WHY DO people like old cars, anyway?

rca2000 said:
I was watching " The grapes of Wrath", last night, and it reminded me of something: It seems that, on the real old cars, one had to add coolant, ever so often, 'cause it just "boiled away". WHY?? did not those old cars from that era, have "closed" cooling systems, lke modern cars do?
Click to expand...

My allis chalmers tractor (1940's) is like that...once you stop the engine the water can heat up to the boiling point dut to the fact the fan and water pump aren't running anymore but there is residual heat in the engine, and water can boil over out of the overflow tube. I check the water and add as needed before starting up.
 
I hate it when people diss old cars. My dad owns a 1965 chevy chevelle and that thing rides so nice it feels like you are rideing on a cloud. And we also own a 1974 corvette and a 1979 malibue classic station wagon and a 1966 mustange fastback. And i will tell you what they kick the sh@% out of any of our newer cars and the old cars have better build quality. None of this cheap plastic garbage just good old solid metal. And i think the reason some older cars arent that fast is because the engines are tired and they are so heavy. Sure you can buy your stooped little ricer4 cylender crap car but i deffinatly wouldnt. And the only way you would be able to beat a old car with a new car is if you spend a good 5000 dollars on the engine nos systems. But if you did the same stuff to an old chevy the old chevy would still win because it has real horsepower. I will bet you my 1979 malibue station wagon will kill your little cheapo car in a race. Its got a 396 out of a 1968 chevelle and that is bored out to 402 horse power. I dont care what you think but new cars are just JUNK! But i think you should buy a 1965 chevelle ss and bore it out with a racing engine. All performance parts that is if you really want to race. But if that 396 could fit in any new cars. Its got so much power that it would probably twist the frame. But i will always buy chevy and never buy ford.
 
I think you missed part of my point...

As I said those cars were slow, and junk, when they were STOCK, with all of that power-robbing (and fuel-mileage robbibg) emissions junk on them!! Sure, IF you beef one up, it will run well, and fast. But STOCK, it would be hard to argue, that cars from 1972-1981, were not that good(with some exceptions, like sports cars, etc). Pre 1972 cars, well, with good tires, they are hard to beat, in the power and racing department.

But, modern(mid-80's and on) FWD , PFI-injected cars do not NEED all of that emissions junk, and they tend to not need a lot of mods, to drive with authority, and they give good gas mileage.

BUT-- I WILL admit, that in a bad accident, they can fold up, into pretty much a big accordian.

We all have our own tastes,and I do NOT mean to diss those who like old cars. I like old hi-fi, like the rest of us, BUT I like modern cars., with all of the modern, hi-tech items in them that entails.
 
I think in "The Grapes of Wrath" the cars were supposed to be old barely running jalopies, & some of that was Hollywood. But cars HAVE gotten better since the '30s-better oils, fuels, metallurgy, ignition systems, and just the general advance of technology. The early Ford V-8, for example, was prone to vapor-lock, & had high oil consumption at first anyway. Cars didn't have oil filters as std equipment til the late '50s-you could have 'em installed, though. The Chevy 6 til 1954 had a primitive "splash-oiling" lubrication system that worked OK at the lower speeds people drove back then, but would soon self-destruct if you pushed the car much past 70 for very long. A typical car of 1940 was pretty well used up at 100,000 miles-now we expect to get 175-200 out of 'em. -Sandy G.
 
I think fondness for old cars has more to do with memories of days past than vehichle quality/reliability.

When my brother & I were teenagers my dad gave us a '73 El Camino to run around in. LOVED that old camino and wish I (or we) still had it!


Early El Caminos had MAJOR cool factor! Especially with mag-wheels on 'em.

Memories indeed! The car my dad taught me how to drive in was a Chevy Corvair.
I think those are collectors items now.

Russ
 
Everyone talks about old cars being safer, thanks to bulk, but there is something to be said for the designs of newer models which take the impact so you don't have to. I once saw a video where they ran an early 30s Chevy through the same crash test-probably 35mph-that new cars run. That poor old Chevy just disentegrated. Gradually they learned. The first car I rode in was a first generation Torino. Dad sold it-he was running a wrecker then & every Torino he saw in a crash didn't fair well at all. But to look at stuff like that old Chevy or that Torino you would say it was indestructible.

The 70s were the only decade when the US auto industry really went backward. Just too many things against them at once-emissions, fuel economy, safety, insurance companies-all tightening the noose. Several years ago I attended a class where the instructor took a poll-how many in this room own an American car made from 1973-1979? Nobody did. The point was that they were all junk. Well, I won't go that far. If you took the poll today the results would be different because, as others have pointed out, 60s stuff is going out of sight. If you can't afford the 69 Camaro of your dreams, get that 79, its still cheap. I think most folks who buy them these days rip out all the emmisions junk in short order & hot rod them just like the older stuff. But from the factory they were not so hot.

Occasionally a real clean 70s model will show up & I could see myself owning it. The other day a fellow stopped by in a 78 Grand Marquis, very similiar to the one that replaced that old Torino. Car was clean as a whistle. Then there was the 74 Newport at the estate auction last Saturday, little old ladies car, just been backed out of the garage. I can daydream about them but I wouldn't want to live with them. My 67 Impala is enough of a project-at least its simple enough to work on. The only times it left me were electrical in nature & if you're creative you can still make it back.
 
DanTana said:
Old cars are not effected by EMP.
Click to expand...


Yeah.. You got a point there.. An 89-92 Trofeo, with the VIC, would most likely put up a little skull and crossbones up on the screen, and the words "your #ucked",(Just kiddin'),If an EMP were to burst anywhere near it, and then, become as dead as a stone, until a complete reboot of the dozen or so computers onboard.(the same applies to ANY 1982 or newer car, with computer control).

Whereas, a 1971 or so, point-type ignition car, with a carb, could keep on chuging by, with nary an effect, except for the radio!!
 
About 60's cars(in particular a 67 Camaro 396 SS::)

I rode in one, in the fall of '84. It was, and to this day still IS, the fastest, meanest car, Ive ridden in. I originally did not think it wiould be that fast, so the owner let me know, by giving it all there was, from about 25 or so, getting on a ramp to a highway. Man, I remember, it was SO powerful!! It slammed me back so hard in the seat, it hurt a little, BUT it was FUN!!! I doubt a modern car, save a porsche, viper, or vette, could beat it very easily. It most likely had been modded, too.
 
The reason that one could not take off the emissions plumbing on an older car was that it was, and remains, quite illegal to do so. Newer cars have the entire drivetrain engineered as a unit... you couldn't take the smog plumbing off modern engines and have them start up, never mind run. The pre-electronically controlled engines (<1977 or so) with air pumps, thermal reactors, air injection manifolds, electric chokes, etc. just had all that crap hung on them as a factory retrofit to engines designed in the 50's. But the smog plumbing on them must remain installed, thanx to Uncle Sam. The only mod I do recall reading was that the 1974 seat belt interlock system CAN be legally disabled.

Russ? I envy your learning to drive in a Corvair. I've always loved those cars as proof that Detroit could dare to be different, in style. I'd still love to get my hands on one today if I were rich. Best I can do at the moment is a 1:18 scale '63 Monza coupe sitting on top of my Yamaha amp!

Dan, IIRC an EMP would kill early (or any, for that matter) electronic ignition systems, yes? Meaning only point systems would work? Or would even the rectifier diodes in the alternators go, too?

Tom
 
Last edited:
What is it with all of the grand marquises? I hate ford lincon mercury basicly hate the whole ford motor division. Because there unreliability in there cars my uncle had a ford windstar not even a month and had engine problems. He put a new engine in there. I dont know why if it was my van it would be headed strait for the junkyard but. That engine lasted him about 3 months or so and then he had electrical problems with it now that was a pos van.
 
If you wanna read something that will chill yer shite about EMP, get the book "Warday" by Jim Kunetka & Whitley Strieber.EMP would not only kill most of our precious electronic devices, it would also kill the test equipment to fix 'em with..Tube stuff would be pretty much unfazed. There's a long-held rumor the military keeps BUNCHES of R-390As ready to go "just in case"-an R-390A should remain operational as long as there was AC power or it wasn't melted by a fireball.-Sandy G.
 
Everyone has horror stories about certain makes. Brand loyalty is one thing; logic is another. One guy will say Fords are crap on wheels, while others will say that GM=Garbage Motors, and another will say Mopars blow. It all goes by personal experience. The only fair way to say what make or company stinks is if you yourself have owned one and had to pay (or not) to fix it. My dad hadn't owned a Ford since the early 50's and for nearly 50 years thought they were junk. He had been a GM man since then, except having had a trio of AMC's ('63 Rambler Classic, '67 Ambassador convertible, '71 Matador) and one Mopar ('78 Volare) Because he wanted a station wagon in decent shape, low miles, etc, and GM no longer had an offering that was acceptable, he was gently persuaded to buy a Taurus wagon. He loves it.

If the car companies REALLY made junk on wheels, enough people would not buy them and the companies would go out of business. That said, the only make I think, based on reputation, that most everyone would agree on as being rolling pieces of $hit would be the Yugo.

All the Grand Marquis that are on the road are usually owned by folks who like big comfortable cars.

Tom
 
Last edited:
Sandy G said:
If you wanna read something that will chill yer shite about EMP, get the book "Warday" by Jim Kunetka & Whitley Strieber.EMP would not only kill most of our precious electronic devices, it would also kill the test equipment to fix 'em with..Tube stuff would be pretty much unfazed. There's a long-held rumor the military keeps BUNCHES of R-390As ready to go "just in case"-an R-390A should remain operational as long as there was AC power or it wasn't melted by a fireball.-Sandy G.
Click to expand...
Fat lot of good the internet would do Uncle Sam then, if all the PC's connected to it for defense purposes became paperweights, eh? We wouldn't be able to shoot back.
Tom
 
I kept waitin' for 'em to offer a "De Sade" option package on the Grand Marquis...My mom's best friend's husband was the Ford dealer here. Once he got a full-boat Country Squire for his personal use, & was perplexed by this strange rattle in the rear passenger door. They took the door panel off, nothing amiss-Hello,what's this ?-an assembly line worker had tied a lugnut on a string, & attached it to a piece of metal on the inside top of the door-the lugnut would only rattle evry so often when they went around a curve, etc. There was an anomymous note attached:"Ha-ha !! You found me, you son-of-a-bitch !"....-Sandy G.
 
harmkard330guy said:
What is it with all of the grand marquises? I hate ford lincon mercury basicly hate the whole ford motor division. Because there unreliability in there cars my uncle had a ford windstar not even a month and had engine problems. He put a new engine in there. I dont know why if it was my van it would be headed strait for the junkyard but. That engine lasted him about 3 months or so and then he had electrical problems with it now that was a pos van.
Click to expand...

I agree with you on the windstar, we had one and it was full of problems. Ditto on the Aerostar...however the Grand Marquis/Crown Vic has always been a mature, conservatively designed car that has been pretty good for me...I think all of the manufacturers had "lemon" models and great models so I don't think it's fair to say that all products are bad from a certain mfr.
 
My two cents...

Having worked in auto parts for a number of years, I for a long time tried to desperately buy into the "old cars are better myth". Still have the stacks of bills and memories of breakdowns to prove it ain't the case. Just ask my wife. She has MANY stories to share about it...
I will not go into hobbies, looks, fun, etc. All of those things are vaild reasons for choosing to drive anything. Hey, I have kicked around getting an old Lada 1500 as something fun to play with. Rational decision? Of course not! An Italian car built by the Soviets?
As far as driving goes, the newer cars are unbeatable. They just don't require the amount of work that the older ones did. Especially the Japanese ones. If everyone drove a Camry or an Accord, the auto parts stores would be out of business. It is not unusual for a Japanese car to use the same tranny to the grave. Unusual for an American car not to have it rebuilt at 70 to 100k. They are just built differently.
Performance? The new cars outperform the old. No questions. My 2.5 V6 (designed by Porsche with production tooling done by Cosworth) 5speed Contour with only the most minor changes will outrun my 78 TA WS6 400 with the hot W72 engine and shortest gears. Gas mileage? No comparison. While I loved the handling of my TA (BIG sway bars and factory urethane bushings) I am totally confident that the Contour will take it on any track. With the limiter removed it will run 140 mph in lots of comfort for my 6'4 frame.Most cars of the late 60's ran 16 to 18 second quarter miles. The hot ones were running 14's and 15's. VERY few the big Hemis and hotest chevys got into the 13's. And as the factory guys of the time are more than willing to admit now, those cars that were given to magazines were no where even close to stock.
Safety? No comparison! While 5000lbs of sheetmetal might make you FEEL safe, new cars are designed to sacrifice themselves and save YOU! It is not because of poor design that they fold up. Folding up is GOOD design. As they fold up, they absorb the energy of the crash, so you don't have to. The chances of surviving a crash in something like a Taurus or Camry as compared to a 75 LTD, for example is MANY times higher. Add airbags to the equation, and it is night and day. Why do you think total fatalities have stayed the same or dropped over the past 30 years, when miles driven has exploded? And that is just passive safety. ANY modern car will outhandle and outstop any of the older cars. Add in things like ABS and traction control, or even disc brakes and your chances of even getting into an accident diminish greatly.
Are parts costs higher? Sure they are. But repairs required are so much less and costs to run them are so much lower, that it easily balances out.
I will in no way disparage anyone who chooses to drive an older car. I understand the appeal in so many ways (just saw a Jag XK-120 yeserday. Nothing modern even comes close). But as cars, as transportation devices, the new ones are just so much better that there really is no way to compare them.
As I said, just my 2 cents...
Erik
 
I bought a brand new Windstar for the wife in Nov 2001. We have had nothing but oil changes, and a couple seat belt recalls. EVERYBODY has their own tales of woe, and success.
 
Biggest problem I've had w/my Excursion is that it LOVES gasoline-LOTS & LOTS of it. Other than that, it's been pretty well trouble-free. But it is great jolly fun to play Hog-of-The-Road w/it- Damn the Toyotas ! Full speed Ahead !! Keelhaul the Bosun's Mate !! Jettison the Mizzen Mast !! Fire when ready, Mr Gridley !! Outta my way, you cheap, insignificant lower forms of life !! Do not perturb me, nematodes, lest ye be struck down by a 6.8 liter V-10 !!..... -Sandy G.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom