Grace F9 + Soundsmith Stylus vs. Anything else +/- $400

[doodahman]

Hi, I've had a Grace F9 Ruby for decades... it's been re-cantilevered twice and I'm reluctant to keep sinking money into it, even though I absolutely love the way it sounds (or sounded). The second repaired/replaced cantilever broke off in normal use after about 18 months. (This isn't a criticism...)

So, a replacement stylus from Sound-Smith ranges from $200-$500. (As opposed to a repair... I'm not interested in another repair.) My budget is closer to $250.

If I sold the cartridge (even with broken cantilever), it looks like I could get maybe $150-200. So, that plus my $250 budget means I could buy something new in the $450 range.

What would you do? A Soundsmith stylus for $250ish or a new cart (like what?) for $400ish?

 

[noisefreq]

If it were me, I'd save up for something else AND keep the Grace.
Something tells me you will want to go back to it after you experience a different cartridge for a while.
I recently had my F9 re-tipped with a line contact and it sounds more musical than any other cartridge I've heard but I've not heard the Bronze.
The SS nude elliptical was my plan B but the re-tip worked out... for now (hasn't been 18 months yet).

 

[Tucker99]

Or check out ex AKer Needlestein for replacement cantilever chouces. Cheaper tha Soundsmith I believe.

I can message you contact info and some details if you want.

Just a comment but putting a new cantilever onto a Grace F9 isn't the same as an expensive repair on a beater vehicle. One would not repair a $40 cartridge but the Grace is a different story, my opinion.

Fare well regardless of which way you jump.

Cheers

 

[Blue Shadow]

@Aerobat had a SS F9e and he moved on to an AT LOMC, 33 something and never looked back.

 

[noisefreq]

Needlestein is who did my retip.
I think you'd be fine either way, retip or SoundSmith.

As far as choosing a different cartridge, I'm not versed in moving coils so no help there.
But your AR/Jelco 250 would be a candidate for some less expensive nice MMs/MIs like Pickering or Grado.
Certainly a different flavor but still excellent sounding carts.

 

[twiiii]

A Grace is a very special cartridge, What I don't understand is why you keep trashing your cartridge. I suspect its the arm you are using. That is where you need to do some upgrading investment. Cartridges have tended to become brighter over the years, so if you like your Grace, get it repaired. I love my Dynavector 10 X 5 and 20 X 2, but they are now out of your budget. I am not n Ortofon fan. As they have become brighter like the earlier MC series. Good luck.

 

[noisefreq]

A Grace is a very special cartridge, What I don't understand is why you keep trashing your cartridge. I suspect its the arm you are using. That is where you need to do some upgrading investment. Cartridges have tended to become brighter over the years, so if you like your Grace, get it repaired. I love my Dynavector 10 X 5 and 20 X 2, but they are now out of your budget. I am not n Ortofon fan. As they have become brighter like the earlier MC series. Good luck.

I was thinking the same thing. Maybe the Jelco is too heavy for the Grace's compliance?

 

[Tucker99]

Two quick further comments...

If you have anyone near'ish to perhaps you could borrow some carts to trial and see what you might like. Advisories on sound are like wines...can be great but still not to your liking.

I predict, because of the above, that you will get a for/agin scorecard on the Grace and a pile of assorted recommendations that will leave you not confused but unenlightened.

If you lived nearby I would loan out some from my stash both better and lesser than the Grace...would be fun to see how you ranked them in your system which, IMO, is the acid test...

Again, good luck with this small audio adventure.

 

[twiiii]

Well I read about your tone arm and it is sort of like my SME 3009 Model III was. They were both deigned for low mass light weight tracking cartridges. Thats a dangerous combination in my opinion when it comes to longevity when the human hand is responsible for placing the stylus in exactly the right location. You miss the proper landing point and you are guaranteed to have a costly accident. I would want to change to a medium mass cartridge with a stronger cantilever that tracks at a higher pressure so the arm isn't as apt to get away from you. Of course a fully and semi automatic tone arm TT combination would be best. In 50 years I have only trashed one MC cartridge and that was because the stylus was fastened to the cantilever improperly. Ortofon fixed The SPE for free even though it was out of warranty. I have worn a few out V-15 V MR styli and trashed one Stanton 981 Stylus because I wasn't concentrating. But for the past 45 years I have been using linear arms with electrical cue and auto lift at the end. Better tracking, less downforce required, and less likely-hood of damage.

 

[ripblade]

Hi, I've had a Grace F9 Ruby for decades... it's been re-cantilevered twice and I'm reluctant to keep sinking money into it, even though I absolutely love the way it sounds (or sounded). The second repaired/replaced cantilever broke off in normal use after about 18 months. (This isn't a criticism...)

So, a replacement stylus from Sound-Smith ranges from $200-$500. (As opposed to a repair... I'm not interested in another repair.) My budget is closer to $250.

If I sold the cartridge (even with broken cantilever), it looks like I could get maybe $150-200. So, that plus my $250 budget means I could buy something new in the $450 range.

What would you do? A Soundsmith stylus for $250ish or a new cart (like what?) for $400ish?

A bird in hand is worth two in the bush. Are you feeling adventurous? An F9 with Ruby CL is special, especially if it's already your favourite.

 

[bberkom]

I love my F9. The cheapest soundsmith option sounds excellent, and I want to try a nicer model. They are pricey, but it is right up there with my Shure V15 III SAS.

 

[srs735]

I never spent much time with the F9E. I listebed to it enough to know I wanted ti hear what it was capable of.

have 2 of the Soundsmith replacement stylus. The RS-9U is very nice, the Ruby OCL is exceptionally good. I haven't compar3d them to my Ortofon 2m Bronze or Black.

I have no plans to let my Grace go anywhere

Just my 2 cents

Good luck with your search

 

[doodahman]

A Grace is a very special cartridge, What I don't understand is why you keep trashing your cartridge. ...

It's a long sad story. I'm not sure what happened the first time -- I discovered the original cantilever missing after the TT had been in storage for years.

The initial, replaced cantilever broke after only 3 months later, thanks to a housekeeper who decided to dust off the TT (argh).

The second replaced-cantilever just fell off in normal use -- and that (the fact it just seemed to fall off) is what scares me away from another repair. I've been reluctant to re-cantilever again because I fear that each successive repair affects the structural integrity of the stylus. Maybe I'm wrong.

I know that history sounds like I maybe can't care for a cart, but I swear that's not the case. LOL ... for at least 20 years all was fine. (+/- 30 if you count the 10 years in storage)

... I suspect its the arm you are using. That is where you need to do some upgrading investment. Cartridges have tended to become brighter over the years, so if you like your Grace, get it repaired. I love my Dynavector 10 X 5 and 20 X 2, but they are now out of your budget. I am not n Ortofon fan. As they have become brighter like the earlier MC series. Good luck.

In fact, that's what I've done - I ordered a Jelco TK-850 yesterday - that's what prompted this thread. I've been using an AT-95E as an interim cart and can't bear the thought of a $50 cart on such a nice arm.

 

[doodahman]

Well I read about your tone arm and it is sort of like my SME 3009 Model III was. They were both deigned for low mass light weight tracking cartridges. Thats a dangerous combination in my opinion when it comes to longevity when the human hand is responsible for placing the stylus in exactly the right location...

I really hadn't thought about that -- that simply the action of placing (or mis-placing) the arm/stylus onto the record could be part of the problem or at least contributing.

 

[pfcs49]

One of my PX-2s came with a broken F9E, and I was able to buy a new NOS stylus for it ($250!). It's been on my shelf for ~6 years now. Like a fine bottle of wine, waiting for that special occasion!

Meanwhile, I'm content with the other stuff in my signature. How good CAN it be? We'll see.

 

[Aerobat]

One of my PX-2s came with a broken F9E, and I was able to buy a new NOS stylus for it ($250!). It's been on my shelf for ~6 years now. Like a fine bottle of wine, waiting for that special occasion!

Meanwhile, I'm content with the other stuff in my signature. How good CAN it be? We'll see.

That fine bottle of wine has a suspension that is slowly hardening...I'd not invest further in the Grace, as good as it was, and save my pennies for something modern.

 

[pfcs49]

Most of my cartridges are of the same vintage and are still fine. I'm always hearing that Bang & Olufsen carts are pretty useless due to their age and you should shun B&O decks because the OE cartridges are NLA.
I have 5 MMC-2s and only one is degraded.
And, according to Peter (Soundsmith) the B&O suspensions soften when they fail.
Me? I'm just an old VW mechanic. I've been wrong a few times

 

[doodahman]

That fine bottle of wine has a suspension that is slowly hardening...I'd not invest further in the Grace, as good as it was, and save my pennies for something modern.

thanks, I’d not heard that as a potential issue. Is it more likely if a cart has been sitting unused for years? I know for other electronic gear, those kinds of issues are less common if the device has stayed in use. Of course use leads to other wear problems...