Is Toslink a standard? [incompatible optical output on bluetooth receiver]

[djproben]

Sorry if this is the wrong forum for this question but I have no idea where to ask and I've googled myself blue in the face looking for info on this. The short version: Shouldn't the digital (toslink) output on any device send a compatible signal to any device with a toslink input? If a device sends valid info to my computer's toslink input, for example, why would that info be unreadable by a different audio interface?

The back story: I purchased a Bose bluetooth audio receiver so that when I have infidels over and they want to stream a song from their phone to my system, they can easily connect without fiddling with wires and such. The Bose works great for the bluetooth part; easiest connection I've seen on such a device. But the DAC is awful so I wanted to use the device's digital output, which is toslink, to send the signal to my sound card (Apogee Ensemble), which then sends the signal to my receiver. I've done this fine with another bluetooth receiver, but that device was crappy at maintaining a bluetooth connection, so that is why I bought the Bose.

Here's the rub. The Bose analog output works fine. The Digital output works fine too if I connect it directly to my Mac. But if I connect it to my Apogee, there is nothing. I've triple-checked all the settings and the Apogee is not getting a signal at all. The problem is clearly the Bose as everything else has been checked with the other device. I sent the first one back to Bose and got a replacement and have the same problem. I spent a couple hours on the phone with tech support at Bose and first they tried to tell me that the device only works with Bose systems (which is clearly not true as it works directly into my Mac), and then that the problem must be my Apogee (also untrue as the Apogee works great with anything else I throw at it, including through the toslink input). Then they said that the Apogee must be incompatible with the Bose.

I've got a workaround - I'm just sending the signal to my Mac and running an app that sends it to the Apogee - but I shouldn't need one, should I? I always assumed optical audio was standardized; is that not the case? And if not, how can a consumer know when different standards are used by a particular device? Is it possible there is something else completely that I am missing here?

Thanks so much for any help!

 

[xero-D-hero]

Toslink is a standard more-or-less (Toslink is the shortened form for Toshiba link who trademarked that).
The hardware for Toslink is largley the standardized side of this,the format side (software/signal) is not exclusive between devices.
So yeah the signals (data) sent over that standarized path (Toslink) are'nt always compatible between given devices due to differing formats.

Toslink generally uses SPDIF (Sony Philips Digital Interconnect Format) for the software side of that deal.

But even within that SPDIF standard there are more than one type of signal that can be used.

Example: One must keep in mind that some devices can only decode a stereo PCM signal,as such they're not able to decode Dolby/DTS multi-channel audio.

Typically stereo PCM signals are uncompressed lossless signals.
Dolby/DTS are compressed signals as such they need additional dedicated decoders that not all PCM based devices have.

Also there is ADAT optical which uses the same basic connectors and cables as Toslink,but again that data format is incompatible with SPDIF based Toslink devices.

So yeah there are a few random things that can cause compatibility issues within the Toslink standard.

HTH

Bret P.

 

[Lesterbest]

Monoprice toslink is good & economical. I run either a 25' or 30' cable from my Onkyo 6 disc changer to my DAC.

 

[djproben]

Thanks! Is there any way to test what kind of signal is being sent? What is strange to me is that the signal is understood by the Mac just fine, and passed just fine to the audio interface. I doubt the Mac is translating ADAT to SPDIF for example. Is it possible that the Bose device is set to send DTS by default even if it's getting a stereo signal? And that my Mac is capable of taking the stereo signal out of the DTS but my audio interface isn't?

It would be great if the Bose tech support people could have answered these questions but all they could really do is offer to replace the device :-/

 

[drew_t]

Bose is clearly uninterested in this product being used with non-Bose products. Why not just return it and buy a Google Chromecast Audio or Apple Airport Express, either of which will work better for the stated purpose than any Bluetooth thing?

 

[Rockyhill]

Bose is clearly uninterested in this product being used with non-Bose products. Why not just return it and buy a Google Chromecast Audio or Apple Airport Express, either of which will work better for the stated purpose than any Bluetooth thing?

+1 to the AirportExpress.

 

[whoaru99]

Bose is clearly uninterested in this product being used with non-Bose products. Why not just return it and buy a Google Chromecast Audio or Apple Airport Express, either of which will work better for the stated purpose than any Bluetooth thing?

I don't think that's clear at all. You don't really expect they're going to guarantee compatibility with any/all other devices, do you?

What's been done so far doesn't really pin the problem to either the Bose unit or the Apogee.

 

[whoaru99]

Thanks! Is there any way to test what kind of signal is being sent? What is strange to me is that the signal is understood by the Mac just fine, and passed just fine to the audio interface. I doubt the Mac is translating ADAT to SPDIF for example. Is it possible that the Bose device is set to send DTS by default even if it's getting a stereo signal? And that my Mac is capable of taking the stereo signal out of the DTS but my audio interface isn't?

It would be great if the Bose tech support people could have answered these questions but all they could really do is offer to replace the device :-/

I think it's pretty unlikely the Bose is sending anything other than PCM.

You could call back and ask to speak to Level 2 support (or whatever is their next step up) or an Engineer. Worst they can do is say "no". But, I suspect they will try to help more than what they have done.

 

[drew_t]

I don't think that's clear at all. You don't really expect they're going to guarantee compatibility with any/all other devices, do you?

I would expect that if they were interested in the product being used with non-Bose products, their specifications for the unit would say more than just "works with a wide range of Bose products," and the first thing that their tech support people would say to callers indicating they were trying to use the unit with non-Bose products wouldn't be "these only work with Bose systems."

 

[whoaru99]

I would expect that if they were interested in the product being used with non-Bose products, their specifications for the unit would say more than just "works with a wide range of Bose products," and the first thing that their tech support people would say to callers indicating they were trying to use the unit with non-Bose products wouldn't be "these only work with Bose systems."

Of course they want to sell you more Bose, that's just business. All companies want you to buy/want to sell you more of their stuff.

I've looked through the product manual. Nowhere does it say compatible only with Bose products.