• The move to the new server is done. There are some software and database maintenance updates in process. This has us passing the hat around to help out. We appreciate any donations. Seriously, even a dollar helps. The payment page may be found here - https://www.audiokarma.org/support.html

Denon tonearm cable?

T

treyking11

New Member
hello all. i am new to this scene and this is my first posting, so i apologize in advance, but here goes...
i bought a denon dp-80 out of a friends garage (it had been sitting in a corner under a bunch of stuff for a few years) a few months ago because i was recently exposed to the joys of vinyl and wanted my own setup. after doing a little research on the model it turns out that it is a pretty nice unit so i am excited since i only gave him $20 for it, but i have two issues i was hoping someone could help with. first off, it is lacking a tonearm cable. it is a 5 pin 240 degree din, and god are they pricey! $100 seems like a lot for a cable, but it would be wrong to have a nice TT and go cheap on the cable. i dont know if i want to make my own, although i do electronic soldering and feel up to the task. i see some on ebay and online, but they say Linn or SME and i am not sure they are compatible. 5 pins in the same spread, but are the pins wired the same (in terms of order or placement)? sorry if i am confusing things... the other thing is that when it is running at 33rpm, there is a small "hickup" every few seconds that makes a small noise and slight and very short change in speed before it settles back into its normal speed. there is a small viewing window where i can see rotating pattern of lines that jumps slightly when the hickup occurs (i dont know what that thing is called). stop laughing at me, i said i was new to this. any ideas what could be causing this? i appreciate your input and your patience! Thanks!
 
Register to hide this ad
Welcome to AK, you came to the right place and we will try to do our best to help. First re the tonearm cable it's tough to answer not knowing exactly which tonearm you have and how it is mounted. If you post a photo of the tonearm we will have a better idea of a tonearm cable that will work. Next up is the "hickup" issue, it may be simple as cleaning or it could be a deeper problem that would require an experienced professional to fix. Since you say you did research re the DP-80 you should be well aware that it was/is one of the best direct drive turntables ever mfg by Denon and was competitive with the top models from Kenwood, Technics, Micro Seiki etc. $20 was a stupid, rediculous low price for that turntable is all I can say. I would strongly advise you use great care in handling this turntable, it has a magnetic strip on the inside of the platter and if damaged it will not read the correct speed. You got one hell of a deal and a turntable of a lifetime that has unbelieveable specs/performance that few turntables of today can match. I'm sure I'll be followed up by others that are more familiar with the Denon turntables that will have good advice. When and if properly running it has the potential to be very valuable and also very high performing.
 
Did a little more checking re the DP-80 and this is a Japan 100v model as best I can tell and will require a voltage converter unless it has a provision for changing the violtage internally. Also speed stability can be effected by by turning off the quartz lock on the face of the turntable. Vinyl Engine has a copy of the owners manual on file. It's easy to sign up and download the manual for reference. I'll also check the manual re voltage and quartz lock. Best advice I can give is not to to power it up until things can be clarified. Try to post pictures of the turntable and tonearm to see what we are dealing with.
 
ok. thanks for the help. the arm says denon and DA-401. the cartridge says denon and DL-301. the plinth is a DK-300 from denon as well. the wall plug has "7A - 125V which i assume is 7amp and 125 volt. i cant find anything else as far as any other identifying numbers, etc. here are a couple of pics, it cleaned up very well and i cannot wait to hear it. please keep the info coming if you have any more!!
 

Attachments

  • DSC01309.JPG
    DSC01309.JPG
    134.8 KB · Views: 83
  • DSC01308.JPG
    DSC01308.JPG
    131.3 KB · Views: 80
The Denon looks excellent and both the tonearm and cartridge are excellent from the same time period, when wiorking this combination should sound very nice. Vinyl Engine didn't have the owners manual but it had a brochure that provides a fair amount of info. For US/North America customers Denon provided a voltage converter, the brochure shows the model. Check with your neighbor to see if he still has the converter. If not you can purchase one for around $40. Also make sure the quartz lock is enabled/on, ther will be a button/dial on the face of the motor section to change it in and out. Use extreme CAUTION if you ever remove the platter that you don't damage the magnetic strip on the inside of the platter, the strip is what controls the accuracy of the speed. At this point you just have to be patient and locate or replace the voltage converter. When your checking back with the person you purchased it from see if he has any more info re the table and possibly any other small parts etc. Let us know how it's progressing I'm also excited to hear what you think of it.
 
thanks again for your time. he doesnt know anything about, and i think it was given to him a few years back but he had no interest in it which is why he sold it to me cheap (and had tools laying on it). most likely he has nothing else that goes with it. are you sure i need a voltage converter? the plug looks "normal" to me (i am in the US for clarification) and it says 125v on the plug... what kind of converter do i need? lastly, the "hickup" only happened when the "33" speed was selected, not when the "45" was selected. does that change your diagnosis? i really appreciate all your help!
 
Vinyl Engine only had the DP-80 broshure and service manual if I remember correctly. The broshure has a picture of the Denon converter that probably would of accompanied the DP-80 or purchased as an option. Also I found reference to the DP-80 on Audiogon thread that as I remember said that the DP-80 was a Japan model and it would need a converter. It doesn't have to be a Denon converter, you should be able to get a decent one for $40 or less. Also make sure the quartz lock is engaged. Like I said before be very careful with the platter so not to damage the magnetic strip which controls the speed. If your not capable of working on electronics it might be better to take it to a authorized Denon repair shop if the voltage converter doesn't solve the problem. I'll get back to you after checking further.
 
Reading your reply again that the 45 speed does not "hickup" when selected somewhat leads me to believe that the portion of the magnetic strip that governs the 33 speed is either possibly dirty/obstructed or worst case damaged. The little window is for the monitoring of the strobe/speed. I would not attempt to clean the magnetic strip unless it was an obvious piece of dirt etc that was loosely on the strip and could be very lightly blown or dusted off. Check to see if you can see any scratches/dings or obvious damage.
 
If you join vinylengine, a review of the DL-301 cartridge by Gramophone is available here http://www.vinylengine.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=38046 . They show two frequency response graphs for the cartridge, which in typical Denon MC fashion, is dead flat to 45kHz, with the comments “I cannot remember a cartridge producing a flatter set of graphs”! They were equally flattering about how good the sound quality and tracking was.

You will need a MC input on a preamp, or a step up transformer for a low output MC cartridge (Denon made – still make - excellent models), which will enable you to plug it into a MM input. Superb cartridge, in typical Denon fashion. Because they owned Columbia records back then (since sold to Sony), it used to be said that Denon turntables, tonearms and cartridges were among the best available.

The turntable and base are excellent – the second best they made, and the tonearm was also excellent. There is a brochure and a service manual for the turntable here http://www.vinylengine.com/library/denon/dp-80.shtml , and brochure for the tonearm here http://www.vinylengine.com/library/denon/da-401.shtml . Although it was an s-shaped tonearm, it was one of the lightest ones made (many s-shaped models are about double – or more – the effective mass!), so should be an excellent match for the cartridge. It came with a nice lightweight magnesium alloy headshell (model PCL-5). I have to say that for $20, you’ve probably got a bargain, if you can get it working properly.

I believe that virtually all tonearm manufacturers used the same 5-pin DIN connector for connections to their tonearms, so any brand one will work. You can make your own leads – use good quality, low capacitance shielded cable, a 5-pin DIN connector, two RCA plugs, and wire it up using this diagram for the DIN socket (I believe you need a female):

attachment.php


Only 3 of the leads are used – 2 for ground, 3 for left channel, and 5 for right channel.

Actually, I’ve just found out that they are ‘special’ DIN connectors, which have different pin spacing to normal DIN. They cost heaps, so it may be worthwhile buying a made-up cable. You can buy the connectors, from sellers on Ebay – do a search for tonearm and DIN, and you’ll find them.
 
Last edited:
thanks everyone. i will take a look inside the TT this weekend so give me a few days to get back on the forum. have a great weekend!
 
treyking11 said:
will this cable work for me? ultimatecable got good reviews on their cables... thanks!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ULTIMATE-SI...782?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f0e3b28f6
Click to expand...

They look pretty good, and probably are quite cheap for leads with a high percentage of silver, and using those connectors. The socket is the correct one for tonearms.

However their capacitance isn’t mentioned anywhere, which is the most critical thing with wiring for tonearms. You should ask them what the capacitance is – the lower the better. I’d be looking for something with less than 150pF total capacitance, and ideally less than 100pF, although for your MC cartridge, it won’t be critical. However, if in the future you want to use a MM cartridge, you need low capacitance cables. It isn’t mentioned either on their website, or in their Ebay ad.

Apart from that, the only factor is if they will fit – many leads use angled plugs (eg 90º bend) so that the tonearm cables will fit under the plinth without excessive bending of the leads. It’s often hard to bend thick leads. The seller may be able to answer those concerns, if you ask them.
 
as far as a preamp, this is the one i have ordered.

http://www.phonopreamps.com/tc760pp.html

reviews said it was a fantastic deal for the money. it is MM/MC. the speakers i have for the setup are an old pair of JVC Nivica (late 60's, early 70's i think) which are in great shape and sound fine to me. they look like "death stars" to me, but my wife says they look like BBQ grills... reviews on their quality are mixed, but for my untrained ears they will be good for now. thanks again!!
 
I know your excited to hear that turntable but lets slow down a little and put everything togeather and see what we have for resources. You have JVC speakers which will be fine as long as they function. I'm assuming you have a receiver that power the speakers. You have ordered a phono preamp for the Denon moving coil cartridge. Unless you can find a used phono cable the one from Ebay is about the least exspensive these days for what your getting. I want to look on the positive side and I'm hopeing that maybe due to being stored in the garage the "hickup" issue can be cured by cleaning, maybe a long shot but we'll try the simplest, least invasive/safest/cheapest things first. When I say cleaning we are not going to use anything harsh or abrasive, that includes the cleaner and applicator.
 
what? me, anxious?? ok a little... i have a denon home theater receiver to power it, but it has no phono input (hence the preamp to convert to rca). i called my buddy and he had it so long that has no remembrance of any accessories, and his garage is cluttered beyond belief, so no luck there. i thought i would go ahead and grab the cable, i dont think i will need a 90 degree. i feel guilty saying i am on a pretty tight budget considering how nice the TT is, but, well, i am on a tight budget. anything i can do myself would be nice so that i can learn how to care for this thing. where can i find a cleaning/maintenance guide? or at least some direction? thanks for everything.
 
I'm in the process of purchasing a Denon turntable (DP-75) that is very close to yours so I have been doing a lot of research and ran into some info that might apply to yours. I'm neither an amature or professional audio tech and my technical skills are limited to very simple repairs. If your on a limited budget I don't want you to spend more then necessary to be able to at least test the turntable to see if we can get get the 33 speed to function properly. If the problem was only with the 45 speed you could probably live with it for who knows how long but it's 33 and that one would be crucial to me. Make sure the power is off and the turntable is unplugged from the outlet. Since it was stored in a garage I'm hopeing that somehow dirt got onto the magnetic strip or the magnetic strip reader (tape head) or both. The magnetic strip is on the bottom of the platter, you will see the black/white lines. Take the rubber mat off the platter, you will see two openings in the platter and attempt to gently lift the platter up and off. It's possible it may be stuck to the spindle, do not stick anything, tools etc, under the platter to force it up. Use a oil for loosening corroded bolts etc, let it sit over night and try again. Be careful that you don't damage the spindle. Some people use a block of wood and GENTLY tap the wood block on the spindle. Once you get the platter off check to see if any of those lines are scratched/dinged/dented or dirty. If it's dirt attempt to gently wipe the dirt off useing water on a soft cotton cloth. If it's deeply scratched or dented it may be all over with for 33. The other area is the reading head that from what I read said it could be cleaned with alcahol and again gently use a Q tip or a small cotton ball to wipe it off much like you would clean a tape head on a tape recorder. Be careful not to loosen any screws either in the window or the reading head. Since the table looks like it hasn't seen any trauma from a fall/drop I would hope all those screws are tight. Since we don't have an owners manual I suggest you go to Vinyl Engine and look up the DP-6000 which will have to be close enough for our purposes and it will show the magnetic strip on the underside of the platter and the reader on the top of the motor that we are talking about. The magnetic tape reader can be adjusted to correct the speed but it should only be done by a pro. If lucky it's dirt on either or both and it's time for testing, gently place the platter back onto the spindle useing the two openings in the platter, don't touch the magnetic strip. Power up and with luck 33 is working like it should. If not it isn't the end of the raod since the table is well worth fixing. Read thru the DP-6000 owners manual and it will in general also apply to your DP-80 re operation etc. Their appears to be no owner maintenace required otherthan normal cleaning, the bearing is permently sealed and does not require oil. Also check to see if your DP-80 has a switch on the top of the motor for 50-60hz.
 
treyking11 said:
what? me, anxious?? ok a little... i have a denon home theater receiver to power it, but it has no phono input (hence the preamp to convert to rca). i called my buddy and he had it so long that has no remembrance of any accessories, and his garage is cluttered beyond belief, so no luck there. i thought i would go ahead and grab the cable, i dont think i will need a 90 degree. i feel guilty saying i am on a pretty tight budget considering how nice the TT is, but, well, i am on a tight budget. anything i can do myself would be nice so that i can learn how to care for this thing. where can i find a cleaning/maintenance guide? or at least some direction? thanks for everything.
Click to expand...

Ok budget you say budget it is. How about taking a pic of where the din socket is on the back of the TT. I'm thinking of converting the din to RCA jacks (or just a new hard wired cable with a video RCA cable like petra (what I use) and you will need a ground wire (22ga rat shack will work). Also if you're feeling good about turning the table upside down and take the cover off the btm and take a pic there as well. Changing cables/sockets is pretty easy and cheap. How's your solder skills? This won't be hard, a $15 ratshak solder iron and $5 for solder and solder wick (to remove the old solder), $15 for Petra cable and you will be good to go. I would ditch the DIN socket if I was on the said budget but that's me. However $80 for the Ebay cable vs time to build my own.... how tight is that budget.... So you could build your own for half the price of new.

So you have options if you can solder or feel inclined to learn. TT cable leads tend to be pretty small so working with a cheap solder iron without skill can be a PIA but thats how I learned. I think replacing my TT cable on my Denon was one of my first DIY projects on vintage gear. A new improved cable WILL get you a better sound specially with that cart.


Cheers,
Bob
 
bobrown that is good advice re the tonearm cable replacement. The OP has an outstanding turntable if he can get the 33 speed to function correctly. This TT was one of the TOTL Denons in the 1980s and very exspensive and the only significant item missing is the tonearm cable and IMO the replacement should come very close to matching the original in quality/construction/performance. I did advise him not to invest any money in the tonearm cable or anything else until he can correct the 33 speed issue. If the speed issue can't be resolved simply/cheaply he will have to decide if he wants to invest in having it repaired by a pro which could be costly. This situation is somewhat like someone giving you for free a luxury car that needs service/parts, depending on your finances you could be finding yourself in a money pit or it could be a simple cheap repair and your rideing in style for next to nothing.
 
thanks for the continued input! i would be interested in removing the DIN and making RCA connections, but doesnt that devalue the TT? i do alot of circuit board soldering, so i am fine there and have all the tools already. here is a pic of my din underneath. i havent opened it up to check the mag strip yet, hectic weekend. thanks again, let you know what i find shortly!
 

Attachments

  • DSC01320.JPG
    DSC01320.JPG
    42.6 KB · Views: 35
DO NOT alter the the DIN connection or you will seriously devalue the tonearm. With a little luck/patience you might find a very good preowned tonearm cable on Ebay or Audiogon for less than the price of the new one you were looking at which isn't bad. When dealing with better/best/exspensive turntables like this any modiofications have to be reversable and the original parts kept in safe storage. I strongly advise not to modify the tonearm connection in any way, you will be very sorry if you should end up having to sell the turntable for parts if the speed issue isn't resolved or the cost to repair is prohibitive for you. Any potential buyer will want everything unmolested and replacing the tonearm cable would be easly done with an equal or better tonearm cable.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom