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Overall, what's better? Black vinyl, or colored vinyl? Are they the same?

Well then @Sam Cogley spit out the Truth as appears it can only come from you!! What's the best or does it matter. The whole AK community is waiting on your answer as you have said no to all the other options. Let us know. Post it up.
 
Your sarcasm is noted and ignored. I'm far from the only arbiter of truth, I just read and remember things. This issue has been beaten into the ground here before, yet people are still trying to pass of the same old hooey as the authoritative word of the heavens or something.

Old JVC Supervinyl (what MoFi used) seems to have been about the quietest stuff ever made. It was clear with some black dye added, but it's still translucent.

The link that dcmfam posted, while I don't necessarily agree with their results, is pretty informative:
"From our experience, the main reason colors can run differently (and sound different) is due to the melt characteristics of the vinyl itself — it has nothing to do with the actual color pigments, but instead, the PVC formulations. (i.e., the color pigments themselves do not have sound characteristics — it is true that black vinyl has the black added into the PVC to give it the black look; however, the composition of the black PVC formula that we use runs much differently than the PVC formula which appears white). Different PVC formulations can have dramatically different melting results at various extruder, nozzle, and mold temperature settings – each leading to different molding results when the records are being pressed."

http://www.lenntech.com/polyvinyl-chloride-pvc.htm

http://audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/colored-vinyl-vs-black-vinyl.320548/

Read Michael Fremer's quote about 2/3 of the way down the page:
http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/is-colored-vinyl-inherently-noisier.323544/page-4
 
My comments are made from my own personal experiences, and I would say that almost any one would be hard pressed to discern any differences in sound or noise floor with almost any of the records that I have. The previous Cars box set is but one example, but I also have DEAD CAN DANCE, live LP in clear vinyl (excellent sound quality), Pink Floyd's Division Bell in Blue vinyl, The Flaming Lips-At War with the Mystics in various colors and several others. The basis for my opinion is that the sound quality is largely the work of the band, the recording engineer, the cutting engineer and so on. In other words, I have crappy sounding black vinyl records, I have great sounding black vinyl records. I have crappy sounding colored records, I have awesome sounding colored records.
 
I really don't know how "picture disks" are made, but I would think the inclusion of a paper(?) medium into a disk could have an effect on the sound quality, this is just my opinion and educated guess on my part.

Mark T. :music:
 
Records are black because carbon is mixed with the vinyl. I don't know what the correct ratio is but record companies have been known to increase the carbon content to stretch the yield. In the early 1980's there was a vinyl shortage for some reason so carbon content was upped. The result was generally increased surface noise and for a time, a lot of records being returned to the stores.

Around that same era, virgin vinyl was a buzz term. Record companies would re-cycle records and virgin vinyl was not supposed to have any old ground up records in the mix.

I don't think the term 180 gram means much of anything. If the vinyl is not great, all you get is a heavy noisy record. Once upon a time, 180 gram may have meant something but these days it's just an advertising term in my opinion.

RCA made Dynaflex records for a time which used less vinyl. Rather than "contaminate" the mix with re-cycled vinyl, they used less of a pure (or purer) mix. Those records were bendable to some degree and had fewer or no warps so laid flat on a turntable.

Picture discs have a paper photo sandwiched between two layers of vinyl. In general terms they play but may not be the highest of fidelity.

In the 1970's quadraphonic records were being made and they cost a fair bit more. The Quadraphonic system (or one of them anyway) involved encoding information at frequencies well above the audible spectrum. Cartridges and styli had to cope with 50,000Hz give or take and the vinyl mix had to be such that those frequencies were uncontaminated. Quad recordings in general (at least at the onset) were made from a higher quality vinyl that their stereo (or mono) counterparts. The odd time, a stereo recording could be found pressed on Quadraphonic Vinyl but at a higher price.

As far as I'm concerned, it doesn't matter sound wise whether a record is made from black, clear or colored vinyl, I've heard good and noisy examples of all. I don't own any but I like the diversity of vinyl colors Jack White is producing at Third Man Records. I doubt very much that anything in their catalogue would be sonically substandard. They released at least one liquid filled record too - a 12" 45 single I think.
 
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I would be more concerned about what is in the colored vinyl. Black vinyl uses very finely ground up carbon (graphite) but the dyes mixed in with the virgin vinyl probably contain a lot of metal oxides.
Carbon (graphite) is a lubricant, most metal oxides are abrasive. Aluminum oxide (not used in pigments as far as I know) is used to make grinding wheels. Iron oxide (a pigment) is used in crocus cloth for polishing metals, etc.
Long term, what if anything does it do to your diamond stylus?
Not trying to ring alarm bells, but if I had a pricey stylus, I'd want some answers as to what is in colored vinyl.

BillWojo
 
BillWojo said:
I would be more concerned about what is in the colored vinyl. Black vinyl uses very finely ground up carbon (graphite) but the dyes mixed in with the virgin vinyl probably contain a lot of metal oxides.
Carbon (graphite) is a lubricant, most metal oxides are abrasive. Aluminum oxide (not used in pigments as far as I know) is used to make grinding wheels. Iron oxide (a pigment) is used in crocus cloth for polishing metals, etc.
Long term, what if anything does it do to your diamond stylus?
Not trying to ring alarm bells, but if I had a pricey stylus, I'd want some answers as to what is in colored vinyl.

BillWojo
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Being the pedantic sort that I am, a small point of correction.
The black colour in vinyl is usually produced with carbon black which is different than graphite. Carbon black is usually made by burning oil, coal or other petro products in a low oxygen atmosphere, often in a tunnel furnace. The soot from the incomplete combustion is carbon black and is composed of tiny spherical particles that are used in tires, records and other products that need to be black and more durable. It also helps to dissipate static charges.

Graphite goes through a more complex manufacturing process including a coking and uses a much higher temperature to produce. It forms a planar, layered shape. It's mostly conductive along the flat surfaces.

I learned about this back in the day when I was a freelance designer and got a contract to do a redesign on a carbon black production facility in Hamilton Ontario. The site work for that project was the dirtiest job I had in my life. The carbon is extremely fine and gets in everything.

Apparently, they use titanium dioxide to make the vinyl white and add colourants to make solid coloured vinyl and dyes to make the transparent coloured vinyl.
 
Tom Brennan said:
Calling a record a vinyl was inevitable once enthusiasts began calling records in general vinyl. I'm cool with it.

I never heard a difference between black and colored LPs as I never owned both types for the same recording. I never saw any colored 45s.
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@Tom Brennan

Hi Tom :)

Well, since it appears this old 2016 thread got a bit of a kickstart back to life, I figured I'd show you my one and only colored 45, the Beatles Yellow Submarine pressed on yellow vinyl.

So there ya go my friend, now you've seen one :cool:

(The B side is Eleanor Rigby)

image0 - 2024-08-04T061636.113.jpeg
 
Its not the color, its the quality of the vinyl, and the people who make, master, record, and see that the LP's are made to the tightest stringent minimized variables possible.
 
Ken Boyd said:
When it comes to vinyl black is best.
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Begging your pardon, I'm rather new at this, but. . . from my research Japanese Red is the actual best - but no longer used. I believe it is called Everclean vinyl and is resistant to static and the dust that static accumulates.
 
This is a spirited old(er) thread.

Hey @GChief .... vinyl or vinyls ???

As for any color other than black for so-called vinyl, one of the best sounding LP sets I have is that Jimi Hendrix deal of a (lotta -- mid 1990s ???) few years ago, the one with the Radio One sessions and a "live" material, that came in a translucent blue-tinged colored vinyl that SOUNDS SUPERB.

So much for black vinyl rules.
 
I dug around and found two more Beatles colored 45's in the collection, Taxman & Birthday on green translucent, All you need is love & Baby you're a rich man on pink opaque, and Sgt pepper's / I get by & A day in the life on totally transparent vinyl.

So my collection actually contains four 45's that aren't the regular black vinyl :D

image0 - 2024-10-05T145027.444.jpeg
 
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