turntable grounding and 'dancing' (?) speskers

theCOOP

theCOOP

Well-Known Member
With reference to my thread in the Sansui group, http://audiokarma.org/forums/index....els-for-various-sources.780394/#post-10727199

I replaced the Sansui amp with the Denon AVR-2700. The conditions were basically unchanged.

I replaced the AR XB turntable with the recently acquired TAYA LP-100.

Although the Denon worked fine in the basement with various speakers and various tur tables and the TAYA worked fi e downstairs on another amp, the condition upstairs asndescribed in the referenced thread remains the same.

Time to swap out the speakers perhaps or at least check the wiring...:/
 
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Maybe it's just acoustic feedback. and not enough isolation. Don't have the turntable too near loudspeakers, and on something solid. Or cartridge/tonearm mismatch.
 
Thanks for the feedback.

Even during the lead-in or the speakers are just pushing a lot of air, only when the needle is in contact with the records. If you're listening for it, you can hear the needle in the groove but otherwise no sound.

I just swapped on two other headshells with good cartridges and stylus and everything was about exactly the same.

Those on the AR are correct and/original.
 
Ok...let's look at the fact then that both the AR and the TAYA each have kinda a hollow wooden plinth.

And so does the Micro Seiki and I think In had similar problems with that one.

My three favorite tables.

:/
 
Sounds like acoustic feedback to me too. Could you describe or post a photo of the setup, especially the platform on which you have the turntable and the proximity to speakers?

If the problem persists with three different turntables and two different amps in different combinations, the good news is it probably isn't the tables or the amps. It seems like you have narrowed it down to an isolation problem if I am understanding you correctly.
 
The speaker isn't always stuck behind guitars and m andolins.

The left side speaker is an equal distance from the TV.

1501971262187.jpg
 
Hmmmm. I would think those shelves are pretty stable and heavy with all of those records in them, but the visible speakers (cool Sonys by the way) are pretty close to the shelving unit. The lower speaker almost looks like it's touching the shelving? That could cause issues even with decently heavy shelving. Have you tried moving the speakers away from the shelves a little? You could even try disconnecting the speaker that is right there next to the shelves and see if the problem persists in the other speaker that is a little further away? Nothing really obvious stands out about your setup.

You said that there wasn't an issue in your basement, but was that with different speakers? The only other variable you haven't changed besides amps and turntables are the speakers, so maybe swap those out with some others in that same room and see if the problem is still there.
 
theCOOP said:
Even during the lead-in or the speakers are just pushing a lot of air, only when the needle is in contact with the records. If you're listening for it, you can hear the needle in the groove but otherwise no sound.
Click to expand...

This is sub sonics, if your woofers are pumping in and out when there really isn't much sound yet.

Feedback is high volume in the room that the cartridge picks up and loops it into your system, that make a noise like wow wow wow
 
Speakers weren't actually touching the cube units.

Only had these speakers a short time. No problems with the prev speakers which are put aside in the basement.

I've had the screens off some time and haven't noticed any problems.

(Between tracks now, plenty enough hum).

At some point with the sansui the sound just opened up, and now this :/
 
4-2-7 said:
This is sub sonics, if your woofers are pumping in and out when there really isn't much sound yet.

Feedback is high volume in the room that the cartridge picks up and loops it into your system, that make a noise like wow wow wow
Click to expand...

Sounds like;
 
theCOOP said:
Speakers weren't actually touching the cube units.

Only had these speakers a short time. No problems with the prev speakers which are put aside in the basement.

I've had the screens off some time and haven't noticed any problems.

(Between tracks now, plenty enough hum).

At some point with the sansui the sound just opened up, and now this :/
Click to expand...
You not helping anyone when your bouncing all over the place, not quoting anyone or answering question. In general holding a conversation to diagnose your issue, one at a time. You have to be clear as to what the problem is.
 
4-2-7 said:
You not helping anyone when your bouncing all over the place, not quoting anyone or answering question. In general holding a conversation to diagnose your issue, one at a time. You have to be clear as to what the problem is.
Click to expand...

Thank you for your feedback.

I've seen discussion more than individual question that needed answering individually.

This started initially because on one or more amps, CD is loud at a relatively low volume-knob level as compared to PHONO and TV.

The higher I turn the volume up for PHONO, the more the bass speakers pump irrespective of any associated recorded sound.

I made sure the speakers were not touching the cube shelf units. I have even now turned the speakers straight into the room instead of pointed toward the middle of the room.

I've check that all the speaker wires are connected properly and that everything is tight.

I turned the RCA cable ends to ensure a good connection.

So there has been some improvement.
 
theCOOP said:
This started initially because on one or more amps, CD is loud at a relatively low volume-knob level as compared to PHONO and TV.
Click to expand...
This is normal as the phono input signal is lower than other sources like CD, Tape, AUX inputs.

theCOOP said:
The higher I turn the volume up for PHONO, the more the bass speakers pump irrespective of any associated recorded sound.
Click to expand...

This is a subsonic issue that could be from a few things, mismatched cartridge and arm, mismatched cart and phono stage. The record it's self could have bad subtonics.

A lot of old receivers, and amps back in the dat had a subtonic filter switch that would fix the issue when playing those bad records.

Are you having the same problem with ALL records?
 
A few threads I found that talk about your issues

Does a subsonic filter have to be anything more than a basic crossover at the speaker?
http://audiokarma.org/forums/index....crossover-at-the-speaker.684379/#post-9144229


Very Low frequency speaker movement problem
http://audiokarma.org/forums/index....speaker-movement-problem.662640/#post-8831588

To use a subsonic filter or not?
http://audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/to-use-a-subsonic-filter-or-not.571982/

SL-1200 & Woofer Pumping - Which mod??
http://audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/sl-1200-woofer-pumping-which-mod.565132/
 
4-2-7 said:
This is normal as the phono input signal is lower than other sources like CD, Tape, AUX inputs.



This is a subsonic issue that could be from a few things, mismatched cartridge and arm, mismatched cart and phono stage. The record it's self could have bad subtonics.

A lot of old receivers, and amps back in the dat had a subtonic filter switch that would fix the issue when playing those bad records.

Are you having the same problem with ALL records?
Click to expand...

And I thought amps with phono input compensated for the low input signal.

Fair enough.

The movement of the speaker is more pronounced with so.e records than others; it's nearly imprrceptable on the original-pressing g Nick Cave album I'm spinning right now. It was more pronounced with a Spirit of the West album a moment ago and more pronounced at the beginnings than at the end.

I had the same problem with another unit/combination but I forget what corrected it.
 
Sounds like the classic turntable rumble (acoustical feedback) as others have mentioned. Either turn your bass down or switch in your low pass filter if your amp/receiver has one. This is nothing new to us here in the audio world, we just have to fine ways to correct it.

Acoustical feedback usually happens with microphones, guitars or instruments with pick-ups, and turntables. Tape and CD players don't suffer from this as there is no direct feedback.
 
Will try a turntable later today with a more substantial base. I have one of those heavy Kenwoods here; The Rock.
 
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