Who Runs Tube Pre-amps Through SS Amps

131east23

131east23

...near Frank's Pizza!
I want a tube sound but I want headroom (is that the correct term) for my speakers. The tube amps I can afford are all low wattage, for example an ST70. I kind of like the idea of a SS amp with muscle feeding my speakers.

I'm running Klipsch Cornwalls from 1981. Any suggestions are welcome. I'm trying to zero in on a tube pre-amp/SS amp combo. Would like to hear opinions on why this is/isn't a good idea and different points of view. Looking for the typical good advice these forums always supply, something to make me scratch my head and go, "good point".

Was running a Dynakit PAS2 (it quit working) into my Rotel integrated amp (see signature) and liked what I heard but thought I could do better. The PAS2 is wimpy on bass and the Cornwalls 15" woofers were being underused. I want something that will thump the room.
 
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used to use a PAS-2 through my Adcom amp after my sansui died... sucked. Sansui was much better! :) Sansui is fixed now yay.

Loved my ST-70, such a sweet little amp, but not for thump, if all you want is thump should stick to all SS gear IMO or two systems, one tube set up for relaxing listening and one SS for when you want to rock out.
 
Cruise on down to Echo Audio in Portland if that's where you are.

ETA: SS amp for me, as power tubes are not worth the trouble. A Yamaha M-4 sounds like whatever you feed it with. Various pre-amps to suit.
 
Tromatic said:
Cruise on down to Echo Audio in Portland if that's where you are.

ETA: SS amp for me, as power tubes are not worth the trouble. A Yamaha M-4 sounds like whatever you feed it with. Various pre-amps to suit.
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I was in Echo Audio today with another AK'er down from Seattle and that visit is what made me ask the question.
 
Echo is the best. Tell them what you are looking for/want and they can find it.

I've come back to an SS pre, mostly because my hearing has changed a bit. Tubes are just a bit too laid-back for me these days.

131east23 said:
No...

We were the guys looking at those speakers in the back room on the beveled wooden bases. I was the guy drooling over the Manley Mahi's and the little ST70 above it...
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I once ran a reworked PAS-3 thru a Hafler and I thought it sounded pretty nice. Played with tubes and thought the Mullards sounded better than Tele. I had changed all the resistors and caps in that PAS but I think I left the rest of it pretty stock, like pots and case, circuit boards. All half watt metal film resistors and PP caps. I liked what that preamp did for the sound, especially mids. Got no functioning tube gear right now, though. Have a nice condx. Fisher integrated that probably needs an overhaul after many years stored by someone. One of these years I may overhaul it to try out.
 
131east23 said:
I want a tube sound but I want headroom (is that the correct term) for my speakers. The tube amps I can afford are all low wattage, for example an ST70. I kind of like the idea of a SS amp with muscle feeding my speakers.

I'm running Klipsch Cornwalls from 1981. Any suggestions are welcome. I'm trying to zero in on a tube pre-amp/SS amp combo. Would like to hear opinions on why this is/isn't a good idea and different points of view. Looking for the typical good advice these forums always supply, something to make me scratch my head and go, "good point".

Was running a Dynakit PAS2 (it quit working) into my Rotel integrated amp (see signature) and liked what I heard but thought I could do better. The PAS2 is wimpy on bass and the Cornwalls 15" woofers were being underused. I want something that will thump the room.
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Nothing I know of could do more justice to your Cornwalls (IF you replace the old capacitors in their crossover network with new ones of the same value) than a Leben preamp running a pair of monoblock Icon Audio MB 845 II's.
http://lebenhifi.com/products/rs100.html
http://www.iconaudio.co.uk/MB845_2.html
On the other hand you could save a lot of $ by substituting the Icon Audio monoblocks with a Rotel power amp. You wouldn't need a powerful one either and could even go with a used one if you're brave.
http://tinyurl.com/69ew6cb
 
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At times I run my Cornwall II's through a Mcintosh MX110 tube Preamp/Tuner and Marantz 250 amp. Sounds quite good. I've tried the Mac through a Marantz 170DC and that also seems to work well.
That said - To me I still prefer Tube to Tube with the Klipschs. I have a 40 +or - watt 6L6 amp that is all the speakers need.

Crite’s modified Fortes, Crites modified Cornwall IIs (2 pair), Marantz 1060, Marantz 140 amp, Marantz 170DC amp, Marantz 240 amp, Marantz 250 amp, Marantz 3200, Marantz 3250, Marantz 3300, Marantz 3600, Marantz 115B Tuner, Marantz 105 Tuner. A Gaggle of Carver receivers, Ohm 2's, Dahlquist 9's, Denon Cd, Technics SL-Q2, SL7 and an AR-XA. A Grant Fidelity Tube processor, JWN Tube Amp, and an Ampex 018 tube pre-amp/tuner, Mcintosh MX110.

"Good Music, Single Malt and Old Motorcycles"
 
Tromatic said:
Have you heard a Leben? I want to hear one SOOOOO bad......
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Now I have to reveal my bias Tromatic. I run a Leben RS-100 into a pair of Icon Audio MB 845 MII monoblocks. I don't like Leben's power amps. Far too soggy in that single ended way that gives everything an unnatural rosy glow with an ill defined bottom end. OK, most 300B lovers would be besotted - count me out. The MB 845 II's, on the other hand have a bottom end to equal many solid state monsters down to about 30Hz ( I then hand everything below over to a pair of Velodyne DD15's), and dynamic and microdynamic shifts and a transparency I've not heard since Audio Research's now ancient D70 MkII. Gives me goose-bumps !
The Leben preamp is as transparent as just about any pre-amp I've used, adds just a smidgen of thermionic glow and gives me the flexibility I refuse to go without such as (forgive me using a vulgar non-purist term) an inter-channel balance control. I'm not too happy about the look of the thing but who cares.
For vinyl I run a Manley 'Steelhead' which also gives me goose-bumps galore. Looks almost as queer as the Leben but in a kind of Flash Gordon way. But hey, you just close your eyes and go with the music.:music: :yes::music::yes::music:
 
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A Stereo 70 should be plenty for a pair of Cornwalls. Just my opinion but if you're not feeling that would be enough, I would look more at the source and preamp and not the amount of power you are feeding those very efficient speakers.

I have a 400wpc solid state amp, that I occasionally run with a tube preamp. It works well. But the amount of 'slam' I get has as much to do with what's in front of that amp, as anything. The headroom of that amp actually makes it, at times, sound less 'loud' than lower powered amps. Transients are quicker. Everything is less compressed. Instead of sounding 'louder', it sounds like less of anything at all. Its just not really there making itself known. That is headroom to me, not 'thump'.
 
JohnVF said:
A Stereo 70 should be plenty for a pair of Cornwalls. Just my opinion but if you're not feeling that would be enough, I would look more at the source and preamp and not the amount of power you are feeding those very efficient speakers.

I have a 400wpc solid state amp, that I occasionally run with a tube preamp. It works well. But the amount of 'slam' I get has as much to do with what's in front of that amp, as anything. The headroom of that amp actually makes it, at times, sound less 'loud' than lower powered amps. Transients are quicker. Everything is less compressed. Instead of sounding 'louder', it sounds like less of anything at all. Its just not really there making itself known. That is headroom to me, not 'thump'.
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Yes Cornwalls are highly efficient and would work well with a Stereo 70 but I'm doubtful they'd have sufficient damping factor to control those Klipsh woofers. A trial would be a good idea.
 
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Tromatic said:
Echo is the best. Tell them what you are looking for/want and they can find it.

I've come back to an SS pre, mostly because my hearing has changed a bit. Tubes are just a bit too laid-back for me these days.
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So you know how to take help when it's offered, but you bash others when what they could really use is the same?

That's nice!

:thumbsdn:
 
I run two Monarchy class A amps, through a Marsh Hybrid preamp. Works for me.

I also have an Aric Audio tube preamp controling two powered PC monitors I made.
 
jimfet said:
I run two Monarchy class A amps, through a Marsh Hybrid preamp. Works for me.

I also have an Aric Audio tube preamp controling two powered PC monitors I made.
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"Works for me" Hidden in this simple phrase is a world of audio wisdom.
Providing preamp output impedences and power amp input impedances are within sane boundaries theory tells us everything should be OK. But, as so many of us have learnt through painful and sometimes expensive experience, the theory doesn't always tells us accurately how a particular preamp/power amp combination is going to sound running particular speakers in each and every room. I've run tube preamps into tube power and SS power amps with both nasty and wonderful results and solid state preamps into both tube and SS power amps with just as many awful and pleasant surprises.
With my present speakers I've hit on a combination of tube pre and power amps that works for me . . there's that phrase again.
I think what I'm trying to say here is lets not rigidly adhere to any particular rule other than what our own ears hear coming out of our own set-ups.
OK, there are some rules you can't ignore such as the atypical requirements of some electrostatic speakers and avoiding blowing your 98dbw efficient horn loaded monsters apart with 300 watts of solid state behemoth but that's another topic.
 
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