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adding insulation to commercial ice maker?

gadget73

gadget73

junk junkie
Subscriber
This is kind of a thought experiment here. I've got a situation where I have a commercial ice machine like you'd find in a hotel that runs too much. Its in an un-cooled space with not great ventilation. I realize this is the primary issue, but there isn't much I can do about it. When its 90F outside, the air around the machine is right around 100F when its running. This causes the ice to melt, which makes the machine run, which makes heat, etc. The bottom hoppers on these things are essentially just a cooler with a drain plumbed in at the bottom.

I was thinking of maybe adding some foam board insulation to the outside of the bin to slow the ice loss. Anyone know if thats a terrible idea for some reason? I was thinking maybe sticking it to the sides with dots of silicone. I get that it won't be pretty but functionality is more important here.
 
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gadget73 said:
This is kind of a thought experiment here. I've got a situation where I have a commercial ice machine like you'd find in a hotel that runs too much. Its in an un-cooled space with not great ventilation. I realize this is the primary issue, but there isn't much I can do about it. When its 90F outside, the air around the machine is right around 100F when its running. This causes the ice to melt, which makes the machine run, which makes heat, etc. The bottom hoppers on these things are essentially just a cooler with a drain plumbed in at the bottom.

I was thinking of maybe adding some foam board insulation to the outside of the bin to slow the ice loss. Anyone know if thats a terrible idea for some reason? I was thinking maybe sticking it to the sides with dots of silicone. I get that it won't be pretty but functionality is more important here.
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Yeah, that might help. Anything to keep the heat out of the bin.
 
There are adhesives specifically for foam board insulation. I'm not sure but silicone adhesive may melt the foamboard. As long as the motor can get ventilation the more insulation you can add the better. Any chance of shading the space the ice maker is in or painting the outside wall(s) white to cut down on solar heat gain?
 
Its sort of a two box deal. The ice maker itself sits on top of the bin and dumps in through a hole in the top of the bin. I'd only be putting insulation around the bottom part, definitely not blocking the refrigeration setup.

This thing lives inside, but the problem is it lives jammed into a corner of a dead end hallway. There is a window next to it with an exhaust fan, but there is not really anywhere to get air in to really get a decent draft to pull the heat out. The air intakes are on the side of the machine, and the exhaust is out the back. The two sides have about 8" to a wall, and the back is about 6" to a different wall. The front panel is left off so it can pull air in from the front, otherwise it just won't work because of all the hot air being sucked back through. Everything about the location is terrible but there isn't anywhere else to go with it unfortunately. If I can rotate the thing 90 degrees and make up some ductwork to directly dump the hot air out through the window it would help but I don't know if there is quite enough space for that to happen.

foam board adhesive, will keep that in mind. Thanks. I was just thinking something I could get loose again if needed for whatever reason. Not going to butter it with adhesive of any sort, just some dots here and there to keep it in place.

Have to take some measurements to see how many sheets I need. Took a quick look at the cost of that stuff at the big box stores. When the heck did a sheet of 2 inch foam start to cost 50 bucks?!
 
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If this is the building that you maintain and an increase in the electric bill is acceptable, could you put an A/C unit in the window?
 
When you apply the foam, make sure it is attached with the all the outer edge is blocked all around the perimeter; so that air cannot run between the foam and the body of the ice maker. Just a reminder that wood can be a better insulator than foam.
 
OBMG74 said:
If this is the building that you maintain and an increase in the electric bill is acceptable, could you put an A/C unit in the window?
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there isn't power capacity to run one just now. The main ac is dead and we're trying to sub 120k btu of central air with two 10k btu window units. Ideally I'd like to cut down on both the power and water Bill's since both go up the more the ice maker runs. I figured insulation might be the more cost effective solution. A newer, smaller unit would be even better since this is 22 years old and has more capacity than we really need but that's also money that we don't have.
 
gadget73 said:
This is kind of a thought experiment here. I've got a situation where I have a commercial ice machine like you'd find in a hotel that runs too much. Its in an un-cooled space with not great ventilation. I realize this is the primary issue, but there isn't much I can do about it. When its 90F outside, the air around the machine is right around 100F when its running. This causes the ice to melt, which makes the machine run, which makes heat, etc. The bottom hoppers on these things are essentially just a cooler with a drain plumbed in at the bottom.

I was thinking of maybe adding some foam board insulation to the outside of the bin to slow the ice loss. Anyone know if thats a terrible idea for some reason? I was thinking maybe sticking it to the sides with dots of silicone. I get that it won't be pretty but functionality is more important here.
Click to expand...
Yes, I would think so, gadget73, foam board, especially foil backed 1" or thicker glued with dots of silicone adhesive should help with with reducing it`s compressor cycle time by keeping the contents (ice) at the internal freezing temperature.
2" thick foam board applied if possible would be even better on all the units finished cabinet walls, but the door, as that might be too bulky of extension of it`s thickness.
Improved ventilation of the area were it resides if possible should also be helpful to reduce the unit`s thermal conversion (condenser) waste heat load.
FWIW.
 
gadget73 said:
Its sort of a two box deal. The ice maker itself sits on top of the bin and dumps in through a hole in the top of the bin. I'd only be putting insulation around the bottom part, definitely not blocking the refrigeration setup.

This thing lives inside, but the problem is it lives jammed into a corner of a dead end hallway. There is a window next to it with an exhaust fan, but there is not really anywhere to get air in to really get a decent draft to pull the heat out. The air intakes are on the side of the machine, and the exhaust is out the back. The two sides have about 8" to a wall, and the back is about 6" to a different wall. The front panel is left off so it can pull air in from the front, otherwise it just won't work because of all the hot air being sucked back through. Everything about the location is terrible but there isn't anywhere else to go with it unfortunately. If I can rotate the thing 90 degrees and make up some ductwork to directly dump the hot air out through the window it would help but I don't know if there is quite enough space for that to happen.

foam board adhesive, will keep that in mind. Thanks. I was just thinking something I could get loose again if needed for whatever reason. Not going to butter it with adhesive of any sort, just some dots here and there to keep it in place.

Have to take some measurements to see how many sheets I need. Took a quick look at the cost of that stuff at the big box stores. When the heck did a sheet of 2 inch foam start to cost 50 bucks?!
Click to expand...
The both side foil covered foam board, IMO/E, is your best performing choice for this application, both in the wider choice of attachment adhesives, and increased thermal effectiveness per dollar spent value.

I had 1" foil covered foam board adhered with construction adhesion applied to both sides (inside/outside) of my 1997 constructed added attached car/smoking lounge garage`s concrete block walls (before the outside T1-11 & inside drywall was installed) so to moderate the wide outside swing of NE.FL. seasonal temperatures (high 90s ~ below freezing) making it easy and inexpensive to cool or heat that car garage/smoking lounge.
 
KingBubba said:
Just a reminder that wood can be a better insulator than foam.
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You might want to rethink that wrong statement, KB !
Captive air pockets will always provide greater insulation properties over any materials of greater density like drywall concrete, or wood, unless its uncompressed/packed fluffy wood shavings/sawdust placed in a captive void.

The greater the density of the material the greater it acts like a thermal capacitor.
 
I was thinking some flavor of closed cell foam for moisture reasons. Any sweat would be soaked into wood or open foam, and that's a mold problem waiting to happen.

The door I was going to leave alone, there is a fair air space below it anyway. The sides are where the bulk of the surface area is.
 
got to looking at it last night and took some measurements. Maybe its not as thermally bad as I thought, it doesn't sweat and its barely even cool to the touch. I did notice the door doesn't seal very well though, so maybe step one is some gasket material around the door to fix that problem and go from there.
 
Make sure the evap and condenser coils are clean. It will help it run efficiently. Maybe a fan or some type of airflow can keep the temp around ambient temps.
 
Did that when the condenser fan motor seized up and I had to extract it. Figured while the fan was out, there was never going to be a better time to clean it. I didn't have any way to really wash it but I was able to vacuum it from the fan side to get it in much better shape than it was.

The evaporator on this is actually the metal plate the ice freezes on. I gave it a run with vinegar a couple months ago and its pretty clean.

a lot of the problem is that there isn't real airflow. Its just one window with a fan, unfortunately nowhere for air to pull from to carry the heat out so the fan can only do so much. Its definitely better with the fan than without but if there was a second window to create some cross-flow it would make it much better.
 
I'd also mount a small box fan onto one of the intake vents. Heavy duty tie wraps should hold it in place.
 
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