80s/90s amp advice - Denon or…?

[G7065]

Looking for some opinions about decent mid-level integrated amps from the late 80s / early 90s era. Specifically the ‘classic’ black full-size separates. 80wpc RMS or higher.

The rest of the system is period Denon, so my first thought was to add a Denon amp so it all matches. However, availability of higher-end Denon integrated amps from that era is quite low in the UK - lots of low/mid range gear around but not much else. I have found a few models within budget (sub-$200) and available:

PMA-920
PMA-1060

Outside of Denon, some alternative options:

Yamaha AX-550
Marantz PM-52
Technics SU-V660
Technics SU-V60

I know condition of these 30-year-old amps will be key, listening is the best test, and speakers matter, etc… but buying from a distance with limited availability and budget. Which direction would you go in?
Have you had these amps or similar models? Are there particularly brands or models to avoid from this era due to known weaknesses or lack of parts to repair (if needed)?

Looking for a ‘full-bodied’ sound with bass more suited to rock music rather than tons of detail and brights for classical listening. Must have phono input too (pretty much eliminating NAD options).

Appreciate everyone’s thoughts and recommendations.

If it helps - my daily listens are a Sony STR-7065 and a Pioneer SX-750, and I’d be really disappointed if the newer system couldn’t hold its own against them…

 

[teal'c]

I don't have any experience with those, but if you run across a Technics that is "New Class A", that's some good sound. They come from around the same era.

 

[Karl vd Berg]

Check the Rotel RA-980BX, too... 100W/8R

https://audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/rotel-ra-980bx-nudies.454903/

 

[KentTeffeteller]

Looking for some opinions about decent mid-level integrated amps from the late 80s / early 90s era. Specifically the ‘classic’ black full-size separates. 80wpc RMS or higher.

The rest of the system is period Denon, so my first thought was to add a Denon amp so it all matches. However, availability of higher-end Denon integrated amps from that era is quite low in the UK - lots of low/mid range gear around but not much else. I have found a few models within budget (sub-$200) and available:

PMA-920
PMA-1060

Outside of Denon, some alternative options:

Yamaha AX-550
Marantz PM-52
Technics SU-V660
Technics SU-V60

I know condition of these 30-year-old amps will be key, listening is the best test, and speakers matter, etc… but buying from a distance with limited availability and budget. Which direction would you go in?
Have you had these amps or similar models? Are there particularly brands or models to avoid from this era due to known weaknesses or lack of parts to repair (if needed)?

Looking for a ‘full-bodied’ sound with bass more suited to rock music rather than tons of detail and brights for classical listening. Must have phono input too (pretty much eliminating NAD options).

Appreciate everyone’s thoughts and recommendations.

If it helps - my daily listens are a Sony STR-7065 and a Pioneer SX-750, and I’d be really disappointed if the newer system couldn’t hold its own against them…

These newer amps don't sound as good as what you own already. Stick to your classics.

 

[G7065]

These newer amps don't sound as good as what you own already. Stick to your classics.

No worries there, this is not to replace my existing systems, just mentioned them as a point of reference

 

[68custom]

Integra / onkyo 504.

 

[teal'c]

No worries there, this is not to replace my existing systems, just mentioned them as a point of reference

Well in that case you should check out some NAD stuff. Great sound and should be easier to find there than here.

 

[G7065]

The search continues… I tried a 1991 Yamaha AX-550 (80wpc), but it had the dreaded input selector fault so I passed.

Then have trialled a recently serviced 1995 Yamaha AX-590 (100wpc)… it is definitely loud but something is missing in the sound. It sounds like a detailed vocal track playing over the top of a muddy low register track, rather than one glorious piece of music. This might be the Yamaha sound of that era which I’m not used to, so will road test it some more before a final decision on whether to keep or look elsewhere…

Well in that case you should check out some NAD stuff. Great sound and should be easier to find there than here.

Thanks for the suggestion - I discounted NAD as they tend to lack a phono input unlike other integrated amps (although one can be added). Might give them another look if I dont settle on the Yamaha.

 

[KentTeffeteller]

The search continues… I tried a 1991 Yamaha AX-550 (80wpc), but it had the dreaded input selector fault so I passed.

Then have trialled a recently serviced 1995 Yamaha AX-590 (100wpc)… it is definitely loud but something is missing in the sound. It sounds like a detailed vocal track playing over the top of a muddy low register track, rather than one glorious piece of music. This might be the Yamaha sound of that era which I’m not used to, so will road test it some more before a final decision on whether to keep or look elsewhere…

Thanks for the suggestion - I discounted NAD as they tend to lack a phono input unlike other integrated amps (although one can be added). Might give them another look if I dont settle on the Yamaha.

Older NAD has phono inputs. The NAD gear is excellent, well made, and nice sounding. Why not some NAD in your life? Parasound is another brand worth considering too.

 

[teal'c]

Thanks for the suggestion - I discounted NAD as they tend to lack a phono input unlike other integrated amps (although one can be added). Might give them another look if I dont settle on the Yamaha.

NAD external pre-amps have a reputation for quality sound, but I've never heard one. I went from FM to cassettes then CDs. I own three albums and I've never heard them.

 

[G7065]

Couldn’t find a NAD that fit my brief (wpc + budget) available. In general, there seems to be a real lack of availability of this type of amplifier in the UK at the moment, even at higher budgets. Plenty of 30-40 wpc amps, but that’s not what I’m looking for.

I did manage to track down a well cared for Denon PMA-880r, which is 75wpc. Having been disappointed by the Yamaha(s) with my speakers, I figured this would be worth a try.

I think we have a winner - nice quality construction and well balanced sound for lots of music types. Plus it matches the rest of the separates, which isn’t a prerequisite but nice to have. To me, it sounds far less fatiguing than the Yamaha, albeit perhaps still a bit bright. If you come across one of these and want a good quality mid level 90s amp, I’d give it the thumbs up.

While I’m here, I also road tested a Technics SU-X880 (80wpc DIN), and was quite impressed. It’s a midi unit but punches above its size. One for another system another day, perhaps!

 

[bigaltx24]

Look for a PMA-900V, it's a beast or PMA-757 / 777

 

[LWB]

I recently refurb'd a PMA-700V and I'm very impressed with it. It's easy to work on, I replaced all the caps - upgrading to WIMA's when I could - and changed metal film resistors from the original carbon composites.

 

[MitsuMan]

I'm partial to the Onkyo Integra integrated amps from that era. The A-8xxx series in particular. I passed on an A-8870 a few years ago and I'm kicking myself.

 

[AudioAvarice]

Some of the 90's Pioneer integrateds were pretty good, the A300, and A400 series especially.

 

[Oilmaster]

Sony TA-F444ES.

It's often overlooked/ignored due its famous brother 555ES (and successors thereof).
But the 444 has specs that are hard to find in the sub $200 range:
- power bandwidth 5Hz-80kHz
- frequency response 5Hz-200kHz
- THD 0.006% @ 6 ohms, 0.004% @ 8 ohms
- damping factor 125
- slew rate 125 V/usec (250 V/usec inside)
- MC and MM phono cartridges, 95dB separation (quite reasonable RIAA preamp with dual JFET input stage)
- residual noise less than 25uV
- Single transformer, but dedicated secondaries for each channel (incl. rectifiers and PSU caps)
- current transfer technology inside
- JFET/BJT cascode input stage
- cascode VAS stage
- triple output stage (not 3 pair output devices)
- High Ft / linear Hfe BJT output devices

And all that excellent artillery for around $100-200....

A couple of selected capacitors would need replacement, some multi-tour trimmers, new relay.... and it sounds awesome.

Another very interesting unit is the Kenwood KA-9X; circuit-wise high level as the TA-F444ES, but Kenwood style (3 differential input stage, starting with JFETs), the Sigma output design (damping factor near to 1000). But often needing more servicing as it is the typical Kenwood chaos inside, incl. some fragile push switches, overheating TO-220 transistors, etc. But after a more elaborate rebuild a very impressive performance.

 

[avionic]

Specifically the ‘classic’ black full-size separates. 80wpc RMS or higher.

Integrated amplifiers are not considered separates.

This is considered separate's

 

[Bob in WI]

I'm partial to the Onkyo Integra integrated amps from that era. The A-8xxx series in particular. I passed on an A-8870 a few years ago and I'm kicking myself.

Have had the NAD, Yamaha (that was a mid level unit), Technics Integrated, Carver. Preferred the Onkyo Integra & stopped shopping.
Good luck in your search. Everyone likes something different.

 

[E2]

Okay, bored, two month old thread. My Denon 980R sounds great! Not surprised that the OP was pleased with the Denon he chose.

 

[G7065]

Okay, bored, two month old thread. My Denon 980R sounds great! Not surprised that the OP was pleased with the Denon he chose.

A few months in with the 860R and it has continued to deliver the goods, nice unit. Would be interested to hear the higher range models of that era. I was wondering what ‘R’ meant and why only some models had it at the end of the model code - turns out it’s ‘Remote’ (included). Sometimes it really is that simple .