A humble Audio Technica LP60x made me get back into vinyl

[Lavane]

If this is a record wear concern, there is a YouTube video addressing that for low-cost, heavy-tracking turntables. It's a fun video, and Vwestlife's explanation of the procedures he chose is interesting.

Vwestlife used multiple copies of a gospel album by The Marcus Family (and perhaps an overabundance of religious jokes), and I have a gospel album by Georgia Lee that I picked up used for $3.00 in 2022 that has been played on my LP60X well over 100 times by now, plus a few dozen more times on the LP120XUSB with a variety of styli, but mostly the ATN-XP3 stylus tracking at 3-3.5 grams. My experience is not a record wear study, and I just have the one copy from the bargain bins, but it continues to sound great to me, still finding its way onto my turntable just about every week.

That was kind of interesting. But it does suggest there are some variables.
Especially when it comes to the vinyl itself. New vs old, recycled, god or bad pressing, etc. but overall a record can last a long time if its taken care of, and the stylus is replaced when it should be.

 

[lini]

What's the difference between the AT 91 (yellow) and AT91R (red)?

Actually, compared to the ATN91 the ATN91R doesn't only sport an alu cantilever, but also a different damper ring for the cantilever suspension. Hence there might be a difference in terms of tracking ability.

Greetings from Munich!

Manfred / lini

 

[jrtrent]

Music to my ears this thread is. I regularly post about loving my time with the AT91. These AT conicals are just so great sounding and such great values. I often wonder about the fact that the engineers who created phono recording/capture and playback systems did so with conical styli. Only years later did ellipticals arrive, followed by advanced shapes. People most often describe more 'air', 'shimmer', 'detail' and a 'wider soundstage' as resulting from the use of advanced styli, in addition to less sibilance.

Still, if the entire format was built around conicals, it seems a legitimate question whether vinyl is 'supposed' to sound like what we get from conicals. To me, once I get used to the 'directness' I get from the conicals I find the 'air' and 'shimmer' from more advanced shapes to not sound as good to me. It almost sounds to me as if effects have been layered onto the music, which I find distracting.

While I'm more interested in the Fluance RT80, I came across an RT81 review by James Barber for Tech Hive, and he had a take on the built-in preamp that seems to echo your thoughts about conical styli.

"Listening to 'Welcome to New York' from Taylor Swift’s 2014 album 1989, the Fluance RT81, its Texas Instruments phono stage, and the Audio Technica AT95E cartridge deliver what I can best describe as a tight presentation. There’s a real sense that the mix hangs together as a coherent whole rather than as a collection of individual tracks. That denseness is one of the factors that contributes to the romance of “natural” analog sound. The AT95E is an excellent entry-level cartridge, but it’s the Texas Instruments phono preamplifier that’s creating that pleasing “vinyl” sound.

I switched off the preamp and routed the turntable through the outstanding Andover Audio SpinStage phono preamp I reviewed recently. The SpinStage is tuned more for contemporary ears that value the details revealed by high-res digital audio streams. There’s more differentiation between instruments with the SpinStage, and an overall sharper sound. If you’re nostalgic for the way LPs sounded on a good home stereo in the 1970s, or just for the idea of the old days if you’re not old enough to have lived through era, the built-in phono stage will be perfect for the long haul."

Maybe now I have an extra reason to look forward to an RT80, the AT91 cartridge plus the built-in phono stage.

Maybe part of what I experience is simply pleasure at getting such good results for such little money in a hobby that IMO has become wildly expensive in the last few years.

That's where my interest has been lately, too, and you can't spend much less money than I have on my current setup of LP60X, Sony STR-DH190 receiver, and Dayton Audio B40 speakers (perhaps not as good as my Cambridge Audio speakers, but I just love playing them, maybe in part because they're just $60 for the pair). My Koss QZ99 headphones didn't exactly break the bank, either.

 

[Lavane]

While I'm more interested in the Fluance RT80, I came across an RT81 review by James Barber for Tech Hive, and he had a take on the built-in preamp that seems to echo your thoughts about conical styli.

"Listening to 'Welcome to New York' from Taylor Swift’s 2014 album 1989, the Fluance RT81, its Texas Instruments phono stage, and the Audio Technica AT95E cartridge deliver what I can best describe as a tight presentation. There’s a real sense that the mix hangs together as a coherent whole rather than as a collection of individual tracks. That denseness is one of the factors that contributes to the romance of “natural” analog sound. The AT95E is an excellent entry-level cartridge, but it’s the Texas Instruments phono preamplifier that’s creating that pleasing “vinyl” sound.

I switched off the preamp and routed the turntable through the outstanding Andover Audio SpinStage phono preamp I reviewed recently. The SpinStage is tuned more for contemporary ears that value the details revealed by high-res digital audio streams. There’s more differentiation between instruments with the SpinStage, and an overall sharper sound. If you’re nostalgic for the way LPs sounded on a good home stereo in the 1970s, or just for the idea of the old days if you’re not old enough to have lived through era, the built-in phono stage will be perfect for the long haul."

Maybe now I have an extra reason to look forward to an RT80, the AT91 cartridge plus the built-in phono stage.

That's where my interest has been lately, too, and you can't spend much less money than I have on my current setup of LP60X, Sony STR-DH190 receiver, and Dayton Audio B40 speakers (perhaps not as good as my Cambridge Audio speakers, but I just love playing them, maybe in part because they're just $60 for the pair). My Koss QZ99 headphones didn't exactly break the bank, either.

Personaly the Fluance 81 would be my choice over the model 80.
You can always get a conical stylus for the the AT95E if you wanted a conical stylus. Then save your money for a better phono preamp later.
When I ordered my U-turn orbit custom, I ordered it without the built in phono stage. That one wasn't very good. It was a first Gen turntable too. Maybe the built in pre's arw better now? I dunno. But the built in phono preamps in turntables tend to be pretty simple single gain stage preamps.

 

[Lavane]

For some the built in phono stage in the Fluance TT may work for them just fine.
Ive had and have lot of different preamps, intagrated amps, amps, and stand alone phono preamps over the years. Some of the phono preamp sections sounded pretty darn good, others not so much. Everyone's ears are different and what sounds good to you may not sound good to someone else. But there have been a few down right awful phono preamp sections I've heard over the years.
When it comes down to it, all that matters is how a system sounds to you, no one else.

 

[jrtrent]

Personaly the Fluance 81 would be my choice over the model 80.
You can always get a conical stylus for the the AT95E if you wanted a conical stylus.

I've owned an AT95E, and I've also owned what may, in effect, be an AT95E with a conical stylus in the form of a Linn Basik cartridge (my older brother has been using one of my old Basik bodies with ATN95E styli for well over 30 years, and loves it). I've also used the VM95E with conical styli. I'm not saying those are bad cartridges, but in comparison I have preferred the sound I get from the AT91 family of cartridges (as mentioned before, that includes the CN5625AL, AT91R, one rebranded for Denon, and the AT3600L in my LP60X). To my ears, anyway, the cartridge body matters, too, not just the stylus shape.

For some the built in phono stage in the Fluance TT may work for them just fine.
Ive had and have lot of different preamps, intagrated amps, amps, and stand alone phono preamps over the years. Some of the phono preamp sections sounded pretty darn good, others not so much. Everyone's ears are different and what sounds good to you may not sound good to someone else. But there have been a few down right awful phono preamp sections I've heard over the years.
When it comes down to it, all that matters is how a system sounds to you, no one else.

Yes, and I think that was Mr. Barber's point. In a separate phono stage review, he mentioned that the Andover Audio SpinStage had better separation, longer-lasting decay of chime-like tones, and an immediate upgrade in detail, and yet the built-in stage was giving him a nostalgic 1970's effect, creating a "natural" and "pleasing" vinyl sound. Because of this, he thought that at least for some people "the built-in phono stage will be perfect for the long haul."

Earlier today, I was ready to place an order for the RT80, but as I listened to my LP60X I got to thinking I'm just chasing the novelty of a new audio toy. The little AT gives me music that is pleasant, engaging, and well suited to the ultra-budget bedroom system I'm using it in. Buying the LP120XUSB last year proved to be something of a misstep, with the LP60X proving to sound better to my ears and to be so much more convenient in operation. I think I just need to stay happy with what I've got.

 

[Lavane]

I've owned an AT95E, and I've also owned what may, in effect, be an AT95E with a conical stylus in the form of a Linn Basik cartridge (my older brother has been using one of my old Basik bodies with ATN95E styli for well over 30 years, and loves it). I've also used the VM95E with conical styli. I'm not saying those are bad cartridges, but in comparison I have preferred the sound I get from the AT91 family of cartridges (as mentioned before, that includes the CN5625AL, AT91R, one rebranded for Denon, and the AT3600L in my LP60X). To my ears, anyway, the cartridge body matters, too, not just the stylus shape.


Yes, and I think that was Mr. Barber's point. In a separate phono stage review, he mentioned that the Andover Audio SpinStage had better separation, longer-lasting decay of chime-like tones, and an immediate upgrade in detail, and yet the built-in stage was giving him a nostalgic 1970's effect, creating a "natural" and "pleasing" vinyl sound. Because of this, he thought that at least for some people "the built-in phono stage will be perfect for the long haul."

Earlier today, I was ready to place an order for the RT80, but as I listened to my LP60X I got to thinking I'm just chasing the novelty of a new audio toy. The little AT gives me music that is pleasant, engaging, and well suited to the ultra-budget bedroom system I'm using it in. Buying the LP120XUSB last year proved to be something of a misstep, with the LP60X proving to sound better to my ears and to be so much more convenient in operation. I think I just need to stay happy with what I've got.

Im curious as to what it was about the LP120XUSB you didn't like.
I would up buying an AT LP1240XUSB on sale myself. It has a heavy aluminum rubberized base and works great. Some have complained about the Gimble being too loose from the factory, but I didn't have that problem.
I put a Nagaoka MP-110 cartridge on it and have been pretty happy with it.
One of the reasons I like some of the older cartridges like the AT91's and Shure M75's etc. is they're just very easy to listen too. They aren't the most detailed sounding cartridges, but they do have a nice overall tone I like.
The The AT3600L has a kind of fat warm sound thats pleasant.
I need to get another turntable to mount it on to use for those records that aren't in the best shape. The conical stylus can be more forgiving.
My neighbor has the LP120XUSB, but I haven't heard it.
I just wish the LP1240 had a hinged cover. I absolutely hate the cheap bendy hinges on my Orbit Custom. I have to open it up two or three times before it will stay up. I also had to buy a second belt for it. I put it on the motor pulley to play a double 45rpm album and it stretched it out enough it would just fall off the platter when I put it back on the 33rpm pulley. So now I have a 33 & 45 belt.

 

[jrtrent]

Im curious as to what it was about the LP120XUSB you didn't like.

It's not that I didn't like the LP120XUSB, just that I like the sound of the LP60X more, and its automatic operation is a much better fit for a bedroom system since it lets me put on a record, lay down on the bed to listen to it, and feel free to let a nap come over me since the turntable will shut off by itself.

I would up buying an AT LP1240XUSB on sale myself. It has a heavy aluminum rubberized base and works great. Some have complained about the Gimble being too loose from the factory, but I didn't have that problem.
I put a Nagaoka MP-110 cartridge on it and have been pretty happy with it.
One of the reasons I like some of the older cartridges like the AT91's and Shure M75's etc. is they're just very easy to listen too. They aren't the most detailed sounding cartridges, but they do have a nice overall tone I like.
The The AT3600L has a kind of fat warm sound thats pleasant.
I need to get another turntable to mount it on to use for those records that aren't in the best shape. The conical stylus can be more forgiving.

Shortly after getting the LP120XUSB plus an ATN-XP3 stylus about a year ago, I wrote, "So far, the new 'table/cartridge is strikingly different from what I had before. One review of the LP60X's AT3600L cartridge said, "The AT3600L is a sonic delight. It may not be the most accurate or detailed cartridge around, but it is a very easy listen and thoroughly entertaining. Its warm tones and gentle treble will appeal to a lot of people. . . I have come across few other cartridges that can match its charm." Having used it for nearly 3 years, I am in agreement with that description. The VM95/XP3 on the new turntable is, so far, giving a much bolder, brighter, more detailed presentation. My records sound more exciting, but only time will tell if I end up finding them as satisfying."

I've enjoyed the LP120XUSB, especially after replacing the Bose table radio I had been using with a receiver and a pair of bookshelf speakers, the receiver's tone controls letting me get an even more pleasing sound from it. But a few weeks ago I gave the LP60X a new belt and stylus for some direct comparisons, and not only do my ears just like it better, its automatic operation has me playing more records under more conditions (for example, as background music while engaged in other tasks) simply because it doesn't need my immediate attention at the end of a side.

My neighbor has the LP120XUSB, but I haven't heard it.
I just wish the LP1240 had a hinged cover. I absolutely hate the cheap bendy hinges on my Orbit Custom. I have to open it up two or three times before it will stay up. I also had to buy a second belt for it. I put it on the motor pulley to play a double 45rpm album and it stretched it out enough it would just fall off the platter when I put it back on the 33rpm pulley. So now I have a 33 & 45 belt.

A friend of mine does the two belt thing for switching speeds with his Rega, too. I own just one 45 rpm record, a 7" freebie (including a duet with Roy Orbison!) that I found in a box set of Emmylou Harris albums, but it is nice that a simple push of a button gets the LP60X up to speed.