Choosing a reliable Denon TT (microprocessors)

[Bluesgrooves]

Hi all,

I’ve drooled over vintage Denon turntables for years. I finally pulled the trigger on a DP-60L that had been fully recapped. Upon arriving, I found the TT was beautiful and everything I hoped it would be. After setting it up, it almost immediately exhibited the dreaded high speed spinning issue that would crop up intermittently while playing a record.

The owner said the TT had previously exhibited this problem, which was the reason he had it recapped. I sent it back out of fear that the issue might be related to a problem with an unobtainable microprocessor (sad times!).

I’m still in the market for a Denon TT, but this has scared me off from those which might have a problem come up that is unfixable (like impossible to find microprocessors).

So my question is this: which of the flying saucer TTs from the 1970s-1980s have microprocessors that cannot easily be replaced?

I adore the DP-60, 62/57, 72/67, 75/80, but it is my understanding that each of these has a lot that can go wrong. On the other hand, I’ve gathered that other UFOs like the DP-6700, 3700, 2500, 1200, 790 are simpler and less likely to turn into paper weights.

Any help/expertise is much appreciated!

Probably a dumb question, but I hear the terms “IC”, “microprocessor”, and “transistor” come up and don’t know if they are interchangeable or entirely different parts.

 

[cafe latte]

Hi all,

I’ve drooled over vintage Denon turntables for years. I finally pulled the trigger on a DP-60L that had been fully recapped. Upon arriving, I found the TT was beautiful and everything I hoped it would be. After setting it up, it almost immediately exhibited the dreaded high speed spinning issue that would crop up intermittently while playing a record.

The owner said the TT had previously exhibited this problem, which was the reason he had it recapped. I sent it back out of fear that the issue might be related to a problem with an unobtainable microprocessor (sad times!).

I’m still in the market for a Denon TT, but this has scared me off from those which might have a problem come up that is unfixable (like impossible to find microprocessors).

So my question is this: which of the flying saucer TTs from the 1970s-1980s have microprocessors that cannot easily be replaced?

I adore the DP-60, 62/57, 72/67, 75/80, but it is my understanding that each of these has a lot that can go wrong. On the other hand, I’ve gathered that other UFOs like the DP-6700, 3700, 2500, 1200, 790 are simpler and less likely to turn into paper weights.

Any help/expertise is much appreciated!

Probably a dumb question, but I hear the terms “IC”, “microprocessor”, and “transistor” come up and don’t know if they are interchangeable or entirely different parts.

I may be wrong but I don't think any have unobtanium parts.
What may have been the issue on the one you had was the heads needed adjusting a bit closer to the magnetic strip.
It sounds like they were not quite close enough so the table was loosing its reference from time to time, adjusting them closer but ensuring thry were not touching would have likely fixed it.
Chris

 

[Bluesgrooves]

Thanks for the response! That’s helpful for future reference. Pretty embarrassing if it was that easy of a fix haha. I’m thinking that because the TT had the same issue in the past and went through a technician that there might have been a larger underlying issue.

The “unobtainable” DP-60l custom microprocessor I’m referring to is called SC3120A. I’ve seen a few on strange websites for prices north of $200 each with no guarantee that they will actually function. So my main concern is needing to buy one or two of these in the event that something fails and a tech can’t repair it.

 

[Tonoje]

What I would do, but okay, in large part it's because I've already done it, is ignore all the others and go for a DP-75 or 80. No automation, no dynamic servo arm, just good solid decks with a fine reputation and excellent (post-purchase) configuration options that you can explore in the future.

This time last year these Denons were barely on my radar. Then I noticed a thread or two on AK, got to thinking (though I have a couple of perfectly good Technics players), and then it was just a matter of seeing if the opportunity came along. It did. The basic TT (DP-75) for 45,000 yen ($300), DK 2-arm plinth for 1,000 yen, Japanese vintage tonearm for 35,000 yen, and a new Denon DL-103 cart for 40,000 yen. I make that about $800 for a pretty decent setup, and could have been significantly less if I'd wanted to get things rolling by cheaping out on the arm and cartridge.

You might struggle to get those prices for the TT where you're living, but they can be had here if you can arrange shipping.

 

[Bluesgrooves]

What I would do, but okay, in large part it's because I've already done it, is ignore all the others and go for a DP-75 or 80. No automation, no dynamic servo arm, just good solid decks with a fine reputation and excellent (post-purchase) configuration options that you can explore in the future.

This time last year these Denons were barely on my radar. Then I noticed a thread or two on AK, got to thinking (though I have couple of perfectly good Technics players), and then it was just a matter of seeing if the opportunity came along. It did. The basic TT (DP-75) for 45,000 yen ($300), DK 2-arm plinth for 1,000 yen, Japanese vintage tonearm for 35,000 yen, and a new Denon DL-103 cart for 40,000 yen. I make that about $820 for a pretty decent setup, and could have been significantly less if I'd wanted to get things rolling by cheaping out on the arm and cartridge.

You might struggle to get those prices for the TT where you're living, but they can be had here if you can arrange shipping.

Thanks for the advice and congrats on the TT! I might just do that if I can find a decent deal. From all the Denon threads I’ve read, most seem to agree the DP-75 and DP-80 are the best of the bunch.

Wondering, on what site did you find the TT and components? Also, did you have the TT recapped?

I’m a little nervous about ordering from eBay sellers in Japan as many auctions feature stock photos or else I see the same pictures used my multiple different sellers. Sounds like it worked out great for you though.

 

[cafe latte]

Thanks for the advice and congrats on the TT! I might just do that if I can find a decent deal. From all the Denon threads I’ve read, most seem to agree the DP-75 and DP-80 are the best of the bunch.

Wondering, on what site did you find the TT and components? Also, did you have the TT recapped?

I’m a little nervous about ordering from eBay sellers in Japan as many auctions feature stock photos or else I see the same pictures used my multiple different sellers. Sounds like it worked out great for you though.

I have bought a cupped of things from Unisound from Japan.
They were as described and well packed.
Chris

 

[Blowed Fuse]

Welcome to AK Bluesgrooves this thread has me wanting a flying saucer type TT. Very interesting

 

[Tonoje]

Wondering, on what site did you find the TT and components?

Different sellers for each part, and I did it arse-backwards: saw the plinth at my local Hard Off and figured it might be years before I see the 2-arm or even single-arm version at that price again, so I had to buy it. Then I had to get a TT to drop into it, but why stop at a DP-3000, so I bought a DP-75 online the next day, received it two days later. I used a couple of spare arms to start, and as I'd been hankering for an SAEC arm for a while, once my funds recharged I was looking round for one and was fortunate enough to win bidding at half the fixed price I normally see them for. Then spent the hypothetical "other half" to buy the Denon MC cart new. And all because I didn't want to pass up a $7 plinth!

And maybe overkill by this point, but I haven't ruled out a DP-80.

I'll PM you some stuff about the turntable seller. They don't list on eBay and don't ship decks internationally but I'll wager you'll find their pictures, which are definitely their own, rather familiar.

Just remind me if you don't get a PM in the next day or so: it'll mean I've forgotten.

Like Chris says, Unisound has a good rep, as does HiFiDo. Other (trusted) sellers may not do international, but you might be able to work something out with a forwarding service. Never used one so I'm not sure how practical it is for issues like packing. Japan-only sellers may pack wonderfully (mine does) but are trusting their boxes to domestic rather than international shipping, which is a whole other game, in my opinion.

 

[Bluesgrooves]

Different sellers for each part, and I did it arse-backwards: saw the plinth at my local Hard Off and figured it might be years before I see the 2-arm or even single-arm version at that price again, so I had to buy it. Then I had to get a TT to drop into it, but why stop at a DP-3000, so I bought a DP-75 online the next day, received it two days later. I used a couple of spare arms to start, and as I'd been hankering for an SAEC arm for a while, once my funds recharged I was looking round for one and was fortunate enough to win bidding at half the fixed price I normally see them for. Then spent the hypothetical "other half" to buy the Denon MC cart new. And all because I didn't want to pass up a $7 plinth!

And maybe overkill by this point, but I haven't ruled out a DP-80.

I'll PM you some stuff about the turntable seller. They don't list on eBay and don't ship decks internationally but I'll wager you'll find their pictures, which are definitely their own, rather familiar.

Just remind me if you don't get a PM in the next day or so: it'll mean I've forgotten.

Like Chris says, Unisound has a good rep, as does HiFiDo. Other (trusted) sellers may not do international, but you might be able to work something out with a forwarding service. Never used one so I'm not sure how practical it is for issues like packing. Japan-only sellers may pack wonderfully (mine does) but are trusting their boxes to domestic rather than international shipping, which is a whole other game, in my opinion.

Wow, HifiDo seems like a great option! I see they even offer year long guarantees on their TTs. Thanks!
I've read conflicting opinions on whether DP-75 or DP-80 is the better table. Do you know why, specifically, the DP-80 is an upgrade?

 

[app4dstn]

i have a dp47f and a dp1200. i'd consider both to be "vulnerable". i don't know the full extent of Denon DP offerings to know if/which don't use a chip.

i lust/lusted after these "saucer" DD's and the Kenwood granite's. IMO, they're high risk/high reward.

both of my units were bought in person via FBMP. the opportunities came within 4 weeks of each other after keeping my eyes open for 18 months. i'd only take a chance on mail order if the cost were 10% of good-condition, which ain't gonna happen. each unit required 2 tanks of gas. the self does a lot of second guessing and self doubt on these treks. i don't have the gambler's mentality to do it online.

(i didn't study the 47f as much) the dp1200 is all discrete except for 1 chip, the last component in the drive to feed the motor. i'm pretty sure that chip is now extinct. the functionality could, in theory, and with a lot of effort, be re-engineered with a modern successor.

that's just the electronics of the drive system.....other caveat's to consider
platter, sensor
motor
active arm
switching controller(?... did not look deep into 47f but i'd be surprised if it didn't have this)

OP, you sure you wanna? (what is your locale?)

 

[Tonoje]

Do you know why, specifically, the DP-80 is an upgrade?

I asked or read about this a few months back but I no longer remember what I heard. Perhaps it's covered in the DP-75 and DP-80 owners' thread, running for several years and currently at 840 comments.

Denon DP80 & DP75 Owner's Thread

Know that there are several of us that own DP80 & DP75 TTs, so thought we should start a thread to share info and resources, pic's, etc. Am designing a Michell Gyro "style" plinth that will be made from either steel (pretty spendy) or aluminum (less spendy). We'll see where that goes, based on...

audiokarma.org

 

[sound hound]

I've read conflicting opinions on whether DP-75 or DP-80 is the better table. Do you know why, specifically, the DP-80 is an upgrade?

The DP-80 has an additional speed adjustment lacking in the DP-75, and is considered better. I am not sure that the quality difference is really significant. One advantage of the DP-75 is that they are available with multivoltage options. The DP-80 was not designed for export and so it would require a step up transformer for some of us.

 

[Tonoje]

Bluegrooves, did you get the PM? I'm so inept, I can't tell if it went through to you the other day or it's still sitting there unsent.

 

[Blowed Fuse]

I have bought a cupped of things from Unisound from Japan.
They were as described and well packed.
Chris

Im looking at some tables from Japan. The sellers say all import taxes are the buyers responsibility. Did you have to pay any extra fees when buying from Japan?

 

[Tonoje]

I don't expect you're liable for Australian import duties. ;-)

 

[cafe latte]

Im looking at some tables from Japan. The sellers say all import taxes are the buyers responsibility. Did you have to pay any extra fees when buying from Japan?

Here it needs to be over 1k to be a problem

 

[ETI_5000]

Here it needs to be over 1k to be a problem

Actually, the $1000 limit was removed in the 2017 budget. A certain (very poor?) billionaire (Gerry Harvey) complained to the treasurer (ScoMo) about how his company was missing out on sales, due to people importing cheap items (less than $1k) from overseas, without paying GST. Apparently the $99 million Gerry received in dividends from Harvey Norman (source- 2016 annual report) wasn't quite enough to maintain his lifestyle!

So now we have to pay 10% GST on everything we buy from overseas, no matter how much it cost. Gerry still isn't rich enough, as he keeps complaining to the press, who usually report everything he says - it's so terrible being a billionaire!

 

[JP]

Im looking at some tables from Japan. The sellers say all import taxes are the buyers responsibility. Did you have to pay any extra fees when buying from Japan?

No duty on non-changers from Japan: https://hts.usitc.gov/search?query=8519.30.20

If the paperwork doesn't have the proper HTS code on it (8519.30.2000), FedEx or UPS may miss-classify it and then charge a small administrative fee when you call them to correct it - the invoice will arrive some weeks later. I've never been charged any duties or fees on anything that was delivered via USPS on this side, and I generally receive 6-8 multi-thousand dollar packages a year.

 

[cafe latte]

Im looking at some tables from Japan. The sellers say all import taxes are the buyers responsibility. Did you have to pay any extra fees when buying from Japan?

Here it needs to be over 1k to be a problem

Actually, the $1000 limit was removed in the 2017 budget. A certain (very poor?) billionaire (Gerry Harvey) complained to the treasurer (ScoMo) about how his company was missing out on sales, due to people importing cheap items (less than $1k) from overseas, without paying GST. Apparently the $99 million Gerry received in dividends from Harvey Norman (source- 2016 annual report) wasn't quite enough to maintain his lifestyle!

So now we have to pay 10% GST on everything we buy from overseas, no matter how much it cost. Gerry still isn't rich enough, as he keeps complaining to the press, who usually report everything he says - it's so terrible being a billionaire!

Not quite.
If you buy something off ebay they are registered to collect the money, but if you buy off a company not collecting you still don't pay 10% if under 1000.
When I bought my first Shaknspin it was under 1k I paid nothing as it was not ebay.
Chris