressings were driven by hipsters, so how long can it survive without them? Not long IMO. My local hipster driven music store's record section has decreased in size after peaking in size about 6 months ago. They have half the new LPs they once had.

My gauge for this bold prediction? 2nd hand Fixie (fixed speed bicycles- a hipster essential item) listings on that auction site are increasing in numbers each week. Vintage TT prices have also peaked IMO. They are getting out, I'm tellin' ya!

:)
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^Topic of this thread^​
 
Maybe it's the beginning of the end for hipsters and PBR in a can. The demise of either or both is no great loss IMO. Vinyl will continue to live on as a niche product.
 
PBR in a can or a Rheingold Chug-A-Mug were fine for me in the late 60's. My taste has matured since then. Little Yellow Pils has been working for me lately.
 
loopstick said:
Maybe what's no longer cool is sharing an interest in vinyl with a bunch of old guys who smell like pee and baby powder.
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One big thing that's no longer cool in audio is knowing how the technology works or having any sort of interest in the engineering behind the recordings and equipment. If ignorance is bliss, the audio hobby has become one of the most blissful hobbies on the planet. If you don't believe this, ask any random group of audiophiles under age 25 how digital audio works. The misconceptions you'll get in response will be as funny as they are numerous.
 
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loopstick said:
Maybe what's no longer cool is sharing an interest in vinyl with a bunch of old guys who smell like pee and baby powder.
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There's no "pee" on me. From what I've heard baby powder may be carcinogenic. No matter, I stay away from it anyway.:smoke:
 
For the sake of staying within topic and no, this is not an analog vs digital topic.
Here's what I don't get, the interest of buying vinyl for music that has been digitally recorded and mixed.
I get buying a vinyl rather than a CD or MP3 from an artist who recorded and mixed 100% analog, but who does this today ?
 
gip111 said:
For the sake of staying within topic and no, this is not an analog vs digital topic.
Here's what I don't get, the interest of buying vinyl for music that has been digitally recorded and mixed.
I get buying a vinyl rather than a CD or MP3 from an artist who recorded and mixed 100% analog, but who does this today ?
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I will not buy MP3 files or any files that are the result of lossy compression.
 
Unavoidable "hipster" creds:
My beard is going on three weeks old (soon to be shaved to jaw-line and chin only)
I have clear rimmed glasses,
I teach art in an MFA Department
I love coffee
and worst of all, I live in Portland Oregon

I've been a so called 'hipster' for going on 35 years!! and will probably stay with my morbid habbits that cause people online to cry all sorts of curse words from their cubicles . . . oh well, c'est la vie

I am just now getting back in to audio - I have thousands of records, I've been carrying them around the country through various academically inspired moves without a decent player for 20 years.

I bought a Sansui 8080 at a garage sale for $10 and a Technics for about $10 - and now I am getting all excited about records again

My location and job and interests keep me pretty close to peole that the interwebz likes to denounce via the word "hipster" -and I don't see any sign of the interest in good music through good equipment dying anytime soon
-it doesn't seem to me that its a phase

- the outward trappings of so called 'hipsterism' will change, as do styles generally -but really, the so-called H crowd are into great things: good music, good eats, good vintage equipment, good movies, good books.

If they awakened those interests and made them trendy - good!

BTW - the excuse for my beard this time around - I'm going to be spending3 months in a conservative Muslim country and figured it would be a polite thing to do . . .
 
Got to give you ^^ some cred mate. Doing it your way and saying so against the tirade of hate.

I've looked like a 'Hippy' for a long time. Wasn't always the easiest.
 
Dr Tinear said:
One big thing that's no longer cool in audio is knowing how the technology works or having any sort of interest in the engineering behind the recordings and equipment. If ignorance is bliss, the audio hobby has become one of the most blissful hobbies on the planet. If you don't believe this, ask any random group of audiophiles under age 25 how digital audio works. The misconceptions you'll get in response will be as funny as they are numerous.
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I don't know how digital audio works.:sigh:
 
just dave said:
I don't know how digital audio works.:sigh:
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I don't know a lot about it but I do know it's a sampled approximation of a continuous infinite-precision analog reality. The fact that I'm not some frickin' animal and can't hear the difference is somewhat comforting but it doesn't put Humpy Dumpty back together.
 
lol

Restorer-John perhaps AU market in your area has run out of good records.. already been picked for genre. quality of records..

I'm a 'boomer' and I have spent about 1200+ in TT, belts and carts. and got a good deal on all 250 nice lp's he took care of.. some look like new and I haven't inventoried at all but I could get 10$ for many.. some with posters in them and some worth a lot more. If it weren't for the records I'd be digging more regularly. I'm way off the radar than a Teen. lol.. However a combo record store audio yuppie place opened up.. near other yuppie establishments has some TT's some speakers etc. opened downtown. (which I hate driving to).. but he's paying rent.

As for quality of sound? scratches? warped? You won't hear any scratches on a record that doesn't have any.. I have many with and without. Better half has some records with usage but with good carts and the phono sections I have in low thd amps, minor surface scratches are greatly reduced. I could clean the rest with audacity if picky. worth burning to cd or library? cost me quad to buy cd's and a lot not available just utube cuts morphed.
 
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