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Can cloth surrounds still be used?

tiga

tiga

Super Member
I know some speakers used cloth for their woofer surrounds (my KLH 20's come to mind). What is the difference between using cloth versus foam? If someone has an off-size speaker that needs re-foaming and a replacement isn't available, is there any reason a surround couldn't be fabricated out of cloth?

Thanks for the input!
Tiga
 
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How would you do the concentric corrugations and rubberizing them? Pretty difficult to do with home tools, if you ask me.
 
Cloth surrounds, or pleated paper and foam ones, for that matter, are just one part of the overall speaker design. If you change from one type to another, you won't have the same speaker, any more.
 
I think there are lots of reasons you couldn't do that. What are the measurements you need? Angled into the cone or flat?
NewFoamDiaMed-1.jpg
 
luvvinvinyl said:
Cloth surrounds, or pleated paper and foam ones, for that matter, are just one part of the overall speaker design. If you change from one type to another, you won't have the same speaker, any more.
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Yup. The surround material, whether it be paper, cloth, foam or rubber is chosen by the designer(s) for a reason.
Try to replace with a surround as close to the original's construction as possible.
 
These are for 3" Pioneer CS-77a tweeters. The cone size is 2 1/4" - doesn't seem to be anything out there that works well. Since there isn't much excursion with a tweeter and the original foam was completely flat, I thought another material may not be a big issue. ??
 
tiga said:
These are for 3" Pioneer CS-77a tweeters. The cone size is 2 1/4" - doesn't seem to be anything out there that works well. Since there isn't much excursion with a tweeter and the original foam was completely flat, I thought another material may not be a big issue. ??
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Search on eBay for item # 360312418054 It looks like it is the right size for the cone. You can check the other dimensions. I have bought surrounds from this seller and was very pleased with the quality and prompt delivery.
 
I have a pair that size now - it fits the metal casing almost perfect but it really covers a lot of the cone. I'm afraid it's going to affect the performance of the tweeter. The inner surround comes right up to the FB logo.

HTHMAN said:
Search on eBay for item # 360312418054 It looks like it is the right size for the cone. You can check the other dimensions. I have bought surrounds from this seller and was very pleased with the quality and prompt delivery.
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tiga said:
I have a pair that size now - it fits the metal casing almost perfect but it really covers a lot of the cone. I'm afraid it's going to affect the performance of the tweeter. The inner surround comes right up to the FB logo.
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Can you mount it to the underside of the cone? Since you already have the surrounds, I would install them and see how it sounds. You can always rip them off.
 
I don't think so. I'd really have to bend the cone to get it under there and I'm afraid I'll damage it. I may just mount it to the top and see how it sounds if I don't find a suitable alternative.

HTHMAN said:
Can you mount it to the underside of the cone? Since you already have the surrounds, I would install them and see how it sounds. You can always rip them off.
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We're on the same wavelength - I was looking at some tonight at Joanne's that was 2mm thick. Seemed a little too thick - I found some on ebay that was 1mm that may do the trick. I also thought the anti-static wrap they use on electronics would work great - the problem is I can only find it in white and pink.

DENNYDOG said:
The surrounds on these are flat, correct? If so you could cut some out of thin craft foam.
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Not sure what you mean by anti-static wrap. I think the 1mm stuff would work fine. I have a pair of CS-88A's that I like to use outside when I have friends over for bonfires. For some reason they just work better than anything else I have tried. The tweeters on them are the same way but haven't felt the need to repair them. The cones move so little I don't think it matters that they are cracked unless the surround is completely gone.

I have seen where someone had smeared rtv over the old surround. It looked like that worked but it was pretty uggly. I wonder if a spray type of rubberized undercoating would work? You would have to tape off what you don't want covered and be very careful not to get it on anything.
 
Ok now I know what you mean. Seller "wandy-foam" has the 1mm thick craft sheets which I think would work better. I've used the 2mm stuff on a few projects and think it's pretty decent stuff.

I don't know what it is about them but they just seem to work outside very well with great bass extension even though they are a sealed box. I've tried other speakers with bigger woofers and they don't seem to work as well for some reason. They aren't the end all for the best sound there can be but what can I say? Whatever works.
 
The CS-88a's don't seem to do well in my listening room - I think it's because the room is small and there are so many drivers that there are coherency issues (just my theory). The CS-77a's seem a lot tighter for me. I really need to give both sets more listening time but I'm anal about the tweeter surrounds.

Again - on the same wavelength - I e-mailed wandy-foam yesterday asking about the 1mm stuff. They have it in grey as well so I may order some and see how it works. The 2mm craft foam I saw at Joannes seem pretty dense and I was worried it wouldn't be flexible enough and would be too heavy and would affect the cones performance. (i worry too much).

This is what lead me down the road of considering using some grey cloth to serve surround purpose. It seems like any material that is light, has some flexibility and would support the cone would work in this case.
 
I think the excursion is so small that it wouldn't matter with the 1mm stuff. You are probably right about using anything that is light and flexible to replace the surround.
 
tiga said:
I don't think so. I'd really have to bend the cone to get it under there and I'm afraid I'll damage it. I may just mount it to the top and see how it sounds if I don't find a suitable alternative.
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I just did a couple small speakers under the cone. You do not bend the cone, you stretch the surround very slightly to get it under. Slide half of the surround under the cone, pull and turn the inside edge of the surround inward just a little and it slides right under. See my post.
http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=326996
 
The material used will have an effect on cone damping even using the same material of a different size will change the damping of the cone. Just my .02
 
If someone is contemplating using cloth for a new surround, I would think the cloth would have to be doped to make an airtight seal, just like it was originally.
 
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