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Clearaudio cartridges

G

grottyash

Super Member
Mentioned on another thread, but i just had a reply from Clearaudio regarding whether their cartridges are outsourced to AT.

It says simply that Clearaudio make and design their own cartridges.

Hopefully that clears things up. Brilliant sounding cartridges, by the way.

Edit: needn't have bothered contacting them! This site: http://hifi-unlimited.blogspot.be/2010/06/cmy-goes-analog-clearaudio-factory-tour.html shows them being made in the Clearaudio factory.
 
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As someone that works within a marketing department with marketers, writers and PR people, the statement "make and design" says to me (in the most abstract way possible) that they make some things but that others are outsourced to their specifications.
 
eurekaiv said:
As someone that works within a marketing department with marketers, writers and PR people, the statement "make and design" says to me (in the most abstract way possible) that they make some things but that others are outsourced to their specifications.
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Please! Have a look at the factory tour - oh, and provide some evidence for your assertions.
 
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Yes, they make cartridges there. Clearaudio moving coil cartridges. Show me a photo of them assembling a pair of cylindrical magnets in a v shape at the end of a cylindrical cantilever for a moving magnet cartridge.

Perhaps they just license the design and technology from Audio Technica? I suppose that's possible, but it's also just as possible that they buy bare assemblies from AT and do the finishing in-house.

Just some thoughts.
 
The Clearaudio email I received was unequivocal. I suggest you contact them regarding your suspicions, they're helpful people. Email address is on their website.
 
I recently acquired a Clear Audio Signature moving coil that needed service. I had the stock cantilever retipped and a repair done to it. I have spent a week or so listening to it now, and it is a very nice cartridge. I find it to be very vibrant and engaging overall, with a top end that has a crystal transparency. Now the higher registers may suffer a bit in my trial of it, as the arm I put it on is not what I would consider the appropriate candidate for it. But I was just trailing it to see how the repair worked out. But I think it is a great cartridge, and was well worth the money. I can certainly say that there is not an AT equivalent in their line up to this one.

For what it is worth, I do not see where its not possible that Clear Audio is using an AT stylus holder assembly for their MM cartridge. Very possible. But that does not mean that it is the same thing as an AT stylus, even though it has been shown that one can be modified to work in it. But the quality of stylus, maybe even cantilever, is not guaranteed to be the same. All I see is the holder is similar.

Regards
Mister Pig
 
I'm mostly just going on this:

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=88878.0

Furthermore, given the small volumes we're talking about in high end audio, it doesn't make sense from a cost standpoint to invest in the tooling needed to do those things. Much easier to buy from somebody else, even if they have to tweak their design to meet some higher specifications on your part. For years people like Wilson Audio, Sonus Faber, heck even Vandersteen used that exact method to "manufacture" their speakers. A speaker is much more than the sum of the drivers, and a cartridge is much more than where the stylus/cantilever/magnet assembly comes from.

Lastly, are you seriously suggesting, in any case, that an answer from a company pr rep is something we should declare definitive? Really?
 
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grottyash said:
Please! Have a look at the factory tour - oh, and provide some evidence for your assertions.
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I simply read your post that says Clearaudio make and design cartridges. If there was additional information they sent you I don't have that information and will base my assuption on the information that I do have. So if "make and design" cartridges is what they do, then they both make and design, just make or just design. That's what that language means. If the people at Clearaudio want you to know that they make ALL their cartridges in house, then they will explicitly state that's what they do, not provide some ambiguous statement that's open to interpretation. This is a good lesson though, if you're working on a resume or running for political office, this sorta ambiguity can really work wonders.

grottyash said:
The Clearaudio email I received was unequivocal. I suggest you contact them regarding your suspicions, they're helpful people. Email address is on their website.
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If it was, then share the parts that are unequivocal, because the part you shared was anything but.

Why is this even a big deal though? If Clearaudio outsources, then they outsource. Who cares?
 
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If you read the factory tour article in The Absolute Sound, you will see that they do an amazing amount of the manufacturing in-house. Very little is outsourced. Same thing with Benz-Micro.
 
eurekaiv said:
I simply read your post that says Clearaudio make and design cartridges. If there was additional information they sent you I don't have that information and will base my assuption on the information that I do have. So if "make and design" cartridges is what they do, then they both make and design, just make or just design. That's what that language means. If the people at Clearaudio want you to know that they make ALL their cartridges in house, then they will explicitly state that's what they do, not provide some ambiguous statement that's open to interpretation. This is a good lesson though, if you're working on a resume or running for political office, this sorta ambiguity can really work wonders.

Why is this a big deal though? I don't really get the reason for this post in the first place.
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Because people have been talking crap, an making unsubstantiated claims that AT makes Clearaudios cartridges. He just posted this to set the record straight.
 
eurekaiv said:
If it was, then share the parts that are unequivocal, because the part you shared was anything but.

Why is this even a big deal though? If Clearaudio outsources, then they outsource. Who cares?
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You seem the one with an issue about this. Can you please point to your sources that raise question of Clearaudios statement that they design and make their own cartridges?
 
I have zero issue, I could care less about Clearaudio or where the products are made, I just saw this guys post and found it rather comical. I have no obligation whatsoever to point to any source for anything. My source is in the first post here.
 
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I've been curious about this as well, but its nothing to lose sleep over. I thought it was a given that parts of the CA moving magnet carts were sourced from AT. That doesn't mean they're the same thing, just that they may share some common parts. This is nothing new in audio. Its like when people are arguing which TT manufacturer is better when they were both made by CEC...
 
I don't really think it's an issue, at all. After all, it's the end result that matters, just like with the speaker manufacturers I noted. But I don't think we can run around shouting and trying to make an unequivocal point that they DO make everything they sell, or every single part of everything they sell.

In fact, in the post I noted over at audiocircle, the issue is really only of note because, as a practical matter, you can apparently replace a part on your CA MM cart with an AT part taken, and modified, from its host cart. Good to know I suppose. What that may, or may not infer about who makes what, is less relevant I think.
 
I believe this may have started on my thread about my scout 1.1 and all I know is that if you look up the CA cartridge I have, the performer v2, I have yet to see any AT cart that looks the same?? this is an ebony wood body...If you look at the description from CA on the Needle Dr site, it makes it sound pretty clear that this is their design? I don't really care one way or another, I just don't see the proof that it is made by another company....
 
And you'd be right. Clearaudio, much to the chagrin of some, do make their own cartridges. Sorry, the internet myth is more fun, but it is just a myth.

I specifically asked about outsourcing and AT, by the way, and got the response already noted.

By the way, I don't think there's much point continuing with this topic. The doubters will continue to doubt, but there's really not much more to be said.
 
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grottyash said:
And you'd be right. Clearaudio, much to the chagrin of some, do make their own cartridges. Sorry, the internet myth is more fun, but it is just a myth.

I specifically asked about outsourcing and AT, by the way, and got the response already noted.

By the way, I don't think there's much point continuing with this topic. The doubters will continue to doubt, but there's really not much more to be said.
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You talked to their marketing/PR guy, right? I work in that field...there's more to be said :).

I don't consider myself a "doubter" as I don't see what the big deal would be if one of the most successful and experienced cartridge makers around was supplying them with magnet/motor assemblies for some of their cartridges. That is how most things are manufactured...how many companies make 100% of the parts in a product that has their name on it? It still means they "make" it, even if they don't make 100% of the components that go into it.
 
I hope you're not inferring that marketing people tell lies :) The answer is no, by the way. Clearaudio is a family run company and I doubt they have a big marketing department - judging from the blog, it is a member of that family that does the marketing.

The reply is unequivocal. As I said, I think there's no point in continuing. It is sad to see that people prefer the myth, but there it is, people always prefer a decent conspiracy. If people do have questions, I suggest they refer them to Clearaudio, rather than making baseless assertions.
 
grottyash said:
And you'd be right. Clearaudio, much to the chagrin of some, do make their own cartridges. Sorry, the internet myth is more fun, but it is just a myth.

I specifically asked about outsourcing and AT, by the way, and got the response already noted.

By the way, I don't think there's much point continuing with this topic. The doubters will continue to doubt, but there's really not much more to be said.
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Why not just copy/paste the exact response from ClearAudio into this thread for all prosperity? It would make for a great reference and something easy to quote because, at least on the TT forum, the same myths and questions get repeated over and over and over.... It's always nice to have an actual reference to point to rather than someone else posting, "I remember some guy said he talked to some person and...".
 
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