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help choosing a TT

Yggdrasill

Yggdrasill

AK Subscriber
Subscriber
I have bunch of albums in boxes I'd like to pull out and become reaquainted with. I've recently gotten into vintage audio and replaced my surround system with two channel. There're some TTs for sale locally and I was hoping for input on quality/prices. These all appear to be in very good condition.

Stromberg Carlson Perfectempo $200
HK 720 $100
Pioneer PL-A35 $140
Marantz 6110 - $100

The Stromberg has a beautiful wood case, but the arm is so light, it makes me nervous to touch it!

Any thoughts on these TTs?

Thanks,

Thor
 
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If it is in good condition, I would buy the Marantz. The Perfectempo isn't really upto modern (after 1970) standards and the Pioneer (fully automatic) I would fear mechanical problems. The Marantz features auto lift off only, which implies (likely) a well behaved tonearm and mechanical simplicity. The looks and specs are also pretty nice.
 
SaSi said:
If it is in good condition, I would buy the Marantz. The Perfectempo isn't really upto modern (after 1970) standards and the Pioneer (fully automatic) I would fear mechanical problems. The Marantz features auto lift off only, which implies (likely) a well behaved tonearm and mechanical simplicity. The looks and specs are also pretty nice.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the advice. In what way is the Stromberg not up to modern standards? I guess I asking, what standards? How would this TT differ from the others I listed or from modern TTs in general? Complete newbie question, I know, but I really don't know what to look for in either a vintage or modern TT.

Thor
 
A lot of the TT business is not based on looks. There are few somewhat homely looking TT's that are stellar performers. The thing is it's an analog mechanical system vs. digital for CD. That means what we are interested in are mostly mechanical attributes. Arm gimbal bearings so the arm tracks with no side loading. Good anti-skate system so the stylus tracks evenly from lead in groove to run out groove. And since the geometry is constantly changing through the play arc, this is a bit tricky. Smmoooottthhh even platter rotation. It's not easy to get, and when it's wrong, it will be in your speakers in a heart beat. Good speed control to eliminate WOW. If you think about a stylus climbing a hill as it encounters a warp, that means there is work being done. It varies around the record, yet the speed must stay absolute.

So if Sasi says the Carlson is not up to spec, it likely has a simple gimbal and the arm may not have anti-skate? If it also offers automatic features, it'll be taking the power from the platter system. Then all the linkages will tie the arm directly to the platter and motor so those noises will feed into the arm and then into your stylus and you'll hear all that. It may be subtle, but it will be there masking part of the music.
 
I have no experience with the other turntables, but I have the Marantz 6200. Mine is a belt drive, and I love it very much. The arm on mine is still very free moving (I am not sure what the term for that is) but I know that it takes a really bad record or a pretty good bump to make it skip. I also have no issue with the speed staying constant. I am not sure how much different the 6110 is and in what condition it is in, but mine seems to be very reliable.
 
not so fast on the marantz

First of all, I think all of those prices are kind of outrageous, barring an impressive guarantee and excellent cartridges.

I'm not a big fan of the Marantz 6110. I have one. Seems to run a little slow, I don't think the arm is particularly great and, in general it just seems a little below par compared to other broadly comparable turntables I've encountered which consist of 2 P-mount Technics (underrated, in fact I have one such table I'd give to you but it is in another state from me at the moment until September), Technics SL-1700 (Mk1), Pioneer PL-115D, Pioneer PL-4.

In contrast to the previous poster, what irks me most about the Marantz is how much less free moving the arm is than the other tables I've had. Might be a maintenence issue though. Remember also that Marantz turntables are not actually made by Marantz. Not to say they are bad for that reason but they have no connection to their great receivers, for example. In any case, the 6200 is part of a different line of Marantz turntables that look to be somewhat more substantial.

I'd go for the Pioneer out of that bunch. They seem to be very well made turntables and if the automatic functions do break, you can just run it manually. If it's anything like the PL-115D, which it seems to be based on a picture I googled, it has a suspended platter, a decent arm and should be reliable.

I don't know anything about the HK but it looks pretty cool.

Be patient, ask around. Much better deals are out there, even without having to resort to EBay. I scored my p-mount technics (quartz drive and aluminum arm - not like the bd20's plastic one) for 10 bucks from my used record store because it didn't have a power cord, the Technics SL-1700 (outstanding table) from the same place for $40, was given the Pioneer which is sitting around in need of a belt, and got off of Ebay a beautiful Dual 505-II with Shure V15vmr for $80. I don't recommend EBay, though, because of shipping scariness and the fact that you never really know what your getting. My Dual ended up needing another $80 worth of work to get up to spec but it was still worth it due to the V15 and the excellent primary system I now have for less than $200.
 
The funny thing is that I would go for the Harman Kardon HK720. The platter has a good weight one it and the mat is better than half decent.
Saying that, the Pioneer suspension would suit a floor that is not stone, and a space that is not large.
 
I think they're all overpriced. I'd go for the HK or the Pioneer. The HK is belt drive, has selectors for capacitance, which is rare, and has auto return. The Pioneer I believe was top of its line before the direct drives came along. If the automation works now, you shouldn't have any problems. You might have to open it and add some grease--no big deal. It's when it has sat unused and the grease hardens that problems occur.

I wouldn't pay more than $75 for either of them.

The Stromberg Carlson looks like an interesting collectors item, but how do you know what it will sound like or if it will even track records well? And I'd never pay that much for a question mark.
 
Stromberg and listening

Really interestng discussion, thanks.

Actually, this guy has all the stuff in his living room and I heard the Stromberg playing Kind of Blue through an Accuphase E303 and some amazing vintage Infinitis, big floor standers. Sounded great, but I didn't compare it to any of the others, though he would be happy to let me. He had about 10 TTs for sale; the ones I listed were just what he recommended.

My impression is that the prices are on the high end but that everything has been well cared for. This guy had a HUGE record collection, probably 90% classical, and a number of vintage speakers for sale as well - Mcintosh, AR, Bose, and some others I don't remember. He was asking $800 for the Accuphase as well, but I don't need nor can afford that.

The thing is, I don't know what to listen for, exactly. I should do more research but I didn't realized this was a complicated as it appears to be.
 
Might make sense to also list the cartridges you'd get with each model and their condition - depending on that, the prices might just as well be pretty fair...

Greetings from Munich!

Manfred / lini
 
goblue said:
First of all, I think all of those prices are kind of outrageous, barring an impressive guarantee and excellent cartridges.

Remember also that Marantz turntables are not actually made by Marantz. Not to say they are bad for that reason but they have no connection to their great receivers, for example. In any case, the 6200 is part of a different line of Marantz turntables that look to be somewhat more substantial.
Click to expand...

I believe the Marantz 6200 was made by Yamaha: I have a 6200 and my brother has a MOTL belt drive Yamaha and they both use pretty much identical tone arms, the same P/N on their motors, and electronic boards that are identical (I think his Yamaha is a YP-B2 model). Some of the other Marantz turntables (6100 etc.) look very similar to MOTL Pioneers and Panasonics. Anyway, even though Marantz bought their turntables from other companies and stuck their name on them, they are still pretty good turntables.
 
No, it's very unlikely that Yamaha made the 6200 for Marantz. More than likely, a third party, probably CEC, made them for both. Furthermore, the arms were all patterned after the Acos Lustre arm and that's why they all look so similar. And yes, CEC made some decent turntables.
 
What company is CEC? I've never heard of them. Maybe these tonearms were built by Koshin Denki or Chuo Denki ?
 
I've got a Pioneer PL-A35 and it's an okay table. I had to jack around with mine to get it working correctly. That one, however, is kinda overpriced. If you decide on it anyway, make sure the anti-skate weight and string are intact. I'm running an old AT cart on mine and it sounds good. Not great, but good.
 
Thanks for all the info, it seems as though our old "Marantz" turntables were indeed built by very reliable sources.
 
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