BW 801 matrix series 80

[frommerstop]

Do you have the owner's manual for these? Later 800 Matrix series speaker had an optional Bass Alignment Filter to get those extra low Hz; plus there were aftermarket suppliers as well: Krell, JPS Labs, Listen Up/ Maughanbox. Don't know of the Series 80 called for the BAF...

No, the bass EQs were introduced for the latter vented designs. The original 801 used an acoustic suspension woofer, and was only rated 45-20 +/-2db, 85db sensitivity & a 37hz cabinet frequency (-3db).

From what I've heard, many studios did EQ them to extend the bass on their own though.
Apparently you could push them pretty flat down to 20hz ...IF, you had enough amplifier!

Here's a PDF of the original manual found on line...
http://www.bwgroupsupport.com/downloads/specsheets/bw/801 Brochure.pdf

 

[laup]

I have just got off the phone with a guy @ B&W HQ uk.

He confirmed the BAF were used for the S2 onwards, and were really to be used with vinyl. He said once CD came out they were irrelevant.....

He said they are very particular with speaker placement, and i must tinker with that first.

@ Audiomagnate it looks like i should be opening these bad boys up and looking for this cap.

I have a serious hard on for these buggers at the moment lol
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/110962000...X:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649#ht_1009wt_1397

 

[Zonker92]

There was no BAF for the 80s, but at some point they added a 1000 uf blocking cap in series with the woofer, which is NOT a good thing. If the blocking cap is present, it should be bypassed.

Can you please elaborate on the function and drawbacks of this cap? I just recapped my brother's 802 Series 80s and, in an abundance of caution, I replaced the old (and swelling) 1000s, with new parallel 500s. I can tell that as did the old ones, they store some electricity; after use the speakers hiss a bit before quieting down, even with the speaker cables disconnected.

 

[audiomagnate]

Can you please elaborate on the function and drawbacks of this cap? I just recapped my brother's 802 Series 80s and, in an abundance of caution, I replaced the old (and swelling) 1000s, with new parallel 500s. I can tell that as did the old ones, they store some electricity; after use the speakers hiss a bit before quieting down, even with the speaker cables disconnected.

It's just a "subsonic" filter that blocks extreme lows from the woofer. It wasn't present in the earliest versions, like mine, and doesn't show up on the hand drawn schematic of the crossover available at the B&W site. I'm 99% sure it was a knee jerk reaction to a bunch of blown woofers coming back from studios that were trying to make these 85 dB speakers play as loud as traditional studio monitors. In my restoration thread a fellow AKer has a graph that shows what damage this cap does. Amps should be direct coupled to woofers. Yank it!

Old big Infinities use blocking caps and I've done A/B comparisons from my listening chair switching them in and out. The cap adds a hump and decreases slam, especially on kick drums.

 

[laup]

Pull the left speaker apart to check the xover god the amount of whool lol covered whole floor

anyhow these cross overs look updated to me? the big red caps has 63uf written on them on the bottom cross over (last picture)


3162 and 3161 are serial numbers for my speakers, i see 3189 on the cross over

 

[audiomagnate]

Those are all original. It's the blue monster you want to jumper. Pretty amazing the amount of rock wool they stuffed in there isn't it?

 

[Zonker92]

It's just a "subsonic" filter that blocks extreme lows from the woofer. It wasn't present in the earliest versions, like mine, and doesn't show up on the hand drawn schematic of the crossover available at the B&W site. I'm 99% sure it was a knee jerk reaction to a bunch of blown woofers coming back from studios that were trying to make these 85 dB speakers play as loud as traditional studio monitors. In my restoration thread a fellow AKer has a graph that shows what damage this cap does. Amps should be direct coupled to woofers. Yank it!

Old big Infinities use blocking caps and I've done A/B comparisons from my listening chair switching them in and out. The cap adds a hump and decreases slam, especially on kick drums.

Cool; thanks!

 

[laup]

So just cut the blue bad boy out and join the connections then or just jumper wire between terminals, btw the blue cap is on the top crossover

 

[laup]

Pulled the buggers out, and put cross overs back in, now 11:20pm so ill have to rinse them tomorrow. to see if they have improved. i was debating putting a switch in but i can just cut the wire if need be

 

[Tetrode]

Getting the woofer closer to the floor like B&W intended will help reinforce the bass by minimizing the Allison boundary effect.

But if you really like the stands:thmbsp:

 

[audiomagnate]

Pulled the buggers out, and put cross overs back in, now 11:20pm so ill have to rinse them tomorrow. to see if they have improved. i was debating putting a switch in but i can just cut the wire if need be

Rinse? Anyway, mine are so old that they don't have that cap, but it's interesting that they put it on the midrange crossover. As far as stands go, mine sound muddy when placed right on the floor. I put them on cinder blocks (ghetto style!) which gets them a few inches off the ground and they sound much cleaner.

 

[laup]

Right jumping caps out helped a bit, noticed on the original brocher that the caps aren't on the xover, and they basically cut the track and slapped them in.

Im now a bit paranoid playin them loud lol.

Next steppp... more power..... 400watt per channel atleast.

 

[Gang-Twanger]

As far as stands go, mine sound muddy when placed right on the floor. I put them on cinder blocks (ghetto style!) which gets them a few inches off the ground and they sound much cleaner.

I did the same thing with my main speakers, except that they're solid concrete blocks (rather than the regular kind with the two big square holes). I picked up some veneered boards to lay between the blocks and my speakers. Gave me the 6 or so inches of extra height I needed. Maybe I can wrap the blocks in a nice walnut veneer to match.

I've heard the old Matrix series 801's before, and bass was not an issue (not to me at least). Surprised to see it mentioned here.

 

[audiomagnate]

Right jumping caps out helped a bit, noticed on the original brocher that the caps aren't on the xover, and they basically cut the track and slapped them in.

Im now a bit paranoid playin them loud lol.

Next steppp... more power..... 400watt per channel atleast.

Don't worry about playing them loud without the cap except unfiltered vinyl. I take my big Nak right up to clipping with them and have never bottomed or damaged them.

 

[frommerstop]

I did the same thing with my main speakers, except that they're solid concrete blocks (rather than the regular kind with the two big square holes). I picked up some veneered boards to lay between the blocks and my speakers. Gave me the 6 or so inches of extra height I needed. Maybe I can wrap the blocks in a nice walnut veneer to match.

I've heard the old Matrix series 801's before, and bass was not an issue (not to me at least). Surprised to see it mentioned here.

Low bass was surprisingly poor on the first generation 801s, both in depth, and quality. I played around with a few, back in the '80s, but it was very hard to control the mid bass bloom (seemed to have a bump around 60-70hz) in most rooms, tending to0 overload the room and make them sound bass heavy, and then the lower bass (below mid 40s, I'd guess), would roll off very quickly. That's the main reason they almost have to be placed on some sort of stand... even tall casters, like those used on many in studios, helps. It was all the more surprising given their low sensitivity, and the size of the enclosure. I believe that's why the subsequent models were mostly about redesigns & mods to improve that area - going to a ported "Matrix" enclosure, significant crossover changes, and adding a bass EQ box.. It was the bass of those first few versions of the 801s that pushed me towards the KEF 107. I found the 107 was demonstrably better in bass control, and went lower even without the KUBE... with it, there was no comparison. The 801s were, after all, designed as a "monitor", not necessarily for home audio use. As such, they were designed for peak spls, & power handling - both areas where they would easily out perform the KEFs. I think the B&W 802s were better in bass control, and seemed to go at least an octave lower than even the series 2 801s (at least without the bass EQ) in a home environment. Before I bought my 107/2s in the early '90s, I listened very closely to the B&W 802s... I considered them the KEF's closest competitor.

 

[laup]

Just found someone, with a pair of Myryad ma 240s, got em both for £500, bargain!

 

[laup]

Got the 2 myryad amps i was after, and gosh they sorted it right out, Id like to thank all u peeps for the advice and audiomagnate for his pointers.

These speakers really do fly with enough power

 

[canuckaudiog]

Wow those look great!! Nice work! It's amazing some of the talent here at the AK board I must say.

The only thing I could suggest is I think they would sound better if they were facing forwards (as in not turned in), and sitting closer to the TV. But of course, they're your speakers you do what you want with them.

Either way, very very nice work here. I like the black on wood actually, they "pop" in a good way.

 

[laup]

The speakers made me buy walnut furniture lol walnut and black glass looks great together my man

i have moved them in closer that is where they usually sit, ill try front facing To be honest I actually haven't tried that

 

[good karma]

How are those stands attached to the bottom of the speaker? Is there a full metal plate under the bottom or just fixed points?

I have read several threads addressing the modifications of the series 80 (mine are 2423 and 2424) and want to start with permanent stands similar to the ones in the photo. AUDIOMAGNATE, I am surprised you have not made stands with everything else you have done. I would also like advice on the crossovers, but one step at a time! Anyone who will volunteer a step by step process for the crossovers should message me (please).

I have a Luxman M4000 power amp and C5000 preamp from 1980 and have never had a problem producing high decibals. The bass is much tighter off the floor, but what height is best (a cinder block high?). Also, I haven't had a battery in the speakers since the originals died. Would a new battery improve the sound (they cost about $20.00 a piece).

I just joined after finding a few threads on the B&W 801s! Great site!