How do I calculate how heavy of a headshell to buy.

[sruddy]

Hi All,
I just purchased a Pioneer PL-70LII turntable. It comes with a S shaped arm and I ordered the missing straight arm for it too. A headshell was not included so I would like to purchase one that would work with a Denon DL103R cartridge, but I don't know how to calculate how heavy of a headshell would need for it. Is there a formula to figure this out?
Thx

 

[KentTeffeteller]

Hi All,
I just purchased a Pioneer PL-70LII turntable. It comes with a S shaped arm and I ordered the missing straight arm for it too. A headshell was not included so I would like to purchase one that would work with a Denon DL103R cartridge, but I don't know how to calculate how heavy of a headshell would need for it. Is there a formula to figure this out?
Thx

You would be better off getting a Denon DL-301 LOMC cartridge for the Pioneer, or considering an Audio-Technica or Ortofon MC for it. Those will perform better on said arm. Hana and Dynavector also have possible LOMC candidates.

 

[mr_petit]

https://alignmentprotractor.com/tonearm-resonance-calculator Is there a formula to figure this out?
Thx

But for that you would also need to know the eff. mass of the arm (minus the original headshell)

That said, with a DL103, don't get a headshell that is too light (considerably lower than 10gr)
For sure I would get a headshell with azimuth adjustment screw.
I would choose a Jelco HS-20 or Jelco HS-25 which are 11,5 gr (whichever style you like) (they are also sold under the TONAR/Analogis/Top-Q branding).
These have the added advantage that they also have a connector alignment pin on the underside of the sme connector so that it sits more securely aligned in the tonearm when you take the headshell on/off, limiting the risk to have to re-align the azimuth when you've taken off the headshell (you know, when putting on an sme headshell there's always that little bit of sideways play when you tighten the connector....)
For that the tonearm needs to have an sme connector that also has a slot on the bottom of the connector but the Pioneer arm has that when I look at pictures.
Be sure to get a headshell that has the azimuth adjustment screw on the side (like the Jelco has) or on the top (like an ortofon LH-4000 has) and not one that has the adjustment screw pointing down (like an ortofon LH-9000 has) as that is very uncomfortable to use.

If you want to know more about the headshell weight needed, just mount the cartridge (I assume you already have it) with any headshell you have laying around and measure the resonance frequency with an audio software editor.

 

[KentTeffeteller]

But for that you would also need to know the eff. mass of the arm (minus the original headshell)

That said, with a DL103, don't get a headshell that is too light (considerably lower than 10gr)
For sure I would get a headshell with azimuth adjustment screw.
I would choose a Jelco HS-20 or Jelco HS-25 which are 11,5 gr (whichever style you like) (they are also sold under the TONAR/Analogis/Top-Q branding).
These have the added advantage that they also have a connector alignment pin on the underside of the sme connector so that it sits more securely aligned in the tonearm when you take the headshell on/off, limiting the risk to have to re-align the azimuth when you've taken off the headshell (you know, when putting on an sme headshell there's always that little bit of sideways play when you tighten the connector....)
For that the tonearm needs to have an sme connector that also has a slot on the bottom of the connector but the Pioneer arm has that when I look at pictures.
Be sure to get a headshell that has the azimuth adjustment screw on the side (like the Jelco has) or on the top (like an ortofon LH-4000 has) and not one that has the adjustment screw pointing down (like an ortofon LH-9000 has) as that is very uncomfortable to use.

If you want to know more about the headshell weight needed, just mount the cartridge (I assume you already have it) with any headshell you have laying around and measure the resonance frequency with an audio software editor.

The Pioneer is low side of medium mass. Denon DL-103 is high mass. Best used on high mass transcription arms like Gray, Fidelity Research, Audio-Technica ATP series, etc. DL-103 not a good candidate for that Pioneer arm, and heavier than 11 gram headshells not balance able on that arm. Reality.

 

[lini]

I just purchased a Pioneer PL-70LII turntable. (...)

Did/will it come with a user manual? Reason for the question: According to the technical specs over on Audio-Database(.com), the balance range for the S-shaped arm tube would be 6 to 32 g (for cartridge and headshell together) - which would appear to be a very wide range, though, so I wonder, whether that's correct.

Greetings from Munich!

Manfred / lini

 

[sruddy]

The Pioneer is low side of medium mass. Denon DL-103 is high mass. Best used on high mass transcription arms like Gray, Fidelity Research, Audio-Technica ATP series, etc. DL-103 not a good candidate for that Pioneer arm, and heavier than 11 gram headshells not balance able on that arm. Reality.

Thank you, I purchased the 103r for my Empire 298 turntable. It has a high mass arm and it’s headshell weighs 22g. I was hoping I could use it on the new to me PL70LII since it’s the only MC I own. I guess I’ll just have to wait. In the meantime I’ll use the Shure M97xE with a Jico SAS/S. It’s now on the PL-630 that I’m replacing.

 

[sruddy]

But for that you would also need to know the eff. mass of the arm (minus the original headshell)

That said, with a DL103, don't get a headshell that is too light (considerably lower than 10gr)
For sure I would get a headshell with azimuth adjustment screw.
I would choose a Jelco HS-20 or Jelco HS-25 which are 11,5 gr (whichever style you like) (they are also sold under the TONAR/Analogis/Top-Q branding).
These have the added advantage that they also have a connector alignment pin on the underside of the sme connector so that it sits more securely aligned in the tonearm when you take the headshell on/off, limiting the risk to have to re-align the azimuth when you've taken off the headshell (you know, when putting on an sme headshell there's always that little bit of sideways play when you tighten the connector....)
For that the tonearm needs to have an sme connector that also has a slot on the bottom of the connector but the Pioneer arm has that when I look at pictures.
Be sure to get a headshell that has the azimuth adjustment screw on the side (like the Jelco has) or on the top (like an ortofon LH-4000 has) and not one that has the adjustment screw pointing down (like an ortofon LH-9000 has) as that is very uncomfortable to use.

If you want to know more about the headshell weight needed, just mount the cartridge (I assume you already have it) with any headshell you have laying around and measure the resonance frequency with an audio software editor.

Thx for the info, it’s much appreciated.

 

[sruddy]

Did/will it come with a user manual? Reason for the question: According to the technical specs over on Audio-Database(.com), the balance range for the S-shaped arm tube would be 6 to 32 g (for cartridge and headshell together) - which would appear to be a very wide range, though, so I wonder, whether that's correct.

Greetings from Munich!

Manfred / lini

Yes, here is a snip. The manual is available in english at Vinyl Engine.

 

[tabarddn51]

Hi, The arm is definitely to light for the 103 & just a heavy head-shell will not be enough.
additional options would be
- additional brass spacer say 10 grams
or
- put a body cap on the 103, this will also improve it's sound.
or
- change you 103R to a 103D or 103S, these two have a higher compliance as well as Elliptical stylus, so you could just get away with the heavy head-shell.

Cheers

 

[mr_petit]

He already has the DL103 (with an ogura retip if I looked at his post history correctly) and already has the turntable.
Why not buy a cheap $10 SME style headshell from aliexpress or amazon (if you don't have any sme type headshells lying around), do the resonance frequency measurement with audacity (or any other (free) software, you just have to record about 30sec of music and do the spectral view to see the resonance peak) and go from there? (when messing about with turntables and cartridges it's always good to have a spare headshell lying around no matter what the quality)
Pioneer doesn't produce data about the effective mass of that tonearm, nor does Denon produce official data on the 10Hz compliance of the DL103 cartridge nor don't we know if the compliance of your cartridge has changed over time... so everything said here is 100% based on speculations.

With buying a cheap headshell and doing the measurement you overcome all these speculations 100% and from there you can look for a better headshell that tends more to your technical and practical needs.

From what I understood for the straight tonearm you ordered, you also need a lighter counterbalance weight. Was that included in the sale or have you ordered that too?
That straight tonearm will be very light compared to the S arm (hence the smaller counterweight needed) and probably not suitable for your denon cartridge but it's always nice to have when you're gonna use a high compliance cartridge.

 

[sruddy]

He already has the DL103 (with an ogura retip if I looked at his post history correctly) and already has the turntable.
Why not buy a cheap $10 SME style headshell from aliexpress or amazon (if you don't have any sme type headshells lying around), do the resonance frequency measurement with audacity (or any other (free) software, you just have to record about 30sec of music and do the spectral view to see the resonance peak) and go from there? (when messing about with turntables and cartridges it's always good to have a spare headshell lying around no matter what the quality)
Pioneer doesn't produce data about the effective mass of that tonearm, nor does Denon produce official data on the 10Hz compliance of the DL103 cartridge nor don't we know if the compliance of your cartridge has changed over time... so everything said here is 100% based on speculations.

With buying a cheap headshell and doing the measurement you overcome all these speculations 100% and from there you can look for a better headshell that tends more to your technical and practical needs.

From what I understood for the straight tonearm you ordered, you also need a lighter counterbalance weight. Was that included in the sale or have you ordered that too?
That straight tonearm will be very light compared to the S arm (hence the smaller counterweight needed) and probably not suitable for your denon cartridge but it's always nice to have when you're gonna use a high compliance cartridge.

I have several cheap headshells, and a Pioneer magnesium headshell from a Pl-630. I Also purchased a vintage Pioneer headshell that I think was supplied with the PL70LII TT. I’ll take your advice and see if any work. I have a record I use for setting up my TTs. See image. It’s very old probably before apps. Ha ha I assume an app maybe easier than listening for when the distortion starts and watching the stylus wiggle.

 

[mr_petit]

You can use the lateral resonance track on that test record (track 2 side 2) just as well, you'll see the arm wiggle.
It works just as well. The method used with recording music and analyzing that with a wave editor is foremost handy for people who don't have a test record with lateral resonance track.

That resonance frequency isn't that important, it's a very broad band that is allowed (mostly claimed at 8-12Hz). Personally I think a too high resonance frequency (12Hz or above) is worse than a low resonance frequency (lower than 8Hz), as a high resonance frequency is induced by the music and a low resonance frequency is in duced by external tremors like walking around on wooden floors. I have no problem playing at 7Hz (something like 5Hz might get very low though, depending on the turntable, lots of turntables with suspended subchasses have a subchassis resonance of 3-5Hz, and if they overlap the arm-cartridge resonance you can get really strange effects)
The DL103 has a very low compliance (so a very stuff suspension) what will result in a high resonance frequency if the arm is really light. So mounting it in that straight arm would probably be a really bad idea.

Normally I'm all for the original headshell as it's styling wise the best fit and some can be quite good, but for to get the best out of the cartridge and turntable, a headshell (or tonearm) needs to have azimuth adjustment as that influences channel separation and sometimes you can get a few dB extra channel separation out of that by adjusting the azimuth. But most (included) headshells on S arms don't have that feature and the S arm itself often also doesn't have that feature. I don't know if that goes for your pioneer turntable too.

 

[StanleyEng]

 

[StanleyEng]

But for that you would also need to know the eff. mass of the arm (minus the original headshell)

That said, with a DL103, don't get a headshell that is too light (considerably lower than 10gr)
For sure I would get a headshell with azimuth adjustment screw.
I would choose a Jelco HS-20 or Jelco HS-25 which are 11,5 gr (whichever style you like) (they are also sold under the TONAR/Analogis/Top-Q branding).
These have the added advantage that they also have a connector alignment pin on the underside of the sme connector so that it sits more securely aligned in the tonearm when you take the headshell on/off, limiting the risk to have to re-align the azimuth when you've taken off the headshell (you know, when putting on an sme headshell there's always that little bit of sideways play when you tighten the connector....)
For that the tonearm needs to have an sme connector that also has a slot on the bottom of the connector but the Pioneer arm has that when I look at pictures.
Be sure to get a headshell that has the azimuth adjustment screw on the side (like the Jelco has) or on the top (like an ortofon LH-4000 has) and not one that has the adjustment screw pointing down (like an ortofon LH-9000 has) as that is very uncomfortable to use.

If you want to know more about the headshell weight needed, just mount the cartridge (I assume you already have it) with any headshell you have laying around and measure the resonance frequency with an audio software editor.

Correct!

 

[krautmaster]

I have several cheap headshells, and a Pioneer magnesium headshell from a Pl-630. I Also purchased a vintage Pioneer headshell that I think was supplied with the PL70LII TT. I’ll take your advice and see if any work. I have a record I use for setting up my TTs. See image. It’s very old probably before apps. Ha ha I assume an app maybe easier than listening for when the distortion starts and watching the stylus wiggle.

View attachment 3631791

View attachment 3631792

I use that test record to set up all my tables, it works just fine.

 

[jbjsr]

Here is a Jelco style headshell from TT Lab.
Nice quality for the cost with top & bottom locking pins / 12.5g. No affiliation.

Turntable Lab: Hi-Fi Headshell (Jelco Style)

Buy Turntable Lab: Hi-Fi Headshell (Jelco Style) at TurntableLab.com, a Better Music Store Experience since 1999.

www.turntablelab.com

 

[sruddy]

You can use the lateral resonance track on that test record (track 2 side 2) just as well, you'll see the arm wiggle.
It works just as well. The method used with recording music and analyzing that with a wave editor is foremost handy for people who don't have a test record with lateral resonance track.

That resonance frequency isn't that important, it's a very broad band that is allowed (mostly claimed at 8-12Hz). Personally I think a too high resonance frequency (12Hz or above) is worse than a low resonance frequency (lower than 8Hz), as a high resonance frequency is induced by the music and a low resonance frequency is in duced by external tremors like walking around on wooden floors. I have no problem playing at 7Hz (something like 5Hz might get very low though, depending on the turntable, lots of turntables with suspended subchasses have a subchassis resonance of 3-5Hz, and if they overlap the arm-cartridge resonance you can get really strange effects)
The DL103 has a very low compliance (so a very stuff suspension) what will result in a high resonance frequency if the arm is really light. So mounting it in that straight arm would probably be a really bad idea.

Normally I'm all for the original headshell as it's styling wise the best fit and some can be quite good, but for to get the best out of the cartridge and turntable, a headshell (or tonearm) needs to have azimuth adjustment as that influences channel separation and sometimes you can get a few dB extra channel separation out of that by adjusting the azimuth. But most (included) headshells on S arms don't have that feature and the S arm itself often also doesn't have that feature. I don't know if that goes for your pioneer turntable too.

Thank you for all the valuable info. Please tell me a little more about when I would choose to use a S arm or straight arm. The TT came with a carbon fiber S arm and I just purchased the carbon fiber straight arm. I believe there is another pioneer straight arm that is ceramic alumina. For the head shell I'm currently using one I stole from my Pioneer PL-650. It's magnesium. It's currently fitted with a MM Shure m97xE I haven't weighed it yet and haven't run the test to see the RF yet but will today. I just got a Pioneer aluminum one that is shown in the owners manual and it weighs 10.5 grams and I think I'll buy the lighter carbon fiber head shell too. I'll decide on an another with the azimuth adjustment once I see which weight head shell I will be using first, so I can buy the right weight.

 

[sruddy]

View attachment 3631805
View attachment 3631806
View attachment 3631807

Thank you, it's nice to see all this info laid out so well.

 

[sruddy]

You can use the lateral resonance track on that test record (track 2 side 2) just as well, you'll see the arm wiggle.
It works just as well. The method used with recording music and analyzing that with a wave editor is foremost handy for people who don't have a test record with lateral resonance track.

That resonance frequency isn't that important, it's a very broad band that is allowed (mostly claimed at 8-12Hz). Personally I think a too high resonance frequency (12Hz or above) is worse than a low resonance frequency (lower than 8Hz), as a high resonance frequency is induced by the music and a low resonance frequency is in duced by external tremors like walking around on wooden floors. I have no problem playing at 7Hz (something like 5Hz might get very low though, depending on the turntable, lots of turntables with suspended subchasses have a subchassis resonance of 3-5Hz, and if they overlap the arm-cartridge resonance you can get really strange effects)
The DL103 has a very low compliance (so a very stuff suspension) what will result in a high resonance frequency if the arm is really light. So mounting it in that straight arm would probably be a really bad idea.

The test record says 8-15Hz is ideal and the Denon DL-103r with straight arm is 14Hz. That's higher than what you have suggested. Will this be ok? I like the way it looks on the straight arm. The s-arm is heavier so If I put it on the S-Arm with the aluminum headshell the total mass will be 5 grams more which would lower the R.F. Tracking is really good on this turntable. I have never passed the track 9 bias setting anti skate test on any other turntable. This one passes it on both the Denon and Shure cartridges.

 

[mr_petit]

The test record says 8-15Hz is ideal and the Denon DL-103r with straight arm is 14Hz. That's higher than what you have suggested. Will this be ok?

I would not play it with 14Hz.
I think 12Hz is already quite high.
One of the problems is, that the higher the resonance frequency, the more energy a resonance will have with the same amplitude (the energy is a factor of the mass and speed squared, and with higher frequency, the speed is higher), so it will be more difficult to dampen by the internal damping grommet.

With 14Hz you're very close with the lowest notes in music (16Hz), so there can be plenty of energy available to excite that resonance (depending on which music)