Technics M.A.S.H. (how does it work?)

[Bigcatlover]

Hi there!


I'm picking up the Technics SU-MA10 amp tomorrow which has a built in DAC using MASH technology. I know what a DAC is and how a multibit DAC works but... this 1-bit MASH noise shaping technology is really confusing for me. I have many digital sources which output PCM at 24bit 44.1 and 48KHz sampling frequencies, i know it supports the sampling frequency but... the bit depth? What is Delta-Sigma modulation?

Can someone explain, in simple terms, how does a MASH 1 bit DAC work? I can understand electronics to a certain degree but this seems to confuse me... Can this MASH DAC handle whatever my plugin sound card outputs through it's S/PDIF?

 

[tybrad]

I was looking into this ended technology just this past Summer. Here is a good read to help.

http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/1-bit-cd-players.241136/

 

[Bigcatlover]

I was looking into this ended technology just this past Summer. Here is a good read to help.

http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/1-bit-cd-players.241136/

Thanks! Had a look at that already... still trying to understand it all >.<

 

[House de Kris]

Can this MASH DAC handle whatever my plugin sound card outputs through it's S/PDIF?

From reading your post, I've got to believe the real question is the last one you asked, quoted above. SPDIF is just a protocal for transporting data from one point to another. It works regardless of the technology used (multi-bit, single-bit, segmented, etc.) in the DAC chip to render the data into analog form. The device sending the SPDIF data doesn't know, nor does it need to know, the methodologies of conversion at the receiving end of the data - as long as it speaks SPDIF, all is good.

Most likely, the amp doesn't go beyond 48kHz sampling rate, so sending it an SPDIF signal with hi rez data probably won't get you anywhere.

 

[Bigcatlover]

From reading your post, I've got to believe the real question is the last one you asked, quoted above. SPDIF is just a protocal for transporting data from one point to another. It works regardless of the technology used (multi-bit, single-bit, segmented, etc.) in the DAC chip to render the data into analog form. The device sending the SPDIF data doesn't know, nor does it need to know, the methodologies of conversion at the receiving end of the data - as long as it speaks SPDIF, all is good.

Most likely, the amp doesn't go beyond 48kHz sampling rate, so sending it an SPDIF signal with hi rez data probably won't get you anywhere.

Yes, I knew I should've been more specific xD Sorry. I know it won't go beyond 48KHz... but I'm confused by the bit depth... How does the DAC work? what kind of bit depth does it decode? My soundcard outputs one thing and this DAC seems to accept another. I'm just... confused... Right now I'm in that "don't wanna cook Technics's refference amp by mistake" state.

I need a clear answer because I'm away most of the time (13 hours a day) and when I get back, I'm usually tired and not prepared to explain it to myself simply... I didn't even have time to check this out again since yesterday, when I left my last reply. I'm in a really busy period.

I won't use the DAC until I know how it works...

 

[House de Kris]

Relax, you won't blow anything up. Your amp speaks SPDIF. As long as you send it an SPDIF signal at a sample rate it understands, no problem.

The SPDIF receiver decodes the SPDIF stream and presents a code to be converted to the DAC. If that DAC wants to turn on/off specific weighted currents and sum them together to create the resultant analog voltage, or if it wants to switch between two levels at a high rate to be filtered (averaged) to create the same analog voltage doesn't matter one iota.

It is important to remember that the bits coming down the line on the SPDIF path aren't directly acted upon by the DAC, but rather they are used to create a code that is presented to the DAC for it to use as a target to shoot for. Hence, there is no need for the sending device to know the technology of the converting device.

If you are concerned over 16-bit words vs. 24-bit words being sent from your music source, and how will the DAC in the amp behave, again, no worries. MOST SPDIF receivers wil ignore the extra bits if they receive 24 bits and only want 16 bits (although SOME may not, due to tight clocking restrictions). Only guessing here now, but I'm assuming the Technics is only designed to be 16-bit equivalent.

So, rest assured that it will do at least 16 bits. Might actually be a 24-bit equivalent, and likely be able to accept 24-bit SPDIF streams.

 

[Bigcatlover]

Relax, you won't blow anything up. Your amp speaks SPDIF. As long as you send it an SPDIF signal at a sample rate it understands, no problem.

The SPDIF receiver decodes the SPDIF stream and presents a code to be converted to the DAC. If that DAC wants to turn on/off specific weighted currents and sum them together to create the resultant analog voltage, or if it wants to switch between two levels at a high rate to be filtered (averaged) to create the same analog voltage doesn't matter one iota.

It is important to remember that the bits coming down the line on the SPDIF path aren't directly acted upon by the DAC, but rather they are used to create a code that is presented to the DAC for it to use as a target to shoot for. Hence, there is no need for the sending device to know the technology of the converting device.

If you are concerned over 16-bit words vs. 24-bit words being sent from your music source, and how will the DAC in the amp behave, again, no worries. MOST SPDIF receivers wil ignore the extra bits if they receive 24 bits and only want 16 bits (although SOME may not, due to tight clocking restrictions). Only guessing here now, but I'm assuming the Technics is only designed to be 16-bit equivalent.

So, rest assured that it will do at least 16 bits. Might actually be a 24-bit equivalent, and likely be able to accept 24-bit SPDIF streams.

I see. Hmm. For now I'm just having fun trying it out... Not using the DAC just yet.

Thanks alot for the reply! It's really helping alot. I'm busy atm so I'll be back with a more constructive reply.