Garrard SL95B with Speed issue and Cartridge Mount ?

[Flaps100]

Garrard SL95B in near mint condition with speed issue and weird cartridge mount.
Hopefully this speed issue can be fixed easily, currently turns 35.48 RPM when on 331/3 RPM. Hoping there is an adjustment underneath for this tiny difference although it is clearly audible that it is turning to fast.
Then check out the weird mount on the Cart, kinda ugly and seems odd, can I just get rid of that mount or does the cart sit too high in the headshell then ? See pics
I won't even go into the hum, its minor, but man these old units sure can be frustrating.
Any ideas or easy fix on speed would make me so happy

 

[loudnoises]

Ahhh that's a fantastic cartridge. Virtually skip proof. Great for cars, boats and suspended floors. Buuut it does require a stylus that can track at 1.5g or less. It's just like all the others of the era, it's only the mounting that's different entirely. You might need a new sled, c2, if you change the cartridge. I think that one is keyed. Don't count it out, could be just fine as it sits.

If the idler is riding correctly on the motor spindle there's no taper. Have you cleaned the platter where the idler rides? How's the idler condition?

 

[johnnytarget]

Garrard SL95B in near mint condition with speed issue and weird cartridge mount.
Hopefully this speed issue can be fixed easily, currently turns 35.48 RPM when on 331/3 RPM. Hoping there is an adjustment underneath for this tiny difference although it is clearly audible that it is turning to fast.
Then check out the weird mount on the Cart, kinda ugly and seems odd, can I just get rid of that mount or does the cart sit too high in the headshell then ? See pics
I won't even go into the hum, its minor, but man these old units sure can be frustrating.
Any ideas or easy fix on speed would make me so happy

That is the most minty SL95B mat I've ever seen. The printing on the aluminum insert is perfect, which you almost never see.

This is a TT that's worth restoring. Unfortunately, that is not going to be as easy as you might hope. Indeed, your hope that there's a speed adjustment underneath is in vain. There is not.

My only "idea' on the fix in speed is what has to be done to every old, unrestored Garrard SL-95B: It has to be almost completely taken apart, degunked (all the old, original, now turned to concrete "Garrard gorilla grease" has to be removed) and then reassembled. This is very difficult for someone who hasn't worked with these TTs before. I wouldn't want to do my first (beginner's learning) restore on such a beautiful, mint deck. On the plus side, you probably won't need a donor deck. Which is nice, because many restores nowadays require a couple of donor decks, and they've gotten very expensive over the past five years.

If you can post a photo of the underside of the chassis maybe I can offer a few more pointers. Maybe even something positive or encouraging. ( (As for the cartridge, it's hard to see from that side photo alone. Maybe some shots from other angles?)

I'm sorry if my comment seems like a downer. These are wonderful, classic machines. But an SL-95B mechanically is pretty much more like an old clockworks than a modern piece of electrical equipment. It's a very complicated and long slog to restore these things, and there's a lot of esoteric knowledge on how to do it that's not captured anywhere on paper or pixel and is only in the heads of us old guy restorers.

 

[loudnoises]

The garrards, duals and miracords of this era are built to last. With little more than cleaning and a new idler, they will literally outlive us all.

But of all of the lot the garrard grease is by far the worst. Pivots need to be fully taken apart and cleaned fully. Take lots of pictures. I sometimes use cardboard box tops to keep track of screws and pieces.

 

[Flaps100]

That is the most minty SL95B mat I've ever seen. The printing on the aluminum insert is perfect, which you almost never see.

This is a TT that's worth restoring. Unfortunately, that is not going to be as easy as you might hope. Indeed, your hope that there's a speed adjustment underneath is in vain. There is not.

My only "idea' on the fix in speed is what has to be done to every old, unrestored Garrard SL-95B: It has to be almost completely taken apart, degunked (all the old, original, now turned to concrete "Garrard gorilla grease" has to be removed) and then reassembled. This is very difficult for someone who hasn't worked with these TTs before. I wouldn't want to do my first (beginner's learning) restore on such a beautiful, mint deck. On the plus side, you probably won't need a donor deck. Which is nice, because many restores nowadays require a couple of donor decks, and they've gotten very expensive over the past five years.

If you can post a photo of the underside of the chassis maybe I can offer a few more pointers. Maybe even something positive or encouraging. ( (As for the cartridge, it's hard to see from that side photo alone. Maybe some shots from other angles?)

I'm sorry if my comment seems like a downer. These are wonderful, classic machines. But an SL-95B mechanically is pretty much more like an old clockworks than a modern piece of electrical equipment. It's a very complicated and long slog to restore these things, and there's a lot of esoteric knowledge on how to do it that's not captured anywhere on paper or pixel and is only in the heads of us old guy restorers.

Not a downer at all, but the unit was restored and no gunk underneath, the Auto Functions work perfectly which is from what I read usually the issue, my issue now after playing with it off and on, the more I used it the more odd noises it makes too, Between the speed and the weird noise coming from the platter, I am not sure, I will send some underneath shots tomorrow, any help is appreciated.

 

[Flaps100]

That is the most minty SL95B mat I've ever seen. The printing on the aluminum insert is perfect, which you almost never see.

This is a TT that's worth restoring. Unfortunately, that is not going to be as easy as you might hope. Indeed, your hope that there's a speed adjustment underneath is in vain. There is not.

My only "idea' on the fix in speed is what has to be done to every old, unrestored Garrard SL-95B: It has to be almost completely taken apart, degunked (all the old, original, now turned to concrete "Garrard gorilla grease" has to be removed) and then reassembled. This is very difficult for someone who hasn't worked with these TTs before. I wouldn't want to do my first (beginner's learning) restore on such a beautiful, mint deck. On the plus side, you probably won't need a donor deck. Which is nice, because many restores nowadays require a couple of donor decks, and they've gotten very expensive over the past five years.

If you can post a photo of the underside of the chassis maybe I can offer a few more pointers. Maybe even something positive or encouraging. ( (As for the cartridge, it's hard to see from that side photo alone. Maybe some shots from other angles?)

I'm sorry if my comment seems like a downer. These are wonderful, classic machines. But an SL-95B mechanically is pretty much more like an old clockworks than a modern piece of electrical equipment. It's a very complicated and long slog to restore these things, and there's a lot of esoteric knowledge on how to do it that's not captured anywhere on paper or pixel and is only in the heads of us old guy restorers.

More pics, someone sent me a response telling me the only way to fix speed is to grind down the pulley, well I am not doing that nor do I have the ability to do that.

 

[loudnoises]

Have you done anything to the idler wheel?

The idler is a funky mechanical thing. Size doesn't matter at all here, what ends up actually affecting the speed is grip and the hardness of the rubber. A smooth or hard edge vs soft and grippy will affect both the input and output of power. Too hard is never good, it transfers noise and vibration and won't run at speed. Too soft and it won't run smoothly. I use an emery board to dress the edge. .If it's a table I want to keep, a new idler is usually in the plan, ideally nos in good condition or a modern upgrade. Occasionally you find a good one in the wild, but generally they all want some attention.

Motor mounts as well, they will affect power transfer. Usually a cheap replacement.

 

[Flaps100]

Have you done anything to the idler wheel?

The idler is a funky mechanical thing. Size doesn't matter at all here, what ends up actually affecting the speed is grip and the hardness of the rubber. A smooth or hard edge vs soft and grippy will affect both the input and output of power. Too hard is never good, it transfers noise and vibration and won't run at speed. Too soft and it won't run smoothly. I use an emery board to dress the edge. .If it's a table I want to keep, a new idler is usually in the plan, ideally nos in good condition or a modern upgrade. Occasionally you find a good one in the wild, but generally they all want some attention.

Motor mounts as well, they will affect power transfer. Usually a cheap replacement.

The unit was restored by the person I purchased it from and based on the fact that all auto functions work perfectly and it looks near new? I can clean the idler wheel and the inside edge of the platter, see if that does anything, there is a nos idler on Ebay for $25 and a new one for $78, The unit does make some noise when turning and it sounds like it is coming from the platter itself but I am not really sure on what the noise is. I appreciate your input, thanks

 

[Flaps100]

Have you done anything to the idler wheel?

The idler is a funky mechanical thing. Size doesn't matter at all here, what ends up actually affecting the speed is grip and the hardness of the rubber. A smooth or hard edge vs soft and grippy will affect both the input and output of power. Too hard is never good, it transfers noise and vibration and won't run at speed. Too soft and it won't run smoothly. I use an emery board to dress the edge. .If it's a table I want to keep, a new idler is usually in the plan, ideally nos in good condition or a modern upgrade. Occasionally you find a good one in the wild, but generally they all want some attention.

Motor mounts as well, they will affect power transfer. Usually a cheap replacement.

I just cleaned the inside of the platter where the idler rides and I cleaned the idler wheel, now at 33.3 rpm it is 34.6 compared to 35.48 before cleaning, 0so it slowed down a bit, does that tell you anything, maybe another cleaning or just a nos idler maybe fix the speed issue, the noise I will deal with next, its not so loud that I could not live with it anyway maybe.

 

[Flaps100]

Cleaned idler wheel 2 times got speed down to 34.28 rpm from 35.48. Sounds much more normal now. Would like to be a little closer than this but its a good move in the correct direction. Thanks for all the ideas everyone.

 

[johnnytarget]

More pics, someone sent me a response telling me the only way to fix speed is to grind down the pulley, well I am not doing that nor do I have the ability to do that.

[EDIT: I see from your second post that you seem to have fixed it. So my ravings below are mostly moot. Congrats.]

NEVER grind down the pulley. That is terrible advice.

If it were me, I would buy a new idler wheel. There's a Canadian company that makes wonderful replacements. They are aluminum with a rubber (band-like) drive surface on the outside. They cost about $50.

Even though your idler wheel "looks" good, and even though everyone other than I will tell you that all you have to do is file down the idler and it'll be fine, they are wrong. Your idler is rubber that's at least 30 years old (since the restore) and more likely 55 years old, since it's clearly a Garrard part, not a replacement. Rubber loses its durometer (hardness) over that period of time. Your idler is probably flexing as it turns, which ucks up the speed. Also, it looks like it's had the spit filed out of it. Get a new idler. (I've had the same problem with a flexing idler.)

A few subjective words on SL-95B speed issues. Even when the SL95B is perfectly restored, it will tend to run fast. Generally around 33.44 rpm. This is for two reasons. One, the changers of the era were designed that way, so that when you have the fourth or fifth or sixth (does it stack six, I can't remember) record on the platter, the record will still sound okay, even though the platter is turning a heavy load. (A teensy bit fast sounds fine and no one can tell. Sloooooooooow is always noticeable. The other reason is it's a Garrard and not a Dual. Garrard always had unit to unit speed variations. (A legit restore guy I know told me that Garrard has 6 different pulleys, and if a machine coming off the line was out of spec, that would put a slightly different pulley on it. I believed him at first, but then I measured all the pulleys I have -- many -- and they were all the same.)

Along with getting a new idler, my other suggestion is someone needs to take the motor apart and relubricate it. The last time it was lubricated was probably 30 years ago during the restore. It needs to have its sintered bearing (the part below the ball bearing) cleared out and relubricated with very light oil. Be very careful when taking the motor off that you don't crack or break the 55 year old rubber motor mounts. (Also, please ignore that Youtube video where a guy relubes the motor by turning the TT upside down and opening the motor in situ (while it's attached). That is a prescription from breaking lots of stuff.

TL ; DR
--SL-95Bs are always very finicky in terms of getting them to run at the correct speed. (Speed and auto/changer operation are the two bugaboos. Changer is harder and you've got that.)
-- Get a new idler. (P.S. On some restores, I've had to try a bunch of different idlers before I found one it "liked." Don't ask me why; it makes no sense. It just is.
--Lubricate the motor
--If you can get it to 33.44 or below, declare victory and enjoy.

 

[loudnoises]

If you do get the new machined idler, definitely get the new platter bearing from them as well. Very worthwhile and inexpensive.

 

[johnnytarget]

If you do get the new machined idler, definitely get the new platter bearing from them as well. Very worthwhile and inexpensive.

It is very good but it is very difficult to install the new platter bearing. You have to drop all the stuff underneath the platter on the underside of the chassis.

 

[loudnoises]

It is very good but it is very difficult to install the new platter bearing. You have to drop all the stuff underneath the platter on the underside of the chassis.

Yeah it's a pain, especially that oring at the bottom. But you really need to remove it all to clean the old bearing anyways. They're wide open and build up gunk. It's not everything that needs to come out, just enough to pull the carrier. You can also just loosen things up enough to tilt the bearing past the cam gear, but then you hadn't to flip the table. Easier maneuver on a dual, very good upgrade for either.

 

[Flaps100]

I cleaned it again and now it is turning 33.88 and the wow and flutter is amazing low. Sounds good now and all the Auto Functions work perfectly. Now time to save up and get a dust cover custom made for it.

 

[loudnoises]

Nicely done. These will eventually regain their status once the vinyl world starts looking beyond duals and technics.

Mine behaves much the same; the speed is a bit more "spikey" than the dual or the miracord, but that is without the stylus on the record. Even that minimal drag will smooth it out a hair.

There are a large number of bases and covers out there, might be worth waiting for an original. The big wood clamshell bases are my favorite.

 

[Beobloke]

Slightly off-topic, apologies, but can someone explain the cartridge to me? Never seen one like that before!