• The move to the new server is done. There are some software and database maintenance updates in process. This has us passing the hat around to help out. We appreciate any donations. Seriously, even a dollar helps. The payment page may be found here - https://www.audiokarma.org/support.html

Help choosing the right tube

Echolane

Echolane

New Member
My Audiomat Arpége blew two of four JJ EL34s. I thought I’d like to try something new.
I’m choosing between current-production Mullard reissue EL34s and genuine SED/Svetlana Winged C EL34s for an Audiomat Arpège. My listening is mostly opera and classical music, and my biggest concern is soprano reproduction. I’m very sensitive to hardness or glare in the upper register.


Has anyone actually compared these two tubes in a high-quality hi-fi amplifier, particularly with female classical voice? I’d especially like to hear from anyone who listens to opera. Do the Winged Cs give a more natural, dimensional soprano voice than the Mullards without losing air and detail?

Or have you listened to the Winged Cs? If so, I’d really like your opinion as to how they sound
 
Register to hide this ad
I suspect from the release date of the amp that it is over 20 years old. It may require some servicing if so. It is possible the coupling caps to the output tubes are leaking direct current that would change the bias on the tubes to make them conduct too much current. I would check that out. Again, if the amp is 20 years old I would change all four output tubes. That said, the SED/Svetlana Winged C EL34s are my favorite EL34s, but I would think they are rare if these are the ones from 20 years ago.
 
Palustris said:
I suspect from the release date of the amp that it is over 20 years old. It may require some servicing if so. It is possible the coupling caps to the output tubes are leaking direct current that would change the bias on the tubes to make them conduct too much current. I would check that out. Again, if the amp is 20 years old I would change all four output tubes. That said, the SED/Svetlana Winged C EL34s are my favorite EL34s, but I would think they are rare if these are the ones from 20 years ago.
Click to expand...
the failure was not the fault of the amplifier. A tube developed a vacuum leak and blew itself and its mate and it also blew a safety resistor which took out several more resistors, but the amp has been gone thoroughly gone over and my tech says it should be good for another ten years, which means it will outlive me.
 
eiraved said:
I hope you will repair the issue before trying something new. You don’t need any more blown tubes.
Click to expand...
I have a very good repair tech. He has thoroughly tested and repaired the Arpége and assures me it was a tube with a vacuum leak that caused the eventful event and not the Arpége.
 
eiraved said:
Some good reading…
gadget73

Post in thread 'Why tube rolling advice doesn't work'

yeah some things aren't awful sensitive to it. Gear with a fair level of global feedback tends to not care so much, and thats basically everything I own. Tube rolling for me is all fairly minor changes unless I happen to be replacing a bad tube.
  • Like
Click to expand...
I’ve had tube amps for about 25 years, maybe more, and have rightly or wrongly stayed with JJ tubes on the Arpége. I have KT88s in my Luxman MQ88uC and I plan to stay with the factory installed tubes for the Luxman. This will be my first venture into a different tube for the Arpége. I especially like the way the user reports read on the Mullards and the Winged Cs. Both sound like good choices for the music I like to listen to, mostly opera, classical, jazz. Why not try something new? I can always return to JJs.
 
Last edited:
I listen to classical music and opera and I really liked the Winged C's of all the 6550 tubes. JJ's are on the bottom of my list.
 
eiraved said:
Some good reading…
gadget73

Post in thread 'Why tube rolling advice doesn't work'

yeah some things aren't awful sensitive to it. Gear with a fair level of global feedback tends to not care so much, and thats basically everything I own. Tube rolling for me is all fairly minor changes unless I happen to be replacing a bad tube.
  • Like
Click to expand...

I can say with my Primaluna I can hear the difference when rolling tube's. So I now I have 4 octets, of also ran tubes.

The top choice for me is the St. Petersburg factory SED Winged "C" EL34. I like them so much I tracked down a spare matched octet.

The other tubes in the box (fav to least)
British made Gold Lion KT88
Shuguang factory EL34 (stock tube)
Tung-Sol KT150
EH6550
 
If the NOS market were more sane I would go with the Svetlana but new production I like the Tung-Sol EL34B. I am generally a Tung-Sol fan especially the EL84 but the EL34 is excellent value for me as well. I just get every test that Tube Depot offers and use the matching tubes, twin for me.
 
I haven't tried the Tung-Sol EL34's. I like there 5881's and 6SN7's though. I I had some old stock and new stock Tung-Sol 5881's that I gave to my son for one of his guitar amps. I couldn't hear a difference between the old stock or new manufature Rung-Sol 5881's when I used them.
I did try a few EL34's, and some KT-77's in my VTA ST-70. In the end I really liked the EH 6CA7 fat bottles. I used the KT-77's for quite awhile and liked them before switching to the 6CA7's.
I'm still using a couple of the KT-77's in a single ended amp I built.
 
Ken Boyd said:
I listen to classical music and opera and I really liked the Winged C's of all the 6550 tubes. JJ's are on the bottom of my list.
Click to expand...
Thank you Ken! That’s exactly the way I’m leaning but since I’m not in a position to try either the Mullards or the Winged Cs your comment is just what I was hoping for, that is someone who has really heard one or the other and liked them. And your comment comes with a very apt bonus in that you listen to my kind of music!
Did you by any chance listen to the Mullards?
 
Last edited:
DeadTrader said:
The top choice for me is the St. Petersburg factory SED Winged "C" EL34. I like them so much I tracked down a spare matched octet.
Click to expand...
And another vote for the Winged C tubes! I’m so glad I decided to visit this forum to ask about them. Your enthusiasm gives me a real boost of confidence to choose the Winged Cs. And the ones I’m offered are from the factory before it burned. As soon as I listen to them and give them time to settle — and assuming I really like them — I think I’ll be a copy cat, and buy a second set and put it in my stash. I’ve just listened to a short interview with Ralph Karstan of Atma-Sphere who has 50 years of experience in tube amps warn of an upcoming shortage of tubes as the major users of vacuum tubes (musical instrument amps) migrate away from tubes to Class D.
. His interview start at almost 7 minutes in, if you’re interested.
 
Echolane said:
My Audiomat Arpége blew two of four JJ EL34s. I thought I’d like to try something new.
I’m choosing between current-production Mullard reissue EL34s and genuine SED/Svetlana Winged C EL34s for an Audiomat Arpège. My listening is mostly opera and classical music, and my biggest concern is soprano reproduction. I’m very sensitive to hardness or glare in the upper register.


Has anyone actually compared these two tubes in a high-quality hi-fi amplifier, particularly with female classical voice? I’d especially like to hear from anyone who listens to opera. Do the Winged Cs give a more natural, dimensional soprano voice than the Mullards without losing air and detail?

Or have you listened to the Winged Cs? If so, I’d really like your opinion as to how they sound
Click to expand...
I would go with a well matched quad of new tubes. Pick your brand but be careful of the vendor. Eurotubes.com does an excellent matching and sells tubes with warranty.
 
mcgjohn said:
my vote would be for the Mullard reissue EL34s, or maybe the EH 6CA7s.
If you are sensitive to harshness stick with the Mullards.
Click to expand...
I am very sensitive to harshness. There is nothing worse than an opera soprano sounding harsh. Are you saying that Svetlana Winged Cs play harsh?
 
I recently watched a video, Elpaso TubeAmps guy who stated a few years ago that Telefunken was buying tubes from JJ. Most likely have to meet Telefunken standards.

On cathode biased circuits you can do much the same as tube rolling by changing the value of the cathode resistor slightly. At least that is what I have been told.
 
From my limited selection of EL34 tubes, and comparing them to old Mullards, honestly I found the JJ to sound and bias most like old production Mullard tubes. EH 6CA7 have a little more top end extension and need more negative grid voltage, the Shugang are softer and need less. I recently discovered I have a set of Shugang 6CA7 that I forgot about, haven't listened to them much but they bias like the Shugang EL34, meaning a fair bit less negative grid voltage. Its different enough that not all amps will have sufficient adjustment range, its really pretty wildly off-spec IMO.

Telefunken tubes are made by JJ in Slovenia. I don't know what the arrangement is there, if JJ owns the Telefunken name for tube production, or if they are produced under contract for Telefunken.

Gold Lion, Tung-Sol, and Mullard, are owned by New Sensor and produced in their factory in Russia along with Sovtek and Electro-Harmonix tubes. Formerly they made the Reflektor tubes during the Soviet era. .
 
I really like the sound of the JJ EL34L tubes. I have them in a SE and PP amplifier. I have had problems with Gold Lion 300B's. One side of the filaments in one of the tubes in a SE amplifier I built burnt 1/2 out. Still plays but obvious to the eye. I know of one guy in video said he had the same problem with Gold Lion 300B's. I will not buy Gold Lions again.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom