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Info on vintage yamaha, Pioneer, Rotel, marantz Onkyo, receivers?

As the owner of an Onkyo TX-8500 (BIN of $99 back in December) I would say that it is very well built for the power rating. Dual trannies at 110wpc? I mean what more could you ask for. I think the Onkyo receivers tend to be a tad overlooked, but some brands just are, it doesn't make them any worse than the competition in some cases, just overlooked. I wouldn't hesitate to buy another TX-8500 if the opportunity was to present itself.
 
This thread has got me thinking, when is the last time anyone actually saw an Onkyo TX-8500 mkII up for sale or auction? I have been checking "that auction site" regularly for months just out of curiousity and I don't think one has been put up there in at least 3 or 4 months. Are they that rare an item? I'm not in the market for one, I was initially just curious about value, but after looking for so long and never seeing one it made me start wondering if they were perhaps more rare than I had thought. For whatever it may be worth, I absolutely love mine!
 
I have an onkyo tx-8500 that I thought ran my braun L-810's extremely well until I recently bought an 8500mkII. The 8500MKII really matches up well with the brauns. The only problem with the 8500MKII is that it is missing a knob for one of the fm presets. If anyone has one that they would sell please let me know.
 
Nikko separates

gyusher

Although I can't speak for the complete line of Nikko, I can say that during my tenure there, we have made some awesome products. The quality of the front panel metal extrusions and the metal enclosures were much beefier than the standard receivers of that era. The Alpha III MOSFET DC amp was only 80wpc but if you had efficient speakers, it was the cleanest amp you have ever heard. If you wanted more power, we had the Alpha VI, which was rated at 300wpc (for a measly $1400.!) that was great for driving speakers like the AR LST or the Bose 901's. Both amps had high slew rate and excellent square wave response while maintaining extremely low THD and TIM distortion. The Beta III had a direct coupled phono preamp coupled with its high speed circuitry. The Gamma V FM tuner had selectable IF bandwidth with amazing tuning accuracy. We also created the ATD1, which was Nikko's version of the Audio Pulse's and Advent's time delay processor. I also presented a white paper at the AES convention titled "Application of gyrators in graphic equalizers" for the development of the inductorless graphic equalizer called the EQ1. A little history behind the company:

Nikko started off as a circuit breaker manufacturer and their main customer was JNR (Japan National Railroad). The company chairman's daughter married a true audiophile and the chairman started the audio division to fulfill his son-in-law's interest. The son-in-law cared very little about marketability of the product and basically, it was his pet project to crank out audiophile type products. I certainly am not knocking the son-in-law because he truly had golden ears and he designed products like the Alpha V, which was a true class A 100 wpc power amp that sounded awesome but it was not marketable due to the insane price tag of the product. Because the revenue from the audio division was so small compared to the circuit breaker division, we were eventually phased out to consolidate Nikko's efforts in their main business. By the time we developed the 19 series (NR-1019, NR-1219, etc.), we could not compete against the giants like Marantz, Sony, and Pioneer who had an immense price/unit advantage over us. The strange thing about Japanese manufacturers in that era was that they were stolidly against outsourcing the manufacturing outside Japan. Perhaps, if we subcontracted the production to Taiwan like NAD did, we would have had a fighting chance for survival.

With warmest regards,

Tom Ishimoto
Northridge Electronics


Hi Tom, I was searching for info on Nikko amps and stumbled on your posts. I am offered Nikko TRM-800 and Nikko Alpha ii by two different guys, so I can't test them side by side. I'd like to hear your opinion if my main music types are jazz, vocal, classical, and mainstream pop (mainly 80's). Thanks in advance.
 
Although I was not involved in the development of either one of the amplifiers, they were both well constructed. If I had to pick one of the 2, I would pick the Alpha II due to its dual power supply and robust metal contrusction of the chassis and front panel.
 
Regarding Onkyo Receivers

Hi guys,

Maybe I can answer some of the questions regarding Onkyo. I started working for Onkyo in 1975 right out of college with a degree in electrical engineering. Originally when I started there, their product line up was the TX220, TX330, TX440, TX560, TX670, and TS500 and a bunch of speakers that were AR wanna be's. To be blunt, the TX220, TX330, and the TX440 used power modules with limited slew rate and frequency response and were dull and sounded pretty awful. I don't know if you know the history of Onkyo but in Japan, they were known as Osaka Onkyo and started as a speaker manufacturer. They originally came to USA as a joint venture between themselves and Mitsubishi and failed miserably at selling Onkyo speakers. Mitsubishi and Onkyo parted ways after about 6 months after I was hired and Onkyo started concentrating on achieving better sounding receivers and tuners. The first attempt was the Onkyo T-4055 tuner which had an awesome review in Absolute Sound. After the review came out I remember that we never could keep the tuners in stock. When we were ready to start conceiving the new receiver line, we came up with a different look than the last product line as it became known as the TX2500 and TX4500 (We didn't have enough budget to develop a complete line then). It's hard to imagine but this was Onkyo's last ditch effort to survive in the audio world and they put all their marbles into these 2 receivers. Onkyo was definitely ahead of its time because they realized the importance of a good phono preamplifier even when their older separates were made (A-7022 and A-7055). If you compare the transient response of the phono preamps in those units to their peers, it was immediately obvious. In our earlier test, we would inject a pulse followed by a since wave and check the dilation of the pulse into the sine wave and the phono preamps were outstanding! The TX2500 and TX4500 incorporated these design parameters so their phono section sounded remarkably good (This is preHolman's white paper of phono preamp TIM). We also upgraded the analog tuners. The TX2500 had the servo lock tuning and the TX4500 had the quartz lock tuning. The quartz lock tuning worked remarkably well and the tuning accuracy was only limited to the quartz time base in each unit. Keep in mind that this is predigital tuner days for receivers. Then we concentrated on the power amplifiers. The power amplifier section of the receivers rivaled Harman Kardon's receivers by achieving low tilt figures for the low frequency and high slew rate for the upper frequency response without sacrificing hum and noise like HK did. If there's any negative comment regarding their product line was that the tone control/line preamp amp lacked the same type of clarity and transient response. The success of TX2500 and TX4500 catapulted Onkyo into the audio world and then the development of the TX1500 and TX8500 began to create a full line of receivers. A few years later, the Mark II series of the original line was introduced but it was a variation on a theme of the original product line. Another interesting product line that you might be able see on ebay is their original Integra line. If you ever have a chance, check out the P303 preamp and M505 power amp. They both have unique circuitry and cosmetics that might interest the collectors. The P303 is literally a straight line preamp with a MC stage with gain. The front panel is sparse but the sonic characteristic is phenom. The M505 (105 wpc) is a bit underpowered but the transient response is awesome. As years progressed, Onkyo because less interested in the sonics and more in profits and I left the company (I think in 1978) to pursue product development in separates with Nikko to revamp the Beta, Gamma, and Alpha separates. As of now, I still have a TS-500 Quad Receiver, T-4055 tuner, TX4500 MkII, and a broken TX4500. I'm looking for a new glass front panel for the TX4500 because the shipper that sent the TX4500 packed it so poorly that it damaged the glass. I still have sentimental attachments to alot of their product because it brings back great memories of the earlier stages of my career in the audio industry. Someday when I actually can find time, I'd like to restore the TX4500 and redesign the tone control circuitry to match the rest of the receiver.

Wtih warmest regards,

Tom Ishimoto
Northridge Electronics


Am giving this a bump.
I just acquired a Nikko Beta V pre, looking for service manual, schematic, anything ( I have the old 1978 catalog page). Have reached out to SM suppliers, no one yet has one. Any info appreciated on obtaining. thanks, BH
 
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Hi, any thoughts on the Alpha 400 power amp? Any good? Thanks!
The 400 is from the later Nikko BY Asti Pacific era, not the original Nikko Mfg.
For power amps for the 'historical' Nikko, look for the Alpha 130, 220. 440, etc. when you see the red lettering on the front, this is the beginning of the Asti Period Generally.
You can find 230 and 450 with both white and red lettering. White is NIkko, Red is Nikko by A/P.
There are some cross over items with little difference from the old Nikko, but the 400, 600, 800 series amp are not the same old.
depends on what you want to do with it. simple listening, likely ok. Hard driving... not as much IMO. When you start seeing that series need a fan to keep it cool, then you are now into a new world of potential hot death by high driving use. The old Nikko used heat sinks as passive heat dissipation, more sturdy. Some users add an external fan to older Nikko just to extend the heat dissipation.
but fans add dirt, dirt causes problems...
YMMV.
 
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