Grado P-mount question

[Decibel_116]

I recently picked up a used Technics p-mount table with a Grado cartridge on it. I have never verntured into Grado territory so I'm kinda lost. I attached a photo of it. I was wondering what level (or grade) this particular Grado is. I looked through my loupe and it appears to be an elliptical stylus. That's about all I know. What I am trying to figure out is if it is worth upgrading with a new stylus and put it back on the Technics when I am finished with the refurb. Anybody know anything about this model? It looks like it says XF 3 on the front. I couldn't find much with a Google search other maybe it is possible to put an "8MZ" stylus on it (whatever that means). Any thoughts are appreciated.

 

[marcmorin]

I recently picked up a used Technics p-mount table with a Grado cartridge on it. I have never verntured into Grado territory so I'm kinda lost. I attached a photo of it. I was wondering what level (or grade) this particular Grado is. I looked through my loupe and it appears to be an elliptical stylus. That's about all I know. What I am trying to figure out is if it is worth upgrading with a new stylus and put it back on the Technics when I am finished with the refurb. Anybody know anything about this model? It looks like it says XF 3 on the front. I couldn't find much with a Google search other maybe it is possible to put an "8MZ" stylus on it (whatever that means). Any thoughts are appreciated.View attachment 720291

The XF3 was a mid level cartridge. in todays line, the equiv would be the blue/red. If your diamond is in good condition, replacing it with a blue or red stylus would be a lateral move. The 8MZ stylus will work fine, and be a big step up in performance

 

[Vinylmasters]

From a huge fan of P-mounts who has a LOT of Technics tables, get a good Audio Technica (even a basic AT-92E works well on these tables) or Panasonic/Technics P-mount. You'll never regret it, and it will be easier on your wallet too.Plus - you'll be in spec that way too (Grado's are NOT made to the correct P-mount specs and need to be tracker heavier as well).

 

[BrocLuno]

Grado made some very nice T4P mount cartridges. If the table has adjustable down force, it's no big deal to find the sweet spot

 

[Bourbon]

I don't have the XF3, but I do have a Grado Blue - with a recently-installed 8MZ stylus. I really didn't like the performance of the cartridge with the original stylus, but I love the sound that comes from using the 8MZ. Yes, it was pricey, but worth every penny. If your cartridge can accept the 8MZ, I would definitely recommend it.

 

[Decibel_116]

Thanks for the replies. I do have a p-mount technics that will let me adjust the VTF. Actually a couple of them. So, the consensus seems to be that the 8MZ stylus will work in my cartridge. That's great news. I will give it a shot as I haven't ever had a Grado in rotation. I'm wondering how it will compare with the Stanton/Pickering cartridge I have with a D73S stylus or the ADC PSX-40.

 

[Vinylmasters]

Thanks for the replies. I do have a p-mount technics that will let me adjust the VTF. Actually a couple of them. So, the consensus seems to be that the 8MZ stylus will work in my cartridge. That's great news. I will give it a shot as I haven't ever had a Grado in rotation. I'm wondering how it will compare with the Stanton/Pickering cartridge I have with a D73S stylus or the ADC PSX-40.

The ADC will probably be the best of the lot on a typical plastic base Technics table. Get the older-style Audio Techinca if you can however. It will stun you the amount of depth you'll get from those tables

 

[Decibel_116]

The ADC will probably be the best of the lot on a typical plastic base Technics table. Get the older-style Audio Techinca if you can however. It will stun you the amount of depth you'll get from those tables

I must agree with you Vinylmasters. I have a bunch of the older style AT P-mount cartridges. Most notable is the AT155LC/U with an NOS ATN-152 stylus. This cartridge sounds great on anything from the lowly SL-BD20 belt drive all the way up to the SL-QX200 with quartz-locked direct drive. I have yet to try it on my SL-7, but I'm sure it would sound phenomenal. One thing I would like to understand is what are the differences between the older AT P-mounts. For instance, the difference between the "made for Radio Shack" RX-1500 and the top of the line AT-155LC/U. I have tried the ATN-152 stylus on a few of the "run of the mill" old style ATs and I couldn't tell a difference except for the color of the cartridge body. But, I am getting off topic now. Are you saying that the AT will sound better than the Grado?

Since I have not used a Grado cartridge before, the plan is to try it on my SL-QX200. Since I already have the AT-155LC/U, is it not really worth it to upgrade my Grado with the 8MZ stylus?

 

[marcmorin]

I must agree with you Vinylmasters. I have a bunch of the older style AT P-mount cartridges. Most notable is the AT155LC/U with an NOS ATN-152 stylus. This cartridge sounds great on anything from the lowly SL-BD20 belt drive all the way up to the SL-QX200 with quartz-locked direct drive. I have yet to try it on my SL-7, but I'm sure it would sound phenomenal. One thing I would like to understand is what are the differences between the older AT P-mounts. For instance, the difference between the "made for Radio Shack" RX-1500 and the top of the line AT-155LC/U. I have tried the ATN-152 stylus on a few of the "run of the mill" old style ATs and I couldn't tell a difference except for the color of the cartridge body. But, I am getting off topic now. Are you saying that the AT will sound better than the Grado?

Since I have not used a Grado cartridge before, the plan is to try it on my SL-QX200. Since I already have the AT-155LC/U, is it not really worth it to upgrade my Grado with the 8MZ stylus?

I have the ATN152LP stylus plugged into a Signet AM body. It's quite a nice cart. It doesn't have as much "meat on the bones" as my Signature 8MZ. As they say, the devil is in the details. There is a bit of difference in detail between a Grado and an AT. Most of that difference in detail is where instruments are placed in the sound field. And, the Grado will always have a bit more booty than an AT

 

[Decibel_116]

I have the ATN152LP stylus plugged into a Signet AM body. It's quite a nice cart. It doesn't have as much "meat on the bones" as my Signature 8MZ. As they say, the devil is in the details. There is a bit of difference in detail between a Grado and an AT. Most of that difference in detail is where instruments are placed in the sound field. And, the Grado will always have a bit more booty than an AT

That settles it then. I will have to try the 8MZ. Thanks marcmorin for your reply.

 

[Vinylmasters]

I must agree with you Vinylmasters. I have a bunch of the older style AT P-mount cartridges. Most notable is the AT155LC/U with an NOS ATN-152 stylus. This cartridge sounds great on anything from the lowly SL-BD20 belt drive all the way up to the SL-QX200 with quartz-locked direct drive. I have yet to try it on my SL-7, but I'm sure it would sound phenomenal. One thing I would like to understand is what are the differences between the older AT P-mounts. For instance, the difference between the "made for Radio Shack" RX-1500 and the top of the line AT-155LC/U. I have tried the ATN-152 stylus on a few of the "run of the mill" old style ATs and I couldn't tell a difference except for the color of the cartridge body. But, I am getting off topic now. Are you saying that the AT will sound better than the Grado?

Since I have not used a Grado cartridge before, the plan is to try it on my SL-QX200. Since I already have the AT-155LC/U, is it not really worth it to upgrade my Grado with the 8MZ stylus?

Yes, without a doubt the AT will sound better than the Grado IMHO. NEVER was a fan of them truthfully. They just sound 'dead' to me.

 

[Mariolmb]

Hello,


Nice threads,
now that discussion turned on the side of AT, may be you could help me.

I have and old Joseph Grado 8mz cart and stylus on my Heybrook TT2 with Linn tonearm, sounded pretty good, I really enjoy it for many decade now.
For now, in my mains system, the second TT is:
Technics SL-23( medium mass tone arm) Pickering v15 with an 4606DEX stylus
(just have ~ 10 hours on it, but even if I liked it, I'm not in love, even if it bumped another TT in my main system) .
My taste is not that this Pickering is not good, but compare to my Grado, the drum and the lead guitar is lot more on the dry side.
As I'm more use to the warmer side of my Grado,

Here is my dilemma:

1) I have an AT15XE cart, no stylus.
Is somebody know, what is the best stylus I can offer to that 15XE body to be at least, as refined as the Pickering, but on the warmer side of the Grado?
this 15XE test: 0.392 and 0.430 H / 430 and 492 ohm ( am I out of balance here?) and could use another TT with a tonearm having less mass (HK T60 if better idea for the styli)

2) I also have an P mount Grado no stylus :
It is black, in front there is a big "G". and below it is write "grado" (minor caracter) .
Tested 479 and 480 Ohm
and .040 and .041 H
Do you know which body this could be?
could it be compatible with an 8MZ Styli?
I could use it on my linear Sony PS-LX520 pmount

and finally:

3) What do you think is the best approach?
or Which way have more chance to best the other one?

Thanks

Mario

 

[HypnoToad]

I had a Technics SL-7 for a while and put a Grado Blue P mount on it and it sang, much better than the cart that came with it. As to the tracking weight, the Grado's are a different weight so they automatically have the correct stylus force, I weighed mine with an industrial measurement scale and it worked out perfectly with the standard settings.

 

[Decibel_116]

Mario,

I had an SL-23 before. I have no experience with the AT-15XE, but stereoneedles still has the original replacement stylus available. I had several cartridges for my SL-23. The ones I liked the most were the Shure M91ED and, my favorite, Shure V15 Type IV. If you want something more current, the Audio Technica AT-150MLX is very close (IMHO) to the Shure V15 Type IV. However, I heard this cartridge is also being discontinued. I recommend you start a thread for your SL-23 to get some current recommendations. There are several folks here that currently own SL-23s. I can't help you with the Grado cartridges at all. I still have not tried out the Grado this thread was started about.

Dave

 

[marcmorin]

Hello,



2) I also have an P mount Grado no stylus :
It is black, in front there is a big "G". and below it is write "grado" (minor caracter) .
Tested 479 and 480 Ohm
and .040 and .041 H
Do you know which body this could be?
could it be compatible with an 8MZ Styli?
I could use it on my linear Sony PS-LX520 pmount


Thanks

Mario

If the coil cover is chrome color, it is equiv to the black through red bodies offered today, if the coil cover is gold, it is equiv to the current Silver or Gold bodies offered today. The 8MZ stylus will plug right into that P mount body.

You'll not find any AT to have the "warmish" character that the Grado does

 

[Mariolmb]

If the coil cover is chrome color, it is equiv to the black through red bodies offered today, if the coil cover is gold, it is equiv to the current Silver or Gold bodies offered today. The 8MZ stylus will plug right into that P mount body.

You'll not find any AT to have the "warmish" character that the Grado does

Thanks M. Morin for a so clear

I have another Grado that I could use

it's greenish color,
mark: FT+.
test: 671/673 ohm, and .034/.035H
and the coil chrome is 1/4 inch longer then the other one,
is it a better body for the 8mz then the other one?


Mario

 

[marcmorin]

Thanks M. Morin for a so clear

I have another Grado that I could use

it's greenish color,
mark: FT+.
test: 671/673 ohm, and .034/.035H
and the coil chrome is 1/4 inch longer then the other one,
is it a better body for the 8mz then the other one?


Mario

No, as there was a change in the F series. The first run of the F series has a different stylus holder than the second run. The FTE+1 would have been a gray body, that one will accept the 8MZ stylus, but your other body is a better one that won't need a change in input loading.

 

[Mariolmb]

No, as there was a change in the F series. The first run of the F series has a different stylus holder than the second run. The FTE+1 would have been a gray body, that one will accept the 8MZ stylus, but your other body is a better one that won't need a change in input loading.[/QU

Thanks,

OK,
so is an standard black or green Styli go there, without any change to input load and play on standard TT
(FTE+1, now that I know, I could say it is grey)

Mario

 

[doctor fuse]

I have been running a Prestige Green1 with an upgraded 8MZ stylus, but got a good deal on an XF-3 from fleabay (I wanted a backup body for the Green's original stylus, which is still in fine shape). I've just mounted the XF-3 and put it on - WOW!
It sounds even better than the 8MZ! Way less surface noise (hardly any audible pops and clicks - almost silent!), awesome tracking, deeper bass, and the same shimmering top end. The mid-range may be a tad less sweet and full, but I am hoping it opens up with a bit of play (I didn't look at the date code before I mounted it, but it must be about 30 years old).
Is this what they call a "nude stylus"? It is a very tiny needle. I don't think the 8MZ is an upgrade at all; the opposite, in fact.

 

[Mariolmb]

I have been running a Prestige Green1 with an upgraded 8MZ stylus, but got a good deal on an XF-3 from fleabay (I wanted a backup body for the Green's original stylus, which is still in fine shape). I've just mounted the XF-3 and put it on - WOW!
It sounds even better than the 8MZ! Way less surface noise (hardly any audible pops and clicks - almost silent!), awesome tracking, deeper bass, and the same shimmering top end. The mid-range may be a tad less sweet and full, but I am hoping it opens up with a bit of play (I didn't look at the date code before I mounted it, but it must be about 30 years old).
Is this what they call a "nude stylus"? It is a very tiny needle. I don't think the 8MZ is an upgrade at all; the opposite, in fact.[/Q

Hi Doctor fuse,

According to the only reference I got,
Your equivalent stylus is this one:
"http://www.gradoheadphones.ca/styli.htm"
So you coiuld pick your info there,
for my part, I think it's an "1985" Blue equivalent.
Look like equivalent or +/- little better then your previous green with green stylus.
But I'm not really sure, as I don't experience it.


But one thing I am sure, it's if you can go with an Blue, you could go with an 8 mz with better result.
That I'm sure, my ears told me that long time ago.

If your green play your 8MZ,
did you try your green with your green stylus,
I suspect your 8mz stylus finish.
But if not, may be you got another stylus on this XF-3, , hard to say with Grado styli.
Each side of the body of the stylus there is 2 point with color, do you have color on this stylus ????
So if you have a chance,
try the 8MZ on this body ,
and the green with this body stylus too,
just to understand what happen there.
To confirm what you previously said.

But sound is a question of taste, may be you could like more what you ear with your XF-3 then your Mz and that's find to.
But the surface noise with grado 8MZ is really suspect, if LP are in good shape
Me I got a couple Grado, and all of the color even to gold are lot less then my 8MZ.
I'll say that, but starting from the red color, it's becoming less evident, but for me it's really different.
And my grado 8MZ body and 8mz stylus is my best cartridge of all my good cartridge for the surface noise, it beat my Red hand's down, and the red is suppose to be little higher level, and more improve then the XF-3(Older Blue equivalent).

But for the rest, you will need to be confirm by a guy who got more experience then me with this XF-3.
The problem will be to identify witch stylus is on this older body that sound so good.
And I really hope you'll find it...
May be you discover the stylus that I'll need to get,

I know it will not help a lot, because I never ear this one XFf-3, but if it sound like a blue (Blue is good) ,
but for "me" ....something is wrong with this 8Mz.


Mario