CD Player/DAC Upgrade

[two sevens]

I am looking for some advice from those with more experience than I.

I want to upgrade my cd player, which is an older Nakamichi CDP-2A. My current set up includes a Scott 222c tube amp and Klipsch Fortes. My budget is around $500. Here are my questions (I know they have been asked before, but given my set up-what do you recommend?):

1) At my budget, am I better off going with a CDP or a DAC? (havent found a definitive answer to this and perhaps there isnt one!) FYI-I have a Marantz CD5000 which as a digital output for a dac.

2) I am eyeing players/dacs with the wolfson chips in them. What would you recommend? Used gear is not a problem here. I am also not tied to wolfson dac chips.

3) I am also intrigued by what I have read about Schiit Audio's Bifrost dac. Anyone who owns one care to share their impressions?

I realize that a lot has to do with the stereo gear involved and preference, but any ideas to steer me would be appreciated!!

 

[davidro]

The main question will be whether you use CDs OR computer files from your computer to feed the CDP or DAC. If you want to stick with CDs then you're better off upgrading your CDP. Otherwise DACs are the future.

 

[two sevens]

I use CDs. I dont have a setup yet to play files from my computer yet, though this is something I may look into in the future. Bottom line is that the formats I use currently are CDs and vinyl.

 

[Gridslayer]

The main question will be whether you use CDs OR computer files from your computer to feed the CDP or DAC. If you want to stick with CDs then you're better off upgrading your CDP. Otherwise DACs are the future.

You might just want to get a budget CDP with an optical out and get a DAC to do the processing... then you can use computer files as well, best of both worlds!

 

[two sevens]

Gridslayer, that sounds like good advice. Now that I am seriously considering a dac which will allow me to play CDs and computer files in the future, what do you recommend? I am seriously considering the schiit bifrost dac. It has gotten good reviews, the price is right and the dac and USB modules are upgradable for the future. Anyone have one? I would love to hear more about this or other recommendations. For the bifrost, there seem to be a lot of ' I just ordered this dac and I'm way excited!" posts and not a lot of reviews on impressions, comparisons to other dacs, etc yet...anyone?..

 

[davidro]

You might just want to get a budget CDP with an optical out and get a DAC to do the processing... then you can use computer files as well, best of both worlds!

From a CDP lovers point of view (which isn't mine) there may be some issue with the quality of CD transport....

 

[two sevens]

I would use my Marantz cd 5000 (came out early 2000s I think). Not high end by any means...my nakamichi doesn't even have a digital out...

 

[mash35231]

I bought a Cambridge Audio DacMagic a few months ago and run my Sonos and Denon 2910 universal player through it. The best of both worlds!

 

[whoaru99]

I would spend my money on a DAC. It's more useful than just a better player. Sure, some newer players are set up so you can use the internal DAC for other signals too, but I think standalone DAC is still an overall better way to allocate your $$.

 

[wsjoe]

It all depends on where you get the music. If you get alot of music through the internet then you definitely need a DAC. Someone stated to get a budget cd player and a nice DAC but I think these two have to be in the same quality. Half of the battle is the quality of the transport mechanism (laser pickup). Unfortunately, the nicer laser pickups are difficult to find or extinct. The other half is converting to analog sound (DAC) and these will also have to be quality stuff. I would get a decent cd player with optical and/or digital out (rca jack) and get a DAC that can take USB and optical or digital inputs. I would raise the budget to at least $700 and spend half each.

 

[Sanc]

Here is my take on why it may be more beneficial to get a DAC than a CDP. CDPs have moving parts, lasers, spinning discs, movement of mechanical parts. This can present problems with the disc read. Similar logic as to why Solid State HDs are better than regular Hard Disc Drives.

I personally think the best way to play digital PCM formats is by storing them on an SSD and using a DAC. SSDs are dropping in price and they're going to drop more and more in the near future. Obviously that might not be the most applicable for some people but using a traditional HDD would still be less prone to read errors due to less mechanical movement.

It is the best for archiving, preserves your physical CDs longer, and most DACs these days (at least the majority of the ones worth purchasing) all support the best audiophile formats. Flacs, Wavs, stretching from 16bit/44.1khz to 24bit/192khz. Most CD players cannot do this, they require an additional digital input, USB input, Esata input, or Ethernet input. Most CDPs do not have these inputs to act as a DAC as well as a CDP. There are universal players and some SACD/CD players that do like the Oppos and Marantzs. Hell there are even DACs that support DSD64 and DSD 128.

When I get a CD that I cannot find the digital files online in lossless Flac or Wav I use a program called EAC, Exact Audio Copy, that does an excellent job extracting the bit for bit information off the disc and has excellent error checking processes to see if this bit for bit data was not taken correctly.

 

[two sevens]

Thanks for all the input. From what I have found researching, the transport should be less important than the DAC itself in determining sounds quality and I think Sanc has a strong argument that the moving parts in CD players could present issues in disk read on a bit level, especially if you dont have a top of the line player. I am still using 'physical' formats like cds to play my music, but thanks Sanc for the advice on SSDs and the EAC program. I am starting to learn more about this stuff and it seems to me that 'lossless' music files direct from a computer or drive would be very desirable for the shear fact that it bypasses the shortcomings and challenges that moving mechanical parts present...

 

[rwartner]

Don't know why you need SSD. Expensive and small. What benefit? HDs are reliable and you can get backup USB drive anyway.

I would get Grant Fidelity tube DAC. If your CDP has optical out would plug into DAC bypassing CDP DAC.

Would get laptop and rip CDs to it lossless. Connect laptop to DAC via optical or USB - depends on laptop output capability. Can switch back and forth to see what you like.

Want a quiet computer - laptops are quiet. Min 500 GB HD, min 2GB memory. You need a computer with CD so can rip, can be different computer than music player though.

I rip on one laptop, copy to USB drive. Connect USB drive to my music player and copy to its HD. Disconnect USB drive. Now have backup. Works for me.

I have 900 CDs ripped lossless to music player 300 GB. It is wonderful.

 

[Gridslayer]

I've got the TUbeDAC11... Couldn't be happier. I find that I'm ripping my CDs to FLAC and playing them that way much more often than I'm playing them in my CD player. On the other hand, the sound via the Denon's analog out through the tube out on the DAC is VERY pleasing to my ears. The FLAC files sound tremendous as well. Can't go wrong...

The nice thing about having the TUBEDAC is that there are so many options. Once you've invested the $ in the DAC, you can swap inexpensive and even "vintage" CD or DVD players in and out till you get the sound you like, since you know the DAC is more than taking care of its end of the process.

 

[Gang-Twanger]

I would spend my money on a DAC. It's more useful than just a better player. Sure, some newer players are set up so you can use the internal DAC for other signals too, but I think standalone DAC is still an overall better way to allocate your $$.

I agree. The standalone DAC seems to be the way to go. Based on what I've read and my own experience, I can go a lot farther with my money than I could if I spent that same money on an outboard CD/SACD/etc-player, that's for sure. I paid $150 for my dac, and I'm already getting the same kind of sound-quality I would get from a high-end CD-player, and that's the truth (And I find it much-easier, besides, CD's just don't have that same tangible feel that LP's do, so I'm not missing the experience of "placing that CD onto the tray and pressing the button and watching the CD spin around"... You can have it). I'm essentially-using my laptop as my transport, playing digital audio files, but even when playing actual CD's using my laptop's transport, I still get equally-great sound, plus I can control my music while I'm web-surfing. The DAC seems to be the key. And not just what DAC-chip they use INSIDE the DAC, but the design of the unit. I appreciate gear that keeps it simple and straightforward. No bells and whistles. I do like the idea of a DAC that has connections for both a CD-player AND a computer-source or mp3-player. Makes it an easier transition from CD to digital files. Myself, I rarely listen to CD's anymore, even in the car (I run a cable from my Dell DJ to the car stereo's 1/8-inch aux-input).

In the future, I see people on AK doing "CDP vs DAC" shootouts. It'll become like the "vinyl vs digital" thing where arguments get started over it.

 

[vq35]

My budget is around $500.

At my budget, am I better off going with a CDP or a DAC?

I am also intrigued by what I have read about Schiit Audio's Bifrost dac. Anyone who owns one care to share their impressions?

I am pretty much in the same boat as you in the CDP vs DAC dilemma and have the same budget. I started on the CDP side of the fence, but kept thinking in the back of my mind that one day (maybe 6 months) I would like the ability to pipe music from a computer into my system. With that in mind, I started to sway over to the DAC side and have concluded it to be the best option for me.

I have an older Yamaha with optical out and should realize a significant improvement converting it to a transport by utilizing a new DAC. Then down the road I will build/buy a dedicated PC for music and connect it via digital out. This will provide me with the flexibility to still listen to CDs if I want or listen through a computer.

After much DAC research, the Schiit Bifrost is currently at the top of my list. It reviews exceedingly well, the price is right within my budget, and it's made in the US (something that's important to me). I just haven't pulled the trigger on purchasing one.

 

[nbndtrain]

I want to upgrade my cd player, which is an older Nakamichi CDP-2A.

Those are pretty nice players, with a very good implementation of the TDA1541A DAC. Just wanted to make sure you were aware. I know it is not modern, and $500 will probably get you something better, but the Nak is kind of a sleeper as compared to others with that DAC.

 

[burmashave]

In my second system, I have a Pioneer DVD player, DV-563A. It plays sacd's, and has optical and coax digital out. When I pipe it into my Emotiva XDA-1 dac, it sounds great. I paid $25 for it on bartertown. I don't even use it as a dvd player. If you get a dac, you can look for something like this.

 

[Catcher10]

Get a good DAC.....I too have the Grant Fidelity TubeDAC11, it performs at dbl its price easily. Many connection options to try out. It has improved the sound of my vintage Sony CDP302, but recently the Sony has died, will not track CDs anymore.

So I am out looking for a midline CDP with coax digital out.....That will sound much better than my current setup, since the DAC will be doing all the processing.

Eventually you will go down the digital file playback option, so do yourself a future favor and get a good DAC.

 

[ARJohn]

I am a fan of those TDA chips in your Nak , very smooth sounding. But a nice Dac with your Marantz would be good too. For some reason I like those Philips based players like in your Marantz with my dac , Adcom GDA-700 . Can be had pretty cheap but doesn't do hi rez . But it does HDCD and you would be surprised how many CD's are HD even when not labeled as such . But I don't do PC audio or any other formats ,I prefer the vinyl sound actually .