Record & Stylus cleaning. What sucks & doesn't?

The biggest performance difference that I see between the Nitty Gritty and the VPI RCMs is the way you scrub. On the VPI machine, the surface you are cleaning is facing up, and the record is completely supported underneath. In this configuration, you can really do some good scrubbing, which is essential with grubby TS and GS records. When you're done scrubbing, swing the vacuum tube into position and turn it on.

On the Nitty Gritty, the record is supported only in the area of the label, so you cannot get as aggressive with your scrubbing with the record mounted on the machine. Some get around this by using an old 'table as a sort of lazy susan to do the scrubbing, then put the record on the machine to vacuum. Additionally, the surface being vacuumed faces down so you have to wet and scrub the record, then flip it over to vacuum.

I think both styles of machine do a very good job, it really boils down to whichever machines idiosyncrasies you think you can live with.

And deli is completely correct. Keep your eye on A'gon and you can pick up a good machine for a fair price. I got my 16.5 off there in new condition for $150 less than retail.
 
Peter_Klim said:
I've seen a bunch of DIY RCM and I would do it myself, but I live in a tiny apt with 2 pairs of 6' tall speakers and so much stuff, I think a tiny RCM would be better for me...it's just a lot of freakn' money for what it does! LOL! Don't you guys think so??
Click to expand...

The dominant tone about the VPI 16.5 among those of us who have purchased one is that it is the single best audio purchase you can make if you are into vinyl.

If you do a little searching you will see what I mean.
 
I've demonstrated both the Nitty Gritty and VPI units for folks and have used both extensively....

I own the VPI 16.5. I wouldn't own the lower level NG machines, and the upper level ones cost like the VPI, so where's the savings?

I really do like the fact that the VPI has a dedicated place to clean your records, turns the LP for you, and just works great...you can use whatever cleaning brushes and fluids you want...

I've had mine for years and the only question I have is why didn't I buy one sooner?

If only all the records I once thought were cleaned by using the really suboptimal Discwasher piece-o-junk had actually been cleaned by something like the VPI, there would be an awful lot more quiet LP's in my collection...
 
$1.09 Small bottle of original Dawn
.33 3" black nylon paintbrush (from a pack of 3 different sizes at the dollar store)
.00 2 dice-sized cubes of Magic Eraser (snipped from a new one my wife hadn't
used yet)
$3.24 Pack of 4 microfiber cloths (on clearance at Target)
_____
$4.66 total investment....works perfect!
 
electronjohn said:
$1.09 Small bottle of original Dawn
.33 3" black nylon paintbrush (from a pack of 3 different sizes at the dollar store)
.00 2 dice-sized cubes of Magic Eraser (snipped from a new one my wife hadn't
used yet)
$3.24 Pack of 4 microfiber cloths (on clearance at Target)
_____
$4.66 total investment....works perfect!
Click to expand...

Close, but no cigar...

All you have to do is to use a VPI once and then you will see why every VPI owner has the same opinion of anything less...

And, I got a dozen microfiber cloths at Walmart for $3.99...I use mine to wipe down the platter of the VPI after cleaning the first side and before setting that clean side down on the platter.
 
For me:

Bad = Discwasher and fluid applied to my albums for many, many moons. I was unknowingly making them noisier and trapping stuff down in the grooves. (a shitpot of us got duped on this one, and paid money to do it even!)

Good = Cleaning records in the sink with Dawn, iso alcohol, and water.

Good = Using carbon fiber brush before each play to remove surface dust/debris.

Someday will build my own record cleaning machine or buy one, that'd be even better than the manual method. Stylus cleaning is simple and hard to mess that up.
 
Funny, but the instructions that came with my Rega advise against using rcms - or any cleaners at all for that matter, saying dust and dirt on a record isn't a bad thing and can be picked off the stylus!!
 
I find a good wash followed by (when dry) a good wipe with a microfibre cloth. This gets rid of deep down dust left in the grooves but unfortunately induces bucket loads of static. To remove this I use Permastat. I have been using Permastat for 30+ years and have albums for that length which have never been re-treated and still have no static on them. I was very dubious when I first tried it, but believe me it works. I carry out the wash/wipe/'Stat procedure whenever I get a new LP whether it is new or s/hand.
Charlie
 
Bennyboy71 said:
Funny, but the instructions that came with my Rega advise against using rcms - or any cleaners at all for that matter, saying dust and dirt on a record isn't a bad thing and can be picked off the stylus!!
Click to expand...

And that is such a load of crap.
 
And I even work on and sell Regas...

I just don't drink that "flat earth" koolaid garbage...been doing this way too long and absolutely know from my own experience that what Roy said about cleaning records is pure, unmitigated, garbage.
 
Linn says basically the same thing....yet, I have convinced a few Linn owners to pick up and try the VPI...they all keep them and do not return them...so, if Rega and Linn were "all knowing" then don't you think their acolytes would hold to the party line no matter what their actual experiences led them to hear?
 
RickB said:
All you have to do is to use a VPI once and then you will see why every VPI owner has the same opinion of anything less...
Click to expand...

What exactly does the VPI machine do that can't be done another way?

1 Rotate a record
2 apply a brush
3 Rotate a record the other direction
4 see #2
5 vacuum liquid

Is that pretty much it?
 
GOYA said:
What exactly does the VPI machine do that can't be done another way?

1 Rotate a record
2 apply a brush
3 Rotate a record the other direction
4 see #2
5 vacuum liquid

Is that pretty much it?
Click to expand...

Well, you''re close, but at least, the VPI 16.5 only rotates one way. And, that is good enough.

One can scrub, apply, to their heart's content. The quality of cleaners used has everything to do with any RCM, whether it's a KAB, which you supply your own Vacuum Source, or a $5K Loricraft-Keith Monks Machine.

If the cleaners, and rinses cannot break loose, remove, and address the contaminants found per given record, you could use a freaking Harrier Jump Jet as a vacuum source, the crap just ain't coming off!

But all you folks who like those Dawn Dishwashing Liquids, continue on, use what you like, tell us how you get the best results. You can fool yourselves, but I've been around the block, I, and others like me you cannot fool. We've done our homework.

As for this cloth, that cloth, Cloths blessed by the virgin mother Mary, even the Shroud Of Turin, you'll fool only yourselves thinking they can ever equal what a vacuum removal system can do. As I said, continue on with your makeshift methods.
 
Bennyboy71 said:
Funny, but the instructions that came with my Rega advise against using rcms - or any cleaners at all for that matter, saying dust and dirt on a record isn't a bad thing and can be picked off the stylus!!
Click to expand...

Perhaps if your records were 99% clean and handled the way audiophiles handle their records.

Once you pick up a record that was played in a room where there is dust, or tobacco (or other type of smoke), or pets, or drinking andxeating going on, or records stored in damp, mildew riddled, dusty basements or attics, and nearly any record sitting on the floor or dirty shelves of the local thrift or outside on a windy day at a yard sale or flea market, fuggedaboutit.


Honestly, I am surprised Rega says that. Unless they think folk are impropely washing records. The wrong cleaners and messy handling and methods could compound issues.


I think the key to the success here of these machines is the vacuum stage, and for careful folk, the steam method too.


As for home made vs. specialty cleaners-

For records I bought new, or were VERY well cared for, my homebrew cleaning fluid is fine.

I am finding out however, anything that was not meticulously taken care of, or had ever been exposed to smoke or excessive dirt, well, my home made stuff is okay, but is not really cutting it.

Some of the factory made stuff tackles the issues much better.
 
Another thing about vacuum cleaning is that it removes the detritus while it is in suspension....
 
I don't deny that the VPI does wonders, but what i should have asked is why is it so expensive? It's not rocket science to make the thing work. What's better about it then some of the DIY RCM. I'm not at all trying to start an argument...I just don't get it.

Once i do get it ( ;) ) should I get this package?

RCM

It seems to have most of what you all have recommended me, plus it saves me a few $100 dollars.
 
Peter_Klim said:
I don't deny that the VPI does wonders, but what i should have asked is why is it so expensive? It's not rocket science to make the thing work. What's better about it then some of the DIY RCM. I'm not at all trying to start an argument...I just don't get it.

Once i do get it ( ;) ) should I get this package?

RCM

It seems to have most of what you all have recommended me, plus it saves me a few $100 dollars.
Click to expand...

I dunno man. But I've only got into vinyl these last couple of months and so have stared reading some of the specialist hi-fi magazines and browsing the web. I tell you, looking at the prices charged for some of this gear is enough to make me go white overnight. I don't have enough kidneys to sell to afford speaker wire constructed by martian technology @ £900 per cm, or cartridges costing thousands which contain armies of invisible nanobots. Sheesh. I can barely afford the price of records.

Its no surprise these record cleaning machines cost so much. What next - synthetic audiophile ears you put over your existing ones to make the soundwaves more neutral?

Anyway, yeah, I'm kinda baffled by the whole record cleaning thing. I guess you get out what you put in eh? And I mean that financially as well as psychologically.
 
I use a nitty griity 1.5Fi for my vinyl and last stylus cleaner
seems to do the job fine for me.
Reason i went for the nitty gritty over the vpi was i like the idea of the clean side not touching anything when cleaning the other side
 
I believe they cost so much cause the market will bear it. Profit per unit is pretty high at the moment. If someone came out with a well designed lower cost unit, it'd sell.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom