Direct Drive vs. Belt Drive

[Paul C]

One train of thought goes like this:

Its relatively easy to isolate motor noise in a belt drive system, but because its more difficult to make a quiet direct drive, if they've gone to the trouble to do it, then the rest of the table may also be well made...........

I would like to point out that with the Technics direct drive there is not really a separate motor as such. The motor is an inside out induction motor. The motor's "armature" is really the platter. It is no different in that respect from a belt drive platter on its bearing.

So, that leaves the "cogging effect" and I have just not heard that on direct drive turntables.

 

[mhardy6647]

The motor's "armature" is really the platter. It is no different in that respect from a belt drive platter on its bearing.

What?

 

[jblmar]

I'm gonna get this upgrade for my technics 1200 DD, then I'll have BOTH DD and Belt drive, Ha!

Keeping the "S" shaped arm?
Oh no!! What did I just start??

Ron

 

[Paul C]

What?

The Technics Direct Drive turntables have an "induction" type motor. Instead of the armature in the middle of the field coil, with a shaft coming out of the end, the motor is inside out. The field coil is in the middle, and the "armature" is actually one piece with the platter. The platter rotates on a bearing just like a belt drive. The only thing touching the platter is the magnetic field generated by the field coil (in the base) and the induced magnetic field in the platter.

Here are photos of two different Technics Direct Drive turntables:

There is no more reason for "motor noise" in a direct drive than there is in a belt drive. In fact, because it does not have a separate motor there is less reason for a Direct Drive to have noise.

 

[similost]

There are two reasons I prefer a direct drive myself...

The first being, if you want to remove an album and replace it while the platter is running, you just have to lift the tone arm (with the lifter, not your finger) swing the arm over, stop the platter with your hand, and drop the new album on and let go.. replace the arm... That way your albums aren't sliding across the mat and scratching up your albums, and you can be lazy, and not have to turn off the player.

The second being.. I hate replacing belts...

 

[AlleyKat]

Over the 34 years that I've owned my Technics SL-1300, it has performed flawlessly with only one repair visit to clean the speed control pots. It's a tank and never seems to fail to meet my needs. If you're looking for a TT for the long run, you just can't beat the durability and maintenance free ( except for 2-3 drops of magic Technics oil every 2000 hours of operation) performance of a decent direct drive.

 

[jblmar]

The Technics Direct Drive turntables have an "induction" type motor. Instead of the armature in the middle of the field coil, with a shaft coming out of the end, the motor is inside out. The field coil is in the middle, and the "armature" is actually one piece with the platter. The platter rotates on a bearing just like a belt drive. The only thing touching the platter is the magnetic field generated by the field coil (in the base) and the induced magnetic field in the platter.

Here are photos of two different Technics Direct Drive turntables:

There is no more reason for "motor noise" in a direct drive than there is in a belt drive. In fact, because it does not have a separate motor there is less reason for a Direct Drive to have noise.

The Technics SP 25 I have is amazingly quiet. This is with JBL compression drivers. Speed is spot on after 22 years. Oiled the motor once in all that time.

 

[MisterFishey]

I think most of the direct-drive "rumble" claims are true only if you have either a. a really poorly made turntable, or b. a very good system and an ear to match it. I have a direct drive, mid-range (Technics SL-D20) turntable, and I have never heard any motor noise at all, and it keeps the pitch very even, much more so than my friend's belt drive Technics turntable.

So I would have to say I prefer DD.

 

[LarryYaremko]

Over the 34 years that I've owned my Technics SL-1300, it has performed flawlessly with only one repair visit to clean the speed control pots. It's a tank and never seems to fail to meet my needs. If you're looking for a TT for the long run, you just can't beat the durability and maintenance free ( except for 2-3 drops of magic Technics oil every 2000 hours of operation) performance of a decent direct drive.

I found the following narrative from KAB to be very helpful in debunking some of the myths associated with expensive turntables:

http://www.kabusa.com/1200com1.htm

 

[whell]

The merits of the 1200, its siblings, and other DD tables will likely continue to be debated until doomsday. I don't think too many folks who are fanatical about the virtue and superiority of belt drive tables will be converted to DD (and I suspect the ability to convert any of them has some proportional relationship to the amount of money invested in their analog set up!), nor would I care to try.

All I know is that my SL-1210 M5G, which is completely stock, with the KAB Ortofon Pro integrated cartridge, is giving me a bunch of enjoyment. Its simple to use, requires almost zero maintenance, and with the integrated cartridge is about as plug and play as turntables can get. As for the sound? Well, I sold a Thorens TD-145 and kept the Technics.

I also picked up another rock-solid DD table along the way: a full auto Pioneer PL-600. I use the Technics for "serious listening", and the Pioneer when I'll be in an out of the listening room and not always immediately available to change pull the tonearm off the record. The 600 is a great sounding table in its own right, is also stock, and also gets me smiling ear to ear with the sound. This table has a Stanton 681 EEE MK III cartridge on it, which is an amazing - sounding cartridge too.

So, get what you like, and don't worry about what is causing the platter to spin as long as it sounds good to your ears while it is spinning.

 

[jfine]

What Whell said

 

[jeffn]

There are two reasons I prefer a direct drive myself...

The first being, if you want to remove an album and replace it while the platter is running, you just have to lift the tone arm (with the lifter, not your finger) swing the arm over, stop the platter with your hand, and drop the new album on and let go.. replace the arm... That way your albums aren't sliding across the mat and scratching up your albums, and you can be lazy, and not have to turn off the player.

Can't you do that with a belt drive?

 

[clydeselsor]

I have been a belt drive fan for ever. I have owned several different Pioneer, Sansui, and Technics belt drive tables. I just recently picked up a Pioneer PL-518 DD turntable and I will never have another belt drive turntable unless I get to the point where I can afford a TOTL belt drive. You really have to spend a great deal of money on a belt drive turntable before it will ever be better than a direct drive. Just my opinion.

 

[hakaplan]

Can't you do that with a belt drive?

I think he means you can literally stall the platter with your hand while changing the record, then let go allowing it to resume speed. Wouldn't the belt get messed up if you tried that with a belt drive?

 

[hakaplan]

I think most of the direct-drive "rumble" claims are true only if you have either a. a really poorly made turntable,

The irony is that that animal (poorly made DD) never really existed. Regarding Japanese turntables, from the very beginning when DD's were introduced, they were ALWAYS at the top of the line for every manufacturer, with the most sophisticated engineering, the best specs, and highest price tags.

That trend continued into the BPC era of the mid 80s to 90s. Although the turntables became lighter with more plastic, the top models were still DD, and the specs were not only better than the belt models, but BETTER than all the DDs that had preceded them. (Those specs being rumble and wow and flutter.) No one is claiming that the BPCs or that even many of the low or midrange s-arms would win sound quality awards, but please...when it comes to speed stability and lack of rumble, nothing touches a DD.

 

[vinyl1]

I think he means you can literally stall the platter with your hand while changing the record, then let go allowing it to resume speed. Wouldn't the belt get messed up if you tried that with a belt drive?

There are high-end belt drive turntables with very low-torque motors using massive platters.

If you hold them, they will stop. But you have to give them a push to get them started, and it takes about a minute for speed to stabilize.

 

[similost]

Can't you do that with a belt drive?

All the belt drives I've ever seen won't allow you to stop the platter, at least easily, or without doing damage... I've had several belts I couldn't stop, and used to DJ with house equipment, and never did they have a belt drive

another point of a direct drive.. you can scratch.. Just not with mine

 

[jeffn]

All the belt drives I've ever seen won't allow you to stop the platter, at least easily, or without doing damage... I've had several belts I couldn't stop, and used to DJ with house equipment, and never did they have a belt drive

another point of a direct drive.. you can scratch.. Just not with mine

oh ok, so its not that you're saying that most belt drives don't auto switch off when the arm is retracted ?

Mmm, i would have cringed at stopping a DD motor by hand while its driving :scratch2:

 

[similost]

oh ok, so its not that you're saying that most belt drives don't auto switch off when the arm is retracted ?

Mmm, i would have cringed at stopping a DD motor by hand while its driving :scratch2:

No idea if they all switch off while retracted.. I had a few that didn't.. they were manual, but belt drive.. I tend not to like auto tables..

I stop mine DD tables all the time.. and I have for years, and never with a problem.

 

[MuZak]

Belts stretch or the rubber degrades after more than a decade of use, thus what good is the supposed better isolation of belt drive when the speed goes incorrect.

For you its a big problem to change a belt once every 10 years???
ROFLMAO!
Whatever....

I have never had any problems with the supposed cogging effect of direct drive turntables

With a decently high resolution system, the low level grunge
is so distracting, you forget about the music altogether.