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250 wpc vs. 52 wpc: Which is Better?

SoCal Sam

SoCal Sam

Lunatic Member
Next weekend, I'm going to play my Marantz 2500 (250 wpc) and 2252B (52 wpc) for some local stereo buddies. They will be paired with my trusty HPM-100's and the volume output will be leveled using a pink noise generated in my BSR 3000 EQ and a SPL meter. Both Marantz are late 1977 models.

The question we will explore is which sounds better at 85, 90, and 95 dB, which for the vast majority of folks are normal listening levels? And, does anyone really need 250 wpc?

Which Marantz do you think will win? The 2500 or 2252B?
 
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As a general rule the more powerful the stereo the better the bass will be at low volume. I'm putting my money on the 2500...
 
Power is not always about playing loud... Some speakers are lower in efficiency and need the extra power to be driven correctly.

So the question is not just which amp sounds better into high efficiency speakers, but also which amp can drive power hungry speakers.......


jk
 
jstang said:
Power is not always about playing loud... Some speakers are lower in efficiency and need the extra power to be driven correctly.

So the question is not just which amp sounds better into high efficiency speakers, but also which amp can drive power hungry speakers.......


jk
Click to expand...

Speaker choice is a huge variable. I chose the HPM-100's because they are rated 92.5 dB/1w/1m and relatively easy to drive. I suppose a true comparo would involve power hungry speakers but I have to draw the line somewhere.
 
I expect the 2500 will trounce the 2552B.

However, taking into account the somewhat short of stellar reliability track record and service issues of the 2500, a more poignant question might be:

Which model would you like to keep as your daily driver over the long haul?​

or alternatively,

If you were given $1,500 to spend on anything, would you buy the 2500 and end up with no funds left over, or buy the 2252B and have $1,400 to spare?​

I am sure we can all agree that the questions have no simple, cut and dry answers!

Good luck on your audition, Sam!
 
How will the speakers be placed? Corner, mid-room 6 foot apart? Just curious and eager to see the results.
 
Njord Noatun said:
I expect the 2500 will trounce the 2552B.

However, taking into account the somewhat short of stellar reliability track record and service issues of the 2500, a more poignant question might be:

Which model would you like to keep as your daily driver over the long haul?​

or alternatively,

If you were given $1,500 to spend on anything, would you buy the 2500 and end up with no funds left over, or buy the 2252B and have $1,400 to spare?​

I am sure we can all agree that the questions have no simple, cut and dry answers!

Good luck on your audition, Sam!
Click to expand...

NN:

Thanks for the comments. Reliability is a huge factor and in the 2500's case, a huge FEAR factor. I'm a believer that if an example of the 2500 has survived this long, it probably left the factory with good parts and should be good for the long haul. In other words, the weak have already been weeded out.

Money is an interesting point. If at 90 dB, the 2252B does sound better, then it makes no sense to spend 10 times more for a 2500. However, there is no doubting that the 2500 is one impressive receiver and when the scope is dancing, there is no better SHOW.

I will submit this comparo to my guests for a vote. Most of them are veteran collectors so the vote will be a good one.

Cheer, Sam.
 
roggom said:
How will the speakers be placed? Corner, mid-room 6 foot apart? Just curious and eager to see the results.
Click to expand...

My living room is approximately 15 by 30 feet. The setup will be about 5 feet off the back wall with each speakers placed about 8 feet apart and about 4 feet off the side walls. Should be plenty of room for the speakers to breathe. The room is carpeted and has some soft furniture and the ceiling is acoustic, that is covered with mini popcorn. It is not particularly lively so that is good.
 
I agree that even without truly cranking it, having the power on tap to make sound at any frequency, any volume level, at any point, happen is going to sound better. Comparing my 100 WPC Sansui (quite a beast, not exactly a mega-powerful receiver like the 2500 but certainly large enough to melt most speakers down) to a smaller 20 WPC Lafayette (which is otherwise in need of maintenance but is mainly just lacking in power), the difference isn't what volume I can drive my speakers to. 20 watts RMS is more than I almost ever utilize. The question is whether a loud drum hit is going to distort and sound bad-- or nuke a tweeter. I've had the Sansui max out the PMPO meters once or twice and even then it wasn't audible clipping. It seems to me that the difference you'll hear in a big receiver vs. a smaller one isn't the general level of power it can deliver, but the burst power it has available, which is certainly something that is audible.
 
jrsh92 said:
I agree that even without truly cranking it, having the power on tap to make sound at any frequency, any volume level, at any point, happen is going to sound better. Comparing my 100 WPC Sansui (quite a beast, not exactly a mega-powerful receiver like the 2500 but certainly large enough to melt most speakers down) to a smaller 20 WPC Lafayette (which is otherwise in need of maintenance but is mainly just lacking in power), the difference isn't what volume I can drive my speakers to. 20 watts RMS is more than I almost ever utilize. The question is whether a loud drum hit is going to distort and sound bad-- or nuke a tweeter. I've had the Sansui max out the PMPO meters once or twice and even then it wasn't audible clipping. It seems to me that the difference you'll hear in a big receiver vs. a smaller one isn't the general level of power it can deliver, but the burst power it has available, which is certainly something that is audible.
Click to expand...

What you say about tones drawing down power is correct and can be seen on the scope in square wave tests as tilting of the plateau. This can be aparent at the lower frequencies like 20 Hz.

However, not all high powered amps have good traces at 20 Hz and in fact a few sub 100 watters I've seen have better 20 Hz traces than the monsters.

I haven't seen either the 2500 or the 2252B on the scope so I can't predict what the results will be. However, bass will be something we will listen for.
 
i vote for the 52b. the hpm's are @ 92.5 sensitivity? they're gonna sing! 2500 might be too much as you lean on the throttle. what source will you be running?
 
still not fair

Even though they're both Marantz's they are two different designers works, that being said. I say the little one will sound more musical:yes:
 
Keep in mind 3spdb on speaker output is half the sound level.... At lower volume settings the 2500 is not stretching legs. Putting a 250wpc amp with speakers meant for 30wpc tube amp is not a good match....

jk
 
I compared my Marantz 3300 and 250 Power Amp to my Marantz 2252B rceiver driving a pair of Yamaha NS-690s. My TT is a Technics SL-1401. I thought the receiver sounded better.
 
It should be close but I'll go with the 50 watter until the levels go beyond 100 db. On a different pair of speakers, i may have voted the other way.

2252 by a few hairs.
 
Recently, I heard the 2265 and 2285B at my home and then played my 2500 immediately afterwards. The 2285B was the clear winner for being sweeter AND for having enough power to fill out the lower octaves. The 2500 is one of the nicer MONSTERS but in this company, the sweetness is a degree less.
 
Interesting shootout.

When it comes to a contest between my 2600 and my 2270, the big boy clearly comes out on top. My AR-LSTs are not very efficient, however, and the 2270 is legendary for its dislike of 4 ohm loads, so probably not a fair contest.

My money's on the 2500.
 
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