CD player DAC vs. receiver DAC

[Jersey Joe]

Hello all,

I have a Harman Kardon 3490 receiver. I am about to pair that with an Onkyo C7030 CD player.

In your humble opinions, would I be better off passing a digital (coax) signal to the amp and letting the HK convert it, or using the analog outputs of the CD player (with its Wolfson internal DAC)?

Opinions and insights much appreciated.

Joe

 

[BigElCat]

Totally depends on your room, system, and ears. Try it both ways. Trust your ears.

 

[cratz2]

I'd try them both and let my ears be the judge but I'd put $2 on the Onkyo.

 

[Tamarillo]

Agree with others. Don't imagine Harmon dac is high grade as very much an add on, and an unusual one too. But try both.

 

[arcorob]

Actually...surprisingly

The DAC in the HK is high grade
http://www.akm.com/akm/en/product/datasheet1/?partno=AK4589VQ

And better than the standard

Wolfson® 192 kHz/24-bit DAC in the Onkyo

PLUS ..going straight to the receiver reduces signal chain BUT you want to use USB input

 

[tblob]

Stick with the CD player's own DAC. Otherwise, the HK will be clocking off of the S/PDIF connection, which has a lower quality clocking signal and introduces more jitter.

The exception to this would be if the CD player has a word-clock out, and the HK has word-clock in, which is the proper way to do digital clocking with the lowest jitter.

 

[Moby2]

The DAC in the HK is high grade
http://www.akm.com/akm/en/product/datasheet1/?partno=AK4589VQ

And better than the standard

Wolfson® 192 kHz/24-bit DAC in the Onkyo

PLUS ..going straight to the receiver reduces signal chain BUT you want to use USB input

I'm thinking about buying a cheap Insignia 5 Disc CD Changer if it ever goes back into production or stock at Best Buy and then using the digital output to connect it to my HK AVR 630 receiver using a long optical cable. No USB will be used. Is this going to be ok for sound?

 

[janikphoto]

Totally depends on your room, system, and ears. Try it both ways. Trust your ears.

Though I agree he should try it both ways, I'm not sure I understand what you mean by the room being a factor for DAC?!? I agree with the system and ears part, but room acoustics is not going to affect the DAC, unless the room is at such a fantastic temperature extreme, like 80 below zero... then one DAC might not operate as well as another.

 

[arcorob]

Okay...sort of silly at this point

You want to replace your CD player with an "inexpensive" 5 disk player.

If you use the optical out to utilize the DAC in the HK you face this
LIMITATIONS
The receiver does not control the data rate, so it must avoid bit slip by synchronising its conversion with the source clock. This means that S/PDIF cannot fully decouple the final signal from influence by the analogue characteristics of the source or the interconnect, even though the digital audio data can normally be transmitted without loss. The source clock may carry inherent jitter or wander, and noise or distortion introduced in the data cable may further influence the process of clock recovery.[5][6][7] If the DAC does not have a stable clock reference then noise will be introduced into the resulting analogue signal. However, receivers can implement various strategies which limit this influence.[7][8]

TOSLINK cables do not work well (and may even suffer permanent damage) if tightly bent or squashed by, say, a misplaced foot. Their high light-signal attenuation limits their effective range to 6.1 metres (20 ft) or so.[citation needed] On the other hand, TOSLINK cables are not susceptible to ground loops and RF interference, as coaxial cables are.[9]

S/PDIF lacks flow control and retransmission facilities, which limits its utility in data communications applications

If you analog out to the HK then you rely on the DAC in the CD play which really doesn't amount to much.

Now..If you do this
Get your CD player
Digital out to a DAC (that handles Toslink in - but will cost a few $100)
Analog out of DAC to the HK, then you have something.

Otherwise...not going to be very impressive either way on the original setup

 

[Moby2]

You want to replace your CD player with an "inexpensive" 5 disk player.

If you use the optical out to utilize the DAC in the HK you face this
LIMITATIONS
The receiver does not control the data rate, so it must avoid bit slip by synchronising its conversion with the source clock. This means that S/PDIF cannot fully decouple the final signal from influence by the analogue characteristics of the source or the interconnect, even though the digital audio data can normally be transmitted without loss. The source clock may carry inherent jitter or wander, and noise or distortion introduced in the data cable may further influence the process of clock recovery.[5][6][7] If the DAC does not have a stable clock reference then noise will be introduced into the resulting analogue signal. However, receivers can implement various strategies which limit this influence.[7][8]

TOSLINK cables do not work well (and may even suffer permanent damage) if tightly bent or squashed by, say, a misplaced foot. Their high light-signal attenuation limits their effective range to 6.1 metres (20 ft) or so.[citation needed] On the other hand, TOSLINK cables are not susceptible to ground loops and RF interference, as coaxial cables are.[9]

S/PDIF lacks flow control and retransmission facilities, which limits its utility in data communications applications

If you analog out to the HK then you rely on the DAC in the CD play which really doesn't amount to much.

Now..If you do this
Get your CD player
Digital out to a DAC (that handles Toslink in - but will cost a few $100)
Analog out of DAC to the HK, then you have something.

Otherwise...not going to be very impressive either way on the original setup

Thanks. I should be ok then with an inexpensive cd changer and a TOSLINK connection of 12ft. Now to wait patiently for Best Buy to re-release an inexpensive Insignia 5 Disc CD Changer.

 

[arcorob]

Actually thats not what I said

Thanks. I should be ok then with an inexpensive cd changer and a TOSLINK connection of 12ft. Now to wait patiently for Best Buy to re-release an inexpensive Insignia 5 Disc CD Changer.

What I said was, without a DAC in between, it really doesn't much matter...

 

[Drumolator]

I recently bought a BOTL Pioneer AVR, VSX-523, which has a 192khz/24-bit DAC. My CD player is a Sony CDP-CE500 that has an optical audio out, so I used it to go into the optical input on the receiver. My bedroom system sounds much better using the DAC in the receiver: the lows are better, and the overall clarity is better. I was considering a subwoofer for this system, but changed my mind because of the improvement in the bass. Now I can listen to music rather than the system. Peace and goodwill.