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50 Years Ago Today...

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savatage1973

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50 years ago today, a spark from a train going over a tressel spanning the Cuyahoga River in Cleveland, OH, resulted in a fire on the river that damaged several RR bridges, and became the "spark" that ignited what is now the "environmental movement" that we all know.

More than 15 fires (some far more serious than the one June 22nd, 1969) are well-documented as far back as 1952.

June 22nd, 1969 was just the "wake-up call" that kind of "rattled the cage", and started us down the path we are now on. Lest we never forget.

Grab a bottle (or three or six) of Burning River Ale by Great Lakes Brewing and enjoy!

NO POLITICS PLEASE! This was a "time and place" in history--leave it at that.
 
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I grew up south of Cleveland so I remember that incident very well. Unfortunately it took an event like that to wake everybody up to the environmental mess that had been made.
 
I remember it well, but I was only 10 years old at the time, so had no real understanding of the significance or future implications of the event. I grew up in the "rust belt" where every river had a steel mill or other industrial facility right on the water, and industrial accidents and occupational injuries/illnesses/fatalities were just a part of life for those who worked there.

Later in life (while working in the chemical/phamaceutical industry), I participated in an "amnesty" program with the EPA (working in conjunction with a group of major chemical and industrial manufacturing companies) to audit environmental/worker health and safety records from facilities (many still in operation) dating back as far as 1918.

These companies actually did keep fairly detailed records (even back then), but there was no EPA or any other reporting/regulatory agency at that time. The purpose of the program was to collect and evaluate this historical data, and the incentive was no threat of penalties/retribution to the participating companies for "sins" of the past. For those curious, the program was the TSCA Section 8e compliance program (falling under the Toxic Substances Control Act of 1976). The EPA (as we know it) was actually not formally established until December, 1970, OSHA, not until April, 1971.

I spent the better part of over a year poring through some of these records, and was just "shocked"--not by the horrendous environmental "disasters", workplace fatalities and work-related illnesses, but also by how legitimately concerned the companies were--way back into the 20's through early 60's. In most cases, it was a matter of "we just didn't know"--yet. They were working toward not having fish-kills in the river, and if people were getting sick/dying as a result of exposure to a particular process, they were doing their best to provide medical care and pension compensation to those affected--without a room full of greedy lawyers waiting in the wings.

I am, by no means, a staunch defender of the current state of the industry, but having read tens of thousands of pages of hand-written/hand-typed internal memos, reports, scientific studies, and directives to actually believe that it was mostly about all we didn't know or could even remotely anticipate, at the time.

By 1969, yeah, that (the Cuyahoga River fire) was a "travesty", and shouldn't have happened, but it serves its place in history.
 
No flames (grin) but seems appropriate ...


Burn on, big river, burn on
Burn on, big river, burn on

Now the Lord can make you tumble
And the Lord can make you turn
And the Lord can make you overflow
But the Lord can't make you burn

Burn on, big river, burn on
Burn on, big river, burn on
 
hjames said:
No flames (grin) but seems appropriate ...


Burn on, big river, burn on
Burn on, big river, burn on

Now the Lord can make you tumble
And the Lord can make you turn
And the Lord can make you overflow
But the Lord can't make you burn

Burn on, big river, burn on
Burn on, big river, burn on
Click to expand...

I was totally waiting for someone to play the 'theme song' from major league! lol
 
If I remember correctly, something similar happened in Washington DC when trash accumulating on one side of the Potomac river caught fire and burned for about 7 hours. This would have been around 1968-1971.
 
savatage1973 said:
I remember it well, but I was only 10 years old at the time, so had no real understanding of the significance or future implications of the event. I grew up in the "rust belt" where every river had a steel mill or other industrial facility right on the water, and industrial accidents and occupational injuries/illnesses/fatalities were just a part of life for those who worked there.

Later in life (while working in the chemical/phamaceutical industry), I participated in an "amnesty" program with the EPA (working in conjunction with a group of major chemical and industrial manufacturing companies) to audit environmental/worker health and safety records from facilities (many still in operation) dating back as far as 1918.

These companies actually did keep fairly detailed records (even back then), but there was no EPA or any other reporting/regulatory agency at that time. The purpose of the program was to collect and evaluate this historical data, and the incentive was no threat of penalties/retribution to the participating companies for "sins" of the past. For those curious, the program was the TSCA Section 8e compliance program (falling under the Toxic Substances Control Act of 1976). The EPA (as we know it) was actually not formally established until December, 1970, OSHA, not until April, 1971.

I spent the better part of over a year poring through some of these records, and was just "shocked"--not by the horrendous environmental "disasters", workplace fatalities and work-related illnesses, but also by how legitimately concerned the companies were--way back into the 20's through early 60's. In most cases, it was a matter of "we just didn't know"--yet. They were working toward not having fish-kills in the river, and if people were getting sick/dying as a result of exposure to a particular process, they were doing their best to provide medical care and pension compensation to those affected--without a room full of greedy lawyers waiting in the wings.

I am, by no means, a staunch defender of the current state of the industry, but having read tens of thousands of pages of hand-written/hand-typed internal memos, reports, scientific studies, and directives to actually believe that it was mostly about all we didn't know or could even remotely anticipate, at the time.

By 1969, yeah, that (the Cuyahoga River fire) was a "travesty", and shouldn't have happened, but it serves its place in history.
Click to expand...

savatage1973, thanks for sharing that explanation. Your summary helps us understand our history a good bit more.

Prost!
 
Cleveland had a significant fire during WW2. A east Ohio Gas company LNG storage tank leaked. The liquid natural gas traveled through passageways (sewers, creek beds) and then it eventually ignited, with a force "calculated to equal to a 2.43 kt TNT explosion or 1/6 of the Hiroshima Atomic Bomb" (wikipedia, link below)

read more here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cleveland_East_Ohio_Gas_explosion
more here, including a picture: https://case.edu/ech/articles/e/east-ohio-gas-co-explosion-and-fire

This event caused utility regulators to limit LNG growth through the 60-90's. Today, though, cheap US gas is being exported through many new LNG plants.
More on this topic here: https://www.gasstrategies.com/sites/default/files/download/lng-outlook-2019.pdf
 
SoCal Sam said:
How did anyone survive the 50's and 60's?
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No kidding, like the nuclear meltdown at the Santa Susana Field Laboratory nuclear power plant in 1959.
Big time Boeing cover up, some experts claim more radiation was released than Three Mile Island.

5beb669186304d000aafaf9b-eight.jpg
 
tubed said:
No kidding, like the nuclear meltdown at the Santa Susana Field Laboratory nuclear power plant in 1959.
Big time Boeing cover up, some experts claim more radiation was released than Three Mile Island.

5beb669186304d000aafaf9b-eight.jpg
Click to expand...

Remember the sickly sweet smell of orange smog? Lead paint in homes? How about asbestos home insulation? People were told smoking was good for you. And, no one wore seat belts or wore motorcycle helmets.

Young people had is rough compared to today's millenials. There were two drafts for two wars. Incredible times and yet people still look fondly back at what they thought was a simpler time.
 
2011etec said:
http://www.chicagonow.com/dennis-by...older-generation-didnt-have-that-green-thing/
Click to expand...

Love that article, and will be passing it on, because that's how I grew up--the whole way from the cloth diapers and hand-me-down clothes, to the paper bags and returnable bottles, and hanging clothes on a line to dry. One TV in the living room, and if it went on the fritz, the repairman came to your house and fixed it--you didn't just pitch it and run off to Best Buy and get a new/bigger/better one. If the toaster broke, you had it fixed--I still have my grandmother's old Sunbeam toaster--has to be at least 80 years old, and AFAIK was only repaired once--and it still works (arguably better than my new disposable POS).

We discovered that solvent and lead-based paints could better protect our homes, and asbestos was a great fire-retardant and insulative material. We figured out that certain chemicals could kill insects and weeds, without killing our crops, but we didn't know what the effects of their manufacture, use, and/or the disposal of their by-products would eventually be.

My great-grandmother died of "consumption"--the generic term for what we now know as cancer. No one knew specifically what it was, much less which of the Baskin-Robbins 31 "flavors" of the disease it was, or how to treat it.

"Way back when" people just got sick and either lived or died. "Modern medicine" is exactly that--pretty modern--as in the last 100-150 years (if that)--most of it in the last 50 years.

Madame Curie died as a result of the very research that earned her Nobel prize status. Alfred Nobel went to his grave tortured with guilt over what he had accomplished.

Let's just file this under "Hindsight is always 20/20", but OTOH, totally debunks "What you don't know, can't/won't hurt you".
 
SoCal Sam said:
Remember the sickly sweet smell of orange smog? Lead paint in homes? How about asbestos home insulation? People were told smoking was good for you. And, no one wore seat belts or wore motorcycle helmets.

Young people had is rough compared to today's millenials. There were two drafts for two wars. Incredible times and yet people still look fondly back at what they thought was a simpler time.
Click to expand...
SoCal Sam, you are on target, as 20th century changes were not always an improvement across the board. One uncle was a "fireman" in England during WWII, and the asbestos suit he wore was the source (can't prove that) of his passing away at 50.

I hope I don't post info that isn't appropriate for this thread, but here is more. I've seen the monument at Verdun during a course about WWI while I lived in Germany. It was built after the "hell" of WWI, and looking in the ground level windows to look into the basement shows nothing but bones. What was also emphasized was how the new technology needed during wars was amplified, with the goal of destruction. Gas, tanks, planes, machine guns, etc. All with one goal.
 
savatage1973 said:
Love that article, and will be passing it on, because that's how I grew up--the whole way from the cloth diapers and hand-me-down clothes, to the paper bags and returnable bottles, and hanging clothes on a line to dry. One TV in the living room, and if it went on the fritz, the repairman came to your house and fixed it--you didn't just pitch it and run off to Best Buy and get a new/bigger/better one. If the toaster broke, you had it fixed--I still have my grandmother's old Sunbeam toaster--has to be at least 80 years old, and AFAIK was only repaired once--and it still works (arguably better than my new disposable POS).

We discovered that solvent and lead-based paints could better protect our homes, and asbestos was a great fire-retardant and insulative material. We figured out that certain chemicals could kill insects and weeds, without killing our crops, but we didn't know what the effects of their manufacture, use, and/or the disposal of their by-products would eventually be.

My great-grandmother died of "consumption"--the generic term for what we now know as cancer. No one knew specifically what it was, much less which of the Baskin-Robbins 31 "flavors" of the disease it was, or how to treat it.

"Way back when" people just got sick and either lived or died. "Modern medicine" is exactly that--pretty modern--as in the last 100-150 years (if that)--most of it in the last 50 years.

Madame Curie died as a result of the very research that earned her Nobel prize status. Alfred Nobel went to his grave tortured with guilt over what he had accomplished.

Let's just file this under "Hindsight is always 20/20", but OTOH, totally debunks "What you don't know, can't/won't hurt you".
Click to expand...
Lots of good info you are sharing. Sometimes we have, and sometimes we haven't learned from the past.

Hand me downs? I understand that, as I am the youngest of all cousins, not just my family. And medicine has changed considerably, with "home visits" by physicians almost no longer an option.

Printed circuit boards are replaced, not repair a component. Digital communications are either all or nothing, and yes, I wish a cell phone would work with "static and noise" like the old days if someone needed help in a crisis.
 
maddog37 said:
20th century changes were not always an improvement across the board. One uncle was a "fireman" in England during WWII, and the asbestos suit he wore was the source (can't prove that) of his passing away at 50.
Click to expand...

See--you get it--and this is exactly my point. They just didn't know or could have anticipated that result (at the time). They knew that asbestos could provide greater protection from fire and heat than what was previously available. There is a very good chance that your uncle would not have survived WWII without the protection of that suit that most likely resulted in his untimely death. I know it is no consolation, but you have to admit that they "meant well" based on what they knew at the time.
 
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