I can dream, Huge Altec horn

[b brian]

I have just inherited a pair of Altec 601c in Barzilay cabinets and wondered if I could put a huge multi cell Altec Horn on top of the cabinet, and drive that horn with the x-over for the 601c.

The 601c has the small horn, but I am wondering if there is an Altec driver/horn combo that would work with the 601c x-over, replacing the small horn.

I have been learning about Altec since getting these, and really like the look of a multi cell horn sitting out in all its glory on top of a cabinet.
Just wondering if anyone know of a Altec driver/horn combo that would work.
I may not be able to afford a Valencia, or Theater speaker, but would like to search for something that might work.

 

[rogerfederer]

pictures!!

 

[b brian]

This is the speaker that I have, and this is a picture of Altec 811 Horns that I borrowed from ebay.
I dont know if the 811 would work, or even if they work, they are the ones I would want.
But I am hoping to find a horn that I could sit on top of these cabinets and plug into the 601c x-overs and get nice sound from.

 

[bowtie427ss]

certainly it will "work", but the 601 XO will not play a larger horn/driver combination to near it's potential.

The crossover network ideally needs to be optimized more for the horn/driver, than for the LF of the 601.

 

[b brian]

certainly it will "work", but the 601 XO will not play a larger horn/driver combination to near it's potential.

The crossover network ideally needs to be optimized more for the horn/driver, than for the LF of the 601.

So find a horn with a x-over and the LF of the 601c should work with it?

 

[mhardy6647]

Those aren't multi-cell Altec horns in your photo in post #3; they look like 811Bs to me. The 811B is an exponential (if memory serves) horn with a 1" throat and some vanes added to it. Some people "surgically remove" the vanes.

A 1505 (for example) is a multi-cell Altec horn; the difference in performance compared to a 511B or 811B is night and day - and the going prices reflect it!

But, if you want to play with 811Bs or 511Bs and compression drivers Build or buy an 800 or 1000 Hz (or so) crossover - you'll probably have to pad down the HF drivers (depending on which ones you use) to match the 601 as a woofer. Did Jeff Markwart or anyone else ever design improved VOT XOs?

 

[bowtie427ss]

Yes, the LF section of the 601 is essentially a 414 woofer. Provided the HF of the crossover can be attenuated sufficiently, the 802/811 combo would mate well with a crossover in the range of 1000-1500hz.

Those aren't multi-cell Altec horns in your photo in post #3; they look like 811Bs to me. The 811B is an exponential (if memory serves) horn with a 1" throat and some vanes added to it. A 1505 is a multi-cell horn; the difference in performance is night and day - and the going prices reflect it!

i wasn't even gonna go there.

 

[b brian]

If I recall those pictures were of a 811. And I can see the difference in price.
What do you mean by "pad down" the HF driver? Muffle in some way?
Are their DIY plans for a 800 or 1000Hz xover?

What Altec horn/driver would be the best to start chasing down? Are 511 easier to find/less expensive?

Thanks for all the input.

 

[mhardy6647]

listen to the man posting above (Mr. Bowtie)! ;-)

 

[marantzfan]

Wouldn't the Z19 crossover do what the op is trying to accomplish?

 

[bowtie427ss]

Wouldn't the Z19 crossover do what the op is trying to accomplish?

If it will attenuate the horn enough to balance with the 601's sensitivity(or lack thereof).

The 601's LF sensitivity is ~ 6db less than that of the 416 the Z19 was essentially designed for. If it's not within the Z19's range of adjustment, i'm sure that could be compensated for.

 

[audiozaz]

Any particular reason why you don't want to use the 601C's own horn as a point-source driver? I don't want to second-guess or put a damper on your horn-aspiration, just plain wondering.

Price for the 811B horns seems to be all over the place. Try to hunt down Emilar EH800 "Bowtie" horns; I hear they have a much thicker casting than 811B and don't ring like a giant cowbell. Price seems to be more steady on these as well, though it might be easier to come upon a great deal on Altec's. Small-format Altec/Emilar/Renkus drivers should be dandy on EH800's.

az

 

[bowtie427ss]

Any particular reason why you don't want to use the 601C's own horn as a point-source driver? I don't want to second-guess or put a damper on your horn-aspiration, just plain wondering.

While i won't attempt to answer on the OP's behalf, suffice to say i just assumed one or both of his 601 HF's were out of commission, and the cost of repair combined with the relatively delicate nature of the 3000 series tweets sent him searching for an "Altec flavored" alternative. I know, a lot of assumption on my part, but i try to keep it safe. :scratch2:

 

[toxcrusadr]

The way I read it, he's interested in the cool factor of those big horns. I know where he's coming from.

The crossover all depends on which horn and which driver. I picked up a pair of 511's last summer with Reinkus-Heinze drivers (rather than the original Altecs). An AKer loaned me a specialized pair of Zilchified crossovers designed for the 511s - except *with* their original drivers, which drop off like mad above 10KHz. The RH drivers go out to 20 KHz, supposedly, so all that compensation made these beautifully designed crossovers a non-starter for me. So I'm building a simple 2-way, 2d order with two inductors, two caps and an L-pad attenuator. :thmbsp:

 

[audiozaz]

While i won't attempt to answer on the OP's behalf, suffice to say i just assumed one or both of his 601 HF's were out of commission, and the cost of repair combined with the relatively delicate nature of the 3000 series tweets sent him searching for an "Altec flavored" alternative. I know, a lot of assumption on my part, but i try to keep it safe. :scratch2:

3000-series, mmm, isn't that the microphone diaphragm also used on at least one flavour (most desirable?) of Bolero?

az

 

[audiozaz]

The way I read it, he's interested in the cool factor of those big horns. I know where he's coming from.

The crossover all depends on which horn and which driver. I picked up a pair of 511's last summer with Reinkus-Heinze drivers (rather than the original Altecs). An AKer loaned me a specialized pair of Zilchified crossovers designed for the 511s - except *with* their original drivers, which drop off like mad above 10KHz. The RH drivers go out to 20 KHz, supposedly, so all that compensation made these beautifully designed crossovers a non-starter for me. So I'm building a simple 2-way, 2d order with two inductors, two caps and an L-pad attenuator. :thmbsp:

Sure can't blame him!

Which RH driver do you have, I'm guessing SSD-1800 or 1801? I really like my Emilar EC-175 with Radian diaphragms.

az

 

[b brian]

The reason for the post is to see what was possible, what I could dream.
My current 601c work fine. The are part of a Barzilay console, and because of space and decorative hold ups, the console and the speakers are in the garage.
I am looking for the cool factor with the horns sitting on top, like a big Cadillac headed toward you. (Another dream would be some old Western Electric curved horn of some sort.)
I would love to be able to get some Altec Valencia's or A7 Voice of Theater, but cost and size limit that dream.
I was hoping to find a way to use what I have, the 601c LF and cross over, and get a great big horn to sit on top of the Barzilay speaker. I want to be able to listen to the horn and not have it be eye candy, but want to make sure that it will "Work"
I have a pair of Knight Mono Blocks that will drive them, and when the room gets re-organized I hope that I can create a Altec Horn Frankenstein to replace my Klipsch Forte.
Looking around it looks like the 511 is going to be the most cost available, so wondering what driver, and would it work with the 601c crossover.

 

[audiozaz]

Good news on the 601C's working fine. You can enjoy these while looking around for a good deal on your dream horn. Being in a hurry can be costly.

az

 

[marantzfan]

Well, knowing that the 601's are working correctly, I would give them a listen before "upgrading". A lot of the magic in duplex speakers is their point source nature which you would be getting away from by adding another horn.... :scratch2:

 

[toxcrusadr]

If a guy was really nuts though, he might be able to put some switches in and use whichever pair of horns he was in the mood for...the coax ones for critical listening with soundstage, or the big horns for...whenever.