God bless plasticky P-mount TTs of the '80s and '90s!

[goldwax]

Why? Because they took all the guesswork out of alignment and they were so cheap that people replaced them fairly often. Result? Well-handled records owned by common folk didn't get messed up due to poor alignment or worn stylii nearly as much as they did in the '60s and '70s.

At least that's my theory based on personal experience. From junior high (1982) till just a couple years ago, I used four such TTs. The first two were Kenwoods (part of rack systems belonging to my folks in the '80s and early '90s) and the second two were my own TTs (a $100 Sony I bought in Japan and a Technics SL-BD20D). I have records going back to the '80s and all of them still very clean--and clean sounding.

Your thoughts?

 

[rushfan]

I owned a BPC JVC turntable in the late 80's. Even then, I thought that it sounded terrible. For some reason it made inner tracks unlistenable. I'm certain that the cartridge was rubbish.

I was always careful with my records as a teen - so much that my friends derided me. I'm glad that I was however, as I still enjoy those unscratched records today.

 

[goldwax]

I owned a BPC JVC turntable in the late 80's. Even then, I thought that it sounded terrible. For some reason it made inner tracks unlistenable. I'm certain that the cartridge was rubbish.

I never noticed that with any of the TTs I had, and they always sounded fine to me. That said, the difference between my Technics and my Thorens was night and day, though of course part of that was down to the cartridge.

I was always careful with my records as a teen - so much that my friends derided me. I'm glad that I was however, as I still enjoy those unscratched records today.

I was too. Right before I got into music big-time, I had a brief (say, six-month) flirtation with comic books via friend who was obsessive about care and handling. It just seemed natural to me to translate that over to records.

 

[myu701]

Took a dusty but good condition YP-211 out of basement storage, threw on a new belt (after cleaning the gunky mess of the old one), reset the weight setting, put on a clean record and then gave it a spin. AT-97E cartridge.

Beautiful!

Just a nice clean basic turntable with very nice honest sound. I A/B'ed the album with the same CD. The output level from the TT was just a little less, so it was a bit cumbersome to keep raising/lowering the volume. But I have to say, I barely heard any difference other than the occasional errant "tick" of the LP during quiet moments... then oddly, in a couple of brief passages, I heard a little extra detail on the LP that was missing from the CD. I repeated just to be sure. Could very well be the mastering of the CD was a little off.

Anyway, I liked the fact that I didn't even have to worry about stylus alignment. :thmbsp:

 

[shimniok]

Interesting... my old JVC pmount didn't wreck my old records too badly... I'm still playing them 20 yrs later and they seem fine. Too bad they didn't have pmounts in the 50's as all those shaded dogs would still sound amazing. I definitely can't hold much against plasticky pmounts given how my Technics sounds.

 

[JohnVF]

I recently set up a plastic Technics P-mount for my niece that used to be one of my TTs in college. All it really needed was a new belt. I put on some Sinatra (she digs Frank) and it sounded pretty decent for a plastic started turntable, and it was pretty much plug and play for her, which is what she wanted to start out with. That said, it didn't sound all that great, either, and I'm afraid that it will inplant in her the idea that all record players sound sort of thin and tinny. While they may have helped keep records undamaged, they may also have hastened the banishment of the whole medium for a while, too, by not sounding so great and not putting up a decent fight against CDs. Between a plastic p-mount TT and CD, I'll take the CD player anytime (and usually did, when that was the choice I had).

 

[goldwax]

While they may have helped keep records undamaged, they may also have hastened the banishment of the whole medium for a while, too, by not sounding so great and not putting up a decent fight against CDs.

That's a good point. Ah, well--we lost the war and then won the battle!

 

[Kevin A]

My first two turntables were a couple of Technics p-mount DD TTs that were a breeze to set-up and play. They both sounded 'okay'— but once I got a NEW CD player ($$$) in early '84, I made the transition to the digital domain—and my TTs went into storage until recently.

I've since sold the both of them and acquired a non "p-mount" table.

 

[LeeVing]

I have my back-up P mount Technics SL-B200 running to a SX-535 with Realistic Optimum 5's. So the sound isn't going to be that great. It doesn't sound too bad for what it is, tho.

The old cart I just switched from, can't find a whole lot of info on it, but I don't think it was anything special.

 

[asmd]

imho, a testament to the fact that some of moms old vinyl survived us kids to this very day that i may enjoy them still.

 

[chadnliz]

Too bad P mounters never really hear how good Vinyl can sound.

 

[Garrard201]

Yes, BUT... how many disks from the 80s/90s would you actually want? : )

 

[SA-708]

Too bad P mounters never really hear how good Vinyl can sound.

I just mounted an Empire 195LT with a new-old-stock S485 stylus on my SL-M3, and it sounds bloody good. But then, the SL-M3 isn't plastic.

 

[chadnliz]

Not all P mounts are bad but in general its fair to say many if not the majority of P mount tables and carts cant give you the very good quality sound serious audio guys often demand.

 

[nolan]

Not all P mounts are bad but in general its fair to say many if not the majority of P mount tables and carts cant give you the very good quality sound serious audio guys often demand.

Fair to say ???? How many p-mounts do you own ????

 

[JohnVF]

Yes, BUT... how many disks from the 80s/90s would you actually want? : )

I have a LOT. The '80s and '90s were great for indie rock fans.

Speaking of p-mounts, I have a p-mount moving coil from Azden that sounds really good, and I run it regularly on one of my turntables with a standard mount adapter that came with it. It's such an odd cart, because neither Azden nor P-mounts in general were thought to be very good. I guess there are exceptions to everything.

Some of the P-mount linear tracking tables sounded pretty decent.

 

[SA-708]

Not all P mounts are bad but in general its fair to say many if not the majority of P mount tables and carts cant give you the very good quality sound serious audio guys often demand.

The problem with p-mount wasn't the concept itself, but that the standard was adopted at a time that mass-market audio, in general, became cheaper and more plastic. The good p-mount turntables were probably outnumbered by the cheap ones, because cheap probably sold better. By the mid-80s, turntables were having to compete with the sub-$200 CD players.

There were also a good number of great p-mount cartridges produced, but they were probably outnumbered by the bottom-of-the-line models destined for the bottom-of-the-line p-mount turntables. Most of the nice ones are no longer in production, which is why my p-mount cartridge collection is dominated by previously-owned or cartridges for which I've purchased new (or new-old-stock) stylii, with the odd new-old-stock cartridge. There's no other way to get the p-mount offerings once made by Empire or ADC, or the high-end models that Shure and AudioTechnica and Ortofon and Stanton/Pickering no longer manufacture.

Oh, and I have lots of great post-punk records from the 80s, that survived being played on my SL-BD22 with a Pickering TL-1E cartridge.

 

[Shackman55]

Too bad P mounters never really hear how good Vinyl can sound.

I don't think I would be so dismissive, yes there are far more and better 1/2" out there, but I remember hearing a Technics SlB something or other, plastic table with a Grado Green P-mount that sounded pretty darn ok! And as opposed to some of the BSR's with knitting needles for a stylus It did just fine. And to someone who is being introduced to vinyl (I have a 23 year old boss, I am teaching the art of vinyl to)for the first time it would be darn impressive. The only thing I see wrong really is the need for some dampening material in most of those plastic tables.

 

[lico]

I'm not a serious audio guy but my Technics SL-Q200 with a Grado Black on it sounds good to me.

 

[Tromatic]

Fair to say ???? How many p-mounts do you own ????

All you have to do is compare the construction of an average p-mount to an average standard TT of the day. Some p-mounts are good, but overall not hte best as machinery goes.