HK 730 vs Sansui 8080 (non db)

[MadcapLaughs]

Hey team, I’m moving!

unfortunately I’m going to be scaling down my current tube system running on my Tannoys, I’m moving out of Missouri to the east coast in a few months and will be living in a smaller living space. I’m absolutely committed to keeping my tannoy 12 golds speakers….but I now need a solid state receiver with a headphone output and a good phono stage. I have a line on a clean HK 730 twin powered receiver and a clean Sansui 8080. Which would you choose over the other for sound quality with the Tannoys? Also is the HK preamp really that bad sounding? I don’t want to bother with updating the phono EQ curve and all that crap, I just want a plug and play unit that sounds good as is. Turntable and tape decks are primary sources used.

again both units have had some basic cleaning, a few capacitors here and there replaced, DC offset and bias adjusted.

 

[Hoytis]

Tough call. Those sweet speakers are easy to power, so the difference in watts between those amps is somewhat moot - neither would have to work very hard. I haven't heard any negatives about the HK preamp (besides just regular vintage clean up). I have both HK 330c and Sansui AU-999 in my house and love both dearly. Looking specifically at phono, I'd have to say the HK is warmer and more laid back, which I prefer. I've heard great things about the 730. Plus, aesthetically, it a looker!

 

[MadcapLaughs]

That’s some solid feedback thanks. And yes I don’t worry about the headroom, my pilot 232 tube amp can drive them to deafening levels as is. I’m really curious about the sound profiles of both amps. I can’t deal with ear fatigue very well, although the Tannoys seem smooth no matter the amp. Would you say the laid back phono stage in the hk still had some punch to it, or was it lacking gain and soft overall?

 

[playittwice]

If the H/K is cap-coupled, it will sound closer to your Pilot amp, if that's the sound you're after or prefer. (Closer meaning warmer.)

 

[Hoytis]

That’s some solid feedback thanks. And yes I don’t worry about the headroom, my pilot 232 tube amp can drive them to deafening levels as is. I’m really curious about the sound profiles of both amps. I can’t deal with ear fatigue very well, although the Tannoys seem smooth no matter the amp. Would you say the laid back phono stage in the hk still had some punch to it, or was it lacking gain and soft overall?

I feel it still has punch, but note I have it set up in a small office, so I'm quite close to the system. I wouldn't call it soft or muddy or anything like that at all. Articulate and full with warm edges. As for your option, the 730 was a game changer bringing (I think the first) dual power design to market...dynamic sound, doubling load capacity, excellent channel separation. And I've read HK was always very conservative in their power ratings...which I find that true with my 330c...only 20 watts and I probably never get past 25% of volume. I can only imagine with the 730.

 

[Oerets]

I have had both of the units.
Liked them both very much.

If both were in the same condition and the price were acceptable. I would go with the Sansui even though it could be more up front.

Hard to beat the 8080 in working condition. The 730 is no slouch either.

 

[Skywatcher]

Hey team, I’m moving!

unfortunately I’m going to be scaling down my current tube system running on my Tannoys, I’m moving out of Missouri to the east coast in a few months and will be living in a smaller living space. I’m absolutely committed to keeping my tannoy 12 golds speakers….but I now need a solid state receiver with a headphone output and a good phono stage. I have a line on a clean HK 730 twin powered receiver and a clean Sansui 8080. Which would you choose over the other for sound quality with the Tannoys? Also is the HK preamp really that bad sounding? I don’t want to bother with updating the phono EQ curve and all that crap, I just want a plug and play unit that sounds good as is. Turntable and tape decks are primary sources used.

again both units have had some basic cleaning, a few capacitors here and there replaced, DC offset and bias adjusted.

Whereabouts on the "East Coast"? South? Mid-Atlantic? North?

 

[MadcapLaughs]

Whereabouts on the "East Coast"? South? Mid-Atlantic? North?

I’m moving to Washington DC in September, got my place all set up, just need to load the moving van!

also it looks like leaning towards the HK. It is definitely a better deal. Both are cosmetically clean, but the 8080 does have that vinyl veneer peeling off in places.

Cost is no object I just want to pick the one between the two that has a non fatiguing sound profile and the better built-in phono stage. Both are pretty important. The twin power thing has me curious. But that Sansui has to have some serious balls too. torn between the two at the moment.

 

[wmgwizard]

HK 730 looks good, sounds great, easily serviced.

The 730 uses a modular design where various boards "plug in" to the main chassis, solder points on both sides of the connection should be re flowed and the pins cleaned.

I have restored 4 730's so far and they were all fairly easy and relatively inexpensive ($40) for quality caps and a few troublesome transistors. Well worth the time, effort and expense.

 

[MadcapLaughs]

Well the Sansui 8080 has passed me by on account of the seller plugging it in and getting cold feet after hearing it again and removing the listing. How annoying. But anyhow the wood case vinyl veneer was peeling off on many parts of the cabinet. I mean, I have to justify this somehow right? Well it’s on to the HK 730. I will be going to test it out from seller tomorrow. Looking forward to my first impressions. Hopefully it will have synergy with the Tannoy 12s.

 

[Hoytis]

Well the Sansui 8080 has passed me by on account of the seller plugging it in and getting cold feet after hearing it again and removing the listing. How annoying. But anyhow the wood case vinyl veneer was peeling off on many parts of the cabinet. I mean, I have to justify this somehow right? Well it’s on to the HK 730. I will be going to test it out from seller tomorrow. Looking forward to my first impressions. Hopefully it will have synergy with the Tannoy 12s.

Let us know how it goes.

 

[MIJ_Pioneer]

I've experienced / restored a 730 and a 7070 and 9090db - never an 8080 though.

I'd go 8080 as there is more to love other than just the sound. The 8080 is twice the power and has a massive transformer. Higher quality in pretty much every aspect. Being able to adjust the mids are nice as well. I am a bit biased towards Sansui and Pioneer however.

The 730 seems to have been a "great bang for the buck" at its time, offering an excellent power plant but sacrificing a bit of quality in other areas. I was very impressed once it was restored and it definitely earned a spot in gear rotation. It has dual transformers and excellent separation. The preamp lacks a bit, offering a very nice sound but its a bit of a one trick pony. The 730 once restored sounds fantastic - some may say better than a 8080, much of this is thanks to the power plant in my opinion. Phono stage after restoration was great, no complaints there - note there are some recommended forward engineering that needs to be done. The selector switches need to be cleaned and are a PITA to clean. Also there are known troublemaker transistors in the 730, probably same goes for 8080.

If you go with the 730 some of this information may be helpful: https://audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/harman-kardon-730-restore.961375/

Well the Sansui 8080 has passed me by on account of the seller plugging it in and getting cold feet after hearing it again and removing the listing. How annoying.

After typing up my abvoe reply I noticed that it is no longer on the table :/ This happens more than you think, I've heard very often during testing before purchasing that the seller has doubts letting it go. Almost lost a few sales.

 

[The Fuxtor]

The hk730 has a bad phono stage. Needs a mod to fix

 

[MadcapLaughs]

The hk730 has a bad phono stage. Needs a mod to fix

see this has me very concerned, I just can’t live with a bad sounding phono section. I’ve read through so many threads at this point and half the time people are lauding the stock 730 phono stage as one of the better ones in vintage receivers. The other half says it has a terrible EQ curve and has to be modded to enjoy. Of course this is a forum so consensus is a rare thing. I just hate the idea that as soon as I pick this up it’s going straight to the shop for phono updates.

 

[The Fuxtor]

see this has me very concerned, I just can’t live with a bad sounding phono section. I’ve read through so many threads at this point and half the time people are lauding the stock 730 phono stage as one of the better ones in vintage receivers. The other half says it has a terrible EQ curve and has to be modded to enjoy. Of course this is a forum so consensus is a rare thing. I just hate the idea that as soon as I pick this up it’s going straight to the shop for phono updates.

The receiver sounds fantastic. If you don't care for the phono pre, you can always pick up a seperate phono preamp .

 

[MadcapLaughs]

The receiver sounds fantastic. If you don't care for the phono pre, you can always pick up a seperate phono preamp .

Ya fair enough. But I’m one of those strange people though that insists on using the built in phono and preamp stages on vintage integrated/receivers. That’s part of the fun of it to me. If it’s not all up to snuff I take a hard pass. Weird audiophile behavior.

 

[MIJ_Pioneer]

Im not a designer but visually looking at the phone stage's footprint and amount of components it looks to be very era specific (most phono stages look like this) - I'd imagine to beat this type of design you would need some good coin for vintage + exceptional phono stage. I listened to vinyl on mine and it was very nice. From the gear I have seen you do not seem to get a more elaborate phono stage until you reach very high end integrated amps.

Don't read too much into it to the point you're going down a rabit hole - it's just a recap, modern low noise transistors, and changing out two film caps for change the bass roll off a bit. The components that go in are very nice and you will be very happy with it. I have nice photos and a component list if you wish to do it yourself:

https://audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/harman-kardon-730-restore.961375/#post-14824049

I used Silmic IIs for electrolytic as a personal preference. Nichicon UKL would go great in those positions as well.

Also, in case no one mentioned it - this receiver is going to need work to get up to spec if its never been serviced. Would not reccomend this unit for a "I dont recap anything it changes the sound, old caps are just as good as new ones why change them" crowd.

 

[Hoytis]

see this has me very concerned, I just can’t live with a bad sounding phono section. I’ve read through so many threads at this point and half the time people are lauding the stock 730 phono stage as one of the better ones in vintage receivers. The other half says it has a terrible EQ curve and has to be modded to enjoy. Of course this is a forum so consensus is a rare thing. I just hate the idea that as soon as I pick this up it’s going straight to the shop for phono updates.

That's the difficult part about hifi reviews...you're never going to get a consensus...sometimes you just have to take a leap of faith (or not) because everyone hears something different. Everyone has different standards as to what sounds "amazing" to them. Everyone has different speakers, sources and listening rooms...all of which colors the music. There's no easy way when buying vintage.

 

[MadcapLaughs]

Woah, WOAH.

this receiver is sooooo nice. So glad I grabbed it. Smooth as hell, my sensitive ears can take the volume without running out of the room. The phono stage sounds really nice, I’m thoroughly impressed so far. Great match up with the Tannoys. I already don’t miss my fisher 400c / pilot 232 combo. I’ll experiment with hooking both of those components up as separates through the HK at some point. Right now I’m digging the whole unit as is.

the seller also had his marantz 2235b which we did a shootout between it and the HK when I came over. It was powering 4ohm KEF 104/2 speakers. The HK blew the Marantz out of the water powering them. I have a deal to come get the KEFs later this week (decent deal). Very nice speakers those KEFs. And I was trying to downsize for my upcoming move…..

 

[Skywatcher]

see this has me very concerned, I just can’t live with a bad sounding phono section. I’ve read through so many threads at this point and half the time people are lauding the stock 730 phono stage as one of the better ones in vintage receivers. The other half says it has a terrible EQ curve and has to be modded to enjoy. Of course this is a forum so consensus is a rare thing. I just hate the idea that as soon as I pick this up it’s going straight to the shop for phono updates.

The phono stage is an easy fix. Basically a couple of cap values changed to put the RIAA curve where it should be for low end.